Left Side %

[rubbinsracin]

will to much left side % keep the car from getting up on the bars?

[joedoozer]

Yes......but

If the weight was mounted high in the chassis it would still help the car "tip" over, instead of the weight being below the axle for example.

[rubbinsracin]

ic. well im pretty big guy. about 285lbs. the guy who had the car before us was about 175 lbs and he said the car worked best for him at about 54% Left % and with me in the car that gets up closer to 58%. should we be down closer to the to 53-54% with me in the car?

also, we have only one piece of lead on the back side of the car that is right behind the LR tire on the frame rail. we are thinking about taking that off and see what that does to the car. other lead is mounted high over the drive shaft.

[dualdj1]

always do your scaling and adjustment with you in the car. If it needs to be around 54%, move ballast until you get close to that. If you don't have ballast to move, look at things like relocating fuel cell, battery, etc to the right.

[Matt49]

58% is pretty high regardless of the chassis. Unless you are getting a ton of side bite (which is hard to imagine with that much left), you won't be getting up on the bars very easily with that much weight on the left side of the car.
Assuming everything else is right with your setup (springs, shocks, bar angles, j-bar, etc.), the high left is likely your problem.
How does it actually handle?

[hpmaster]

I am almost the same weight as you. Move your battery on the right upper frame rail and also put weight/lead over there too. Us fat guys put too much low left in the cars so I found high right makes it work great. I like 54.3 to 54.8 left side percentage and about the same rear. All cars are different but my experiance is using my numbers will get you (not a nice word)(not a nice word)(not a nice word)(not a nice word) close. Your car might be heavy but it will drive better.

[rubbinsracin]

58% is pretty high regardless of the chassis. Unless you are getting a ton of side bite (which is hard to imagine with that much left), you won't be getting up on the bars very easily with that much weight on the left side of the car.
Assuming everything else is right with your setup (springs, shocks, bar angles, j-bar, etc.), the high left is likely your problem.
How does it actually handle?

we have all the setup stuff exactly as it comes from Shaw. only difference is we are running a straight 3 comp/reb on the 5th coil instead of a 7-3

surprisingly i felt like the car handled pretty good, just didnt get up on the bars at all. im new to a 4 bar car(came from an old bomber class) so i give up some of speed because im still getting used to the way the car feels. i finished just 11th in my first feature. but the difference between the top 6 or 7 cars and the rest of us is they all run the 602 crate and they only have to weigh 2150 and we have to weigh 2475 with our 11-1 GN motor. so unless we really get this car handling, its going to be hard to beat any of them anyways.

[rubbinsracin]

our batter is already mounted to the right side of the car. so we will try moving some lead and the fuel cell to the right and see if that helps the percentages. were going to try and get closer to the 54% with me in the car instead of 58% we are at.

[MasterSbilt_Racer]

Move the engine right as well.

[rubbinsracin]

its as far right as it can be without relocating the fuel pump which we are not allowed to do as it must be in stock location.

[joedoozer]

If you don't run a lot of long races you can get by with a smaller fuel cell as well. Then you can slide it over to the right. I will be doing that in the off season. I have a big tear drop style cell, that I can't move. I don't know how much it holds, I can't afford to fill it. I know its the size of a gas grill under there though haha.

[rubbinsracin]

i have a 22 gal cell that i can slide about 8-10 inches from right to left. but yes we will probably be going to a 12 gal cell next year because the longest feature we run is 40 laps and the end of year special. and as long as we top it off for the beginning of the feature(if we make the feature) we should be fine. we should be able to move a 12 gal cell 18" or so each way if we get the skinny cell.

[4bangerhotrod]

if you cant get the ls weight down to 54% you might want to try to hang what weight you have mounted on the car weight up high on the chassis to help with roll over

[lovinlatemodels]

I would try to get the fuel cell about 2" to the left side of center or even centered that way there is very little effect of fuel burn off. To me never have the cell to the right of center you don't want the car gaining LS% during a race. I am also a 270 lb driver and what i got is my battery mounted high on the right side just behind the tranny. Now i also run 70 lbs over the rear between the shock mounts favoring the right side slightly. I still run 55% but with the weight that high in the car over the center of the rear it alows the car to move around. Also becareful not to get to much over the RR only as this could allow that part of the car get pinned down with to much weight hanging there. JMO

[dualdj1]

X2 on lovinlate's post, those are good points. the fuel cell moving was just brought up in a suspension class i went to. if you don't burn much fuel, then that's an option.

[rubbinsracin]

we burn about 8-10 gal of fuel during an entire night. we run a 8 lap heat and a 25 lap feature on most all nights. maybe 2 times a week will we run a B or have a feature that is 40 laps. seeing as the AV Fuel we use weighs at 6.75lbs/gal we burn off about 60-70lbs off during the average nights racing at the most. so should we move the cell so it is just about centered? or just a hair to the left?

were going to work on the car tonight. gotta pound out some sheet metal and and then we might go ahead and put it on the scales and play with it.

KEEP THE SUGGESTIONS COMING!

[lovinlatemodels]

I would find center of car on scales then move the cell 2" left also if you can keep it mounted high to help the car roll.

[rubbinsracin]

we have it mounted as high as it goes. we are going to run it pretty much centered over the rear to get the fuel burn off to be as equal as possible. we got it down to around 54.6% left side with me in the car. and about 52% rear but we need to add 15 gal of fuel then we might need to add a little bit of lead in the center of the car to make it up to weight. we have to weigh 2475 and have no idea other than added weight right over the drive shaft as high as possible to get into allowed weight. because if i finish the heat and dont make weight we get parked for the night.

[F22 RAPTOR]

So how'd you do with the changes?

[rubbinsracin]

This is what we ended up going with.

Springs
LF 500 RF 375
LR 250 RR 200

Shocks
LF 5c5r RF 4c6r
LR 4c4r RR 4c4r

bars are all in shaw "stock" locations execpt the LR bar is 1 hole up on frame and on the bottom on the birdcage

jbar is just below centerline on pinion and second hole from top on frame. one hole above "stock" location.

all numbers with me in car

52.5 Left %
54.5 Rear %
cross was about 52% (if i remember correctly)
115lbs of LR bite

we are thinking about some different setup options for the LR still.

since i'm still a little inconsistent about being on and off the gas through the corner a guy that is successful that parked down the pit from us said to possibly just mount a gas traction shock in front of the LR. with about 125 psi in it. so when the car get up, it doesn't come crashing down when i get on and off the gas. seems like everyone is running a second shock on the LR but a few of us that are at the back of the pack.

should i just go ahead and mount that ahead of the LR without making any other changes? or should i dial back the wedge so it is where i want it with the gas shock on? i have heard both ways, but if i set my wedge at 115lbs or so and then bolt that shock on i will have way more than 115lbs if i understand correctly. or should i set the wedge with the traction shock on the car?

[hpmaster]

This might sound stupid but for me I make the throttle travel pretty darn long so it is harder to come completely off throttle. Also work on draggin the brake in combination with the throttle before going for other changes. JMHO

[gadirtracer]

Scale the car with the traction shock on, set the bite(115#) or to what ever you want to start with. As it will add a lot of LR weight. Then take the shock loose from the bird cage and let it hang. After taking it loose, these are the numbers I write in my scale book. May be as low as 40# LR. This is the most consistent way I have found. With the LR front shock, nitrogen pressure, and how you settle the car will change the bite every time. Easier to just unhook it.