Ticket Sales Slow at Knoxville !

[TUTY]

I don't get it, I love Late Model racing, no imca a-mods as a support class ! The a-mods put 2000 to 3000 of those fans in the stands at $85 a ticket. BIG,BIG,BIG, mistake ! Sales are absolutly horable as of today, just 1 week away. You can sit anywhere you want, any section, not good. Just a wild guess I don't think they have sold 2000 tickets yet. I was coming Sat. (6 hours) not for 3 maybe 4 races. This race smells alot like Wheatland Show Me 100, and smells pretty bad !

[vande07]

I don't get it, I love Late Model racing, no imca a-mods as a support class ! The a-mods put 2000 to 3000 of those fans in the stands at $85 a ticket. BIG,BIG,BIG, mistake ! Sales are absolutly horable as of today, just 1 week away. You can sit anywhere you want, any section, not good. Just a wild guess I don't think they have sold 2000 tickets yet. I was coming Sat. (6 hours) not for 3 maybe 4 races. This race smells alot like Wheatland Show Me 100, and smells pretty bad !

Not everyone is going to buy reserved tickets (which are only in sections C, D, E, F and G rows 20-40) and ticketforce doesn't show us (Fans) the # of general admission tickets that have been sold.

Sections AA, BB, H, I, J, L, L, M, N and rows 1-20 in C, D, E, F and G are all GENERAL Admission.

having just features on Saturday is fine by me (a C main, B-main and the 100 lapper). The mods are fun to watch, but no big race should require a support class IMO.

[TUTY]

When you are there on Thursday and Friday and there's 5000 fans (that's normal) and 5000 more fans come on Saturday it will matter ! Some will stay home if driving 5 to 10 hours for 1 day, I am,
my car was 4 or 5 people. Lucas Oil has to have something to do with this, just like Wheatland, better get ready to count lug nuts on push trucks. I bet that track gets over watered and the races start late on Saturday Night !

[vande07]

When you are there on Thursday and Friday and there's 5000 fans (that's normal) and 5000 more fans come on Saturday it will matter ! Some will stay home if driving 5 to 10 hours for 1 day, I am,
my car was 4 or 5 people. Lucas Oil has to have something to do with this, just like Wheatland, better get ready to count lug nuts on push trucks. I bet that track gets over watered and the races start late on Saturday Night !

When they decided to lift the car count cap of 66, the RACEWAY made the decision to drop the support class. The infield pit area can only park so many rigs and allow the FANS (paying customers) to SEE the races that they paid to watch.

There is NO RIGHT ANSWER when it comes to support classes. Knoxville is doing what they feel is what THEIR paying customers want.

[TUTY]

I'm going to tell you that the 2000 to 3000 mod fans that won't be there is the gravy, better known as profit, 2000 fans @ $85 = $170,000 ! Having mods keep no one away and adds to the ticket sales. Not having mods, well refer to above. There's no argument it's a fact, it's stupid !

[tracksmack]

If you want a mod show, then go to a mod show! Mods = YELLOWS and a MUCH longer night. 2000 mod fans is a stretch dont ya think!

[vande07]

If you want a mod show, then go to a mod show! Mods = YELLOWS and a MUCH longer night. 2000 mod fans is a stretch dont ya think!

I KNOW it's a stretch. They barely get 2000 fans for the Harris Clash with better weather and WAYYYY more mods (usually over 100).

And mods were a Saturday only event the last few years anyway (no support classes on Thursday or Friday), so that $85 goes down to $35 pretty quick....

First time I've ever heard a "fan" bit#h about the lack of a support class and the track making less $$$..... 99.9999% of the time it's the exact opposite.

[vande07]

When you are there on Thursday and Friday and there's 5000 fans (that's normal) and 5000 more fans come on Saturday it will matter ! Some will stay home if driving 5 to 10 hours for 1 day, I am,
my car was 4 or 5 people. Lucas Oil has to have something to do with this, just like Wheatland, better get ready to count lug nuts on push trucks. I bet that track gets over watered and the races start late on Saturday Night !

Funny, I thought Lucas races were all 1 lane train races according to everyone on this message board...

