scaling discussion....

[Duckhnter83]

OK I am going to start a discussion about scaling because there are so many different ways I have read to do it. So that has me wondering why do some people scale with a racer in the seat some scale without. Some scale with weight in the seat if the driver weighs more than 200 lbs and so on. I've also seen ride heights measured with or without.My question is why is one way better than the other. I would think you would want to scale with the driver because that is exactly how the car would roll out onto the track to race. But that's my only logic behind that. So why do it one way as opposed to the other? Please explain your logic behind the way you do it. Also what way do you do your ride heights?

[MM90]

I think the whole "scale without the driver" started with people complaining that they were the only ones that work on the car and nobody can help them scale so they needed some numbers to use without a driver in the seat. My chassis people say all the ride heights and measurements are without the driver. I started out in go-karts and you can't scale them without a driver so I do it both. I scale without me in the car for the most part. I'm in the seat for measurements like birdcage indexing and then climb out and see where they are so I don't have to be in the car the next time. There are plenty of ways to do it with only a few ways you should do it.

[MasterSbilt_Racer]

OK I am going to start a discussion about scaling because there are so many different ways I have read to do it. So that has me wondering why do some people scale with a racer in the seat some scale without. Some scale with weight in the seat if the driver weighs more than 200 lbs and so on. I've also seen ride heights measured with or without.My question is why is one way better than the other. I would think you would want to scale with the driver because that is exactly how the car would roll out onto the track to race. But that's my only logic behind that. So why do it one way as opposed to the other? Please explain your logic behind the way you do it. Also what way do you do your ride heights?

Your car needs to be at the designed ride heights when you drive it to the grid to race. So initially, at least, you must scale it with you in the car. Once that has been done, you can remeasure all the data points without you in the car and use those from that point forward.

[7uptruckracer]

Most chassis books have you reset them after you add the weight though too it's just to rough them in. Without the driver is great for roughing it in, but I set everything with drivers weight if the driver isn't in it I put 9/10 of the weight in the seat and a little in the floor. Pull my axles and whatever else can hold weight on the scales. I personally like grain scales or dual cell pads throw your single