[TUTY]

Are you there all 3 days, I'm just a dirt track race fan and been to knoxville 50 times.

[vande07]

Are you there all 3 days, I'm just a dirt track race fan and been to knoxville 50 times.

I've gone to Knoxville for 30+ years to every event they have (Sprints, Late Models, Mod's, AMA motorcycles, Enduro's, etc.).

The mod's DO NOT add to the fan count during the Late Model Nationals, just as the 305 Sprint cars did not when they were the support class. The fans have complained since a support class was added (during the 4th or 5th year I believe it was), that this race did not need a support class.

Crowds for the big races @ Knoxville this year (Knoxville Nationals, 360 Nationals, AMA Flat Track motorcycles, World of Outlaw Shows) have been up over the previous 4 or 5 years and I don't expect the Late Model Nationals to be any different.

[TUTY]

We will see with the 5000 fans that come in just for Saturday. I bet the croud is down this year and if not next year it will be because people just expect a support class. Making a long haul for Saturday to see 3 maybe 4 races not cool to me. I just like racing and the a-mods have done a good job, I will just go to DEER CREEK tonight and see 115 of the best A-MOD drivers in the country and 50 USRA B-mods. This is a really good show, if everyone limits themselves to late models maybe we will get Virgina Speedway like last week $20,000 to win, 25 cars "ouch".

[vande07]

We will see with the 5000 fans that come in just for Saturday. I bet the croud is down this year and if not next year it will be because people just expect a support class. Making a long haul for Saturday to see 3 maybe 4 races not cool to me. I just like racing and the a-mods have done a good job, I will just go to DEER CREEK tonight and see 115 of the best A-MOD drivers in the country and 50 USRA B-mods. This is a really good show, if everyone limits themselves to late models maybe we will get Virgina Speedway like last week $20,000 to win, 25 cars "ouch".

I don't think it will affect the crowd at all. A MAJORITY of the big races in Late Models have better crowds on day #2 of a 2 day show and all qualifying and heats are run on day #1. What's that leave for day #2? Just the feature and semi's (some of those events have support classes, but most do not).

Knoxville is doing what the fans have been asking for for the last 5 years (to not have a support class). Will it help or hurt the crowd? Who knows 100% for sure.

Like I stated before, there is no right answer on this. They have fans that say they would come, but won't because there is a support class and others that like the fact that there is a support class and they get more bang for their buck. The question is, which one is the larger group??

I do know this for certain. (2) of the (8) Late Model Nationals have had the 100 lap feature take in excess of 2 hours to complete due to yellow flags created by the competitors for no reason other than they "wanted" to change tires (not flats or blown tires) or they totally missed the set-up so they stopped to bring out a caution. (one of those events the actual temperature was 28 degrees outside). If those un-necessarry cautions went away and the 100 lap feature could be completed EVERY time in 35-55 minutes (34 minutes would be 20 second lap times if race went non-stop), I have NO DOUBT that a support class would be on tap.

Unfortunately the trend is for the 100 lappers to take MUCH, MUCH longer than that amount of time.

[vande07]

Have fun @ Deer Creek, nice little track that puts on a great show.

I hope you re-consider coming to Knoxville, but I can understand where you are coming from. I have the same issues when I think about traveling to other venues.

5 hours for me to go from Knoxville to Sioux Falls for a Sunday Night show. Car counts are pathetic in every class and the program still takes as long or longer than one with twice as many cars does in Knoxville. Hard for me to justify it.

9-1/2 hours to Eldora for the Kings Royal, Dream or World 100. I don't really care if there is a Support Class, it isn't what I traveled to go watch. (this is a majority of the fans coming to Knoxville's mindset).

[slick01]

We drive over 1100 miles for the Nationals and would be furious if it included support classes. We don't like it the nights the legends run, though they don't take near the time that a bunch of dadblamed mods would.

[vande07]

We drive over 1100 miles for the Nationals and would be furious if it included support classes. We don't like it the nights the legends run, though they don't take near the time that a bunch of dadblamed mods would.

I'm not a huge fan of the Legends either, but I like the "REASON" they have them "to support the families of fallen officers across the US" so it makes it OK in my book (plus they just fill in the dead time, I can still go to the concession stand, restroom, etc., and not miss anything I paid to see.

[huskerdirt]

Just my 2 cents on a couple of things.

1. Ticket sales-- to me looking at the website, pre sales seem to up over previous years on number of reserved seats sold. The crowd is at least double on Saturday night. During the day there seems to be people everywhere and you can definitely feel the buzz.

2. Support class-- most of the time I don't care about the support class when traveling to big shows. To me its stupid to limit the entries on the premier class, but yet bring 30-40 mods in for the support class. I understand why the track did it. More back gate money. More fans???? Doubt it. You wanna see mods.... Go to Boone.

3. 100 lap feature-- I love it, its a chess match among competitors. Brady Smith dicing through the field last year was cool to watch. Also, watching Tyler Redd!ck come to life in last 20 laps was special. I do agree that it takes to long to run. And to guys that bring cautions to change tires or tinker with the set up...... That's Bush league.

[fryefan]

I don't get it, I love Late Model racing, no imca a-mods as a support class ! The a-mods put 2000 to 3000 of those fans in the stands at $85 a ticket. BIG,BIG,BIG, mistake ! Sales are absolutly horable as of today, just 1 week away. You can sit anywhere you want, any section, not good. Just a wild guess I don't think they have sold 2000 tickets yet. I was coming Sat. (6 hours) not for 3 maybe 4 races. This race smells alot like Wheatland Show Me 100, and smells pretty bad !

1. Most fans buy their tickets when they get there.
2. Having the modifieds would not pull in anywhere near to 2000 extra fans.

[fryefan]

When you are there on Thursday and Friday and there's 5000 fans (that's normal) and 5000 more fans come on Saturday it will matter ! Some will stay home if driving 5 to 10 hours for 1 day, I am,
my car was 4 or 5 people. Lucas Oil has to have something to do with this, just like Wheatland, better get ready to count lug nuts on push trucks. I bet that track gets over watered and the races start late on Saturday Night !

Just stop with your jealousy of Lucas Oil and Forrest Lucas.

[fryefan]

I'm going to tell you that the 2000 to 3000 mod fans that won't be there is the gravy, better known as profit, 2000 fans @ $85 = $170,000 ! Having mods keep no one away and adds to the ticket sales. Not having mods, well refer to above. There's no argument it's a fact, it's stupid !

Stay home. Nobody is going to miss your whining, crybaby attitude.

[TUTY]

Deer Creek was really good ! Have to agree didn't need a support class there. 116 a-mods and 56 b-mods and 350 laps of racing. When you get 116 cars in your premier class you don't need a support class. 8 heats of 15 cars (10 laps), 5 b-mains of 20 cars (20 laps), 1 40 lap a-main ! Your not getting anywhere near 116 cars at Knoxville, maybe 75 to 80 and I doubt that. Every year there's 72 cars entered and 60 show up and by Saturday there's 55 cars left !

[vande07]

Deer Creek was really good ! Have to agree didn't need a support class there. 116 a-mods and 56 b-mods and 350 laps of racing. When you get 116 cars in your premier class you don't need a support class. 8 heats of 15 cars (10 laps), 5 b-mains of 20 cars (20 laps), 1 40 lap a-main ! Your not getting anywhere near 116 cars at Knoxville, maybe 75 to 80 and I doubt that. Every year there's 72 cars entered and 60 show up and by Saturday there's 55 cars left !

But those Mod's don't qualify, they just race...

And if I remember correctly, Deer Creek pits OUTSIDE of the racetrack, so you could have 600 cars and you don't inconvenience any FANS by hindering the sightlines.

Face it, each track is different and Knoxville is trying to balance the needs/wants of the PAYING FANS as well as the racers (they don't want a worn out racetrack, and if they get hot at this point in the season there are guys that now want to come (if the car cap was still there they'd get told no)).

Maybe YOU are interested in being at the track until 2:00 AM every night if they had 80 lates and 40 mods, but I can tell you that I am not (as I will have my 9 year old son with me, races getting over at a decent hour every night means that the Raceway earns ADDITIONAL ticket $$ and concession $$ from people like me (if they had a support class I wouldn't bring him with, so that's $42.50 in ticket Revenue and $20 per night ($60) at the concession stand for just him). That's over $100 in revenue that walks out the door if a support class is on tap (and potentially me too, as it's hard to tell your kids they can't go and then walk out the door and head to the track, so a support class would cost the track at least $200 in Revenue next weekend from just 1 customer).

I've said it before and I'll say it again. There is NO RIGHT ANSWER when it comes to having a Support Class for big events. Having one will drive some fans away and not having one will drive a different group of fans away.

[TUTY]

That's cool, hey come to Cedar Lake next and see there USA NATIONALS. 100 Late Models between nascar and open cars and much closer racing (3/8 mile track) and done between 10 and 11.

[vande07]

That's cool, hey come to Cedar Lake next and see there USA NATIONALS. 100 Late Models between nascar and open cars and much closer racing (3/8 mile track) and done between 10 and 11.

I've seen TONS of close racing on 1/2 miles too... and 1/4, and 1/3 and 3/8. It's just different type of racing. I enjoy them all.

I haven't made it to Cedar Lake (yet), but I will at some time in the future (right now I barely make it Knoxville with kids activities going on and I live 10 minutes from the track).

My son (age 9) has a bucket list of races he wants to attend, so hopefully we can start hitting one or two of those a year here in the near future (World 100, King's Royal, Daytona 500, Indy 500, Williams Grove National Open, and USA Nationals @ Cedar Lake are just some of them on his list a(he also LOVES Supercross and Motocross, so those are ALWAYS on my list (we do hit St. Louis Supercross every year)..

[BSDirtlm7]

I have not been to Knoxville since 2008 and am going this year and am overjoyed that there is no support class. I can watch mods beat eachother up any night at any track. The reason I travel 6 hours is to watch the best Late Models in the country race. Last week I wnet to Kankakee for the frist time ever when I was in Chicago for the Cup weekend and saw an event where there were WAY TO Many classes. I left at 11:45 and the UMP Late Model feature wasn't even completed yet. More cars does not = a better program. Quality, not quanity in my opnion.

[TUTY]

Sorry I barked up the wrong tree ! I guess I'm a all around race fan and love Late Models and Modifieds and IMCA or USRA Stockcars. Adding one of these would just add to my fun and seem more wirth the drive. You guy's have a great time !

[ftfiowa]

1.i have never met a fan at the LM Nats that said anything negative about the IMCA type mods running as a support class on all 3 or 1 night so all of the people saying how they "hate" the mods is new to me!
2.the mods that ran were invited to run and it was an invite only race which featured the best of the best running.bob harris did the invites and made sure that it was a solid field of cars.there were no junkers/clunkers running which can't be said for some of the lm's that show up.i suspect most of the mod "haters" are out of staters who dont care for mods in general and have no connection to the mods that run during the show.but yes this year there will be lots of dead time so everyone be ready for it.the show will not get over quicker without the mods running.
3.i know of quite a few fans who only come to the knoxville lm nats to see the mods run and otherwise arent gonna pay the $35 to see a race.you can call them names or belittle these fans but they do exist and i bet they number around 1500+.there are sprint car only fans,lm only fans,mod only fans,and then there are race fans imo.most are "real" and some are like me.i will miss the mods running as they always put on a good show and didnt cause needless yellows like some the the Lucas guys do.i prefer the WoO series myself but im glad that Lucas does what they do too.
4.i dont get the folks who only come saturday as often the 1st 2 nites are much better shows than the saturday show(especially thursday which is my favorite nite).

anyways we will see how many cars show up and if there would have been room in the pits for a support class or not.

[TUTY]

Thank you : I would run mods only Saturday because of there only being 3 or 4 races that night. Slice it how ever you want if 1000 fans don't come Saturday night thats $35,000 lost in ticket sales and maybe $12,000 paid in purse. I'll take that $23,000 any day, and you can't tell me that lm only fans don't come because of the mods. If that were the case they have never been there, always has been a support class. When Saturday comes and there's only 60 cars there and the c-main isn't even full, then that would suck ! I totally agree also from what i have seen the last 2 or 3 years i will take WOO before BIG BUCKS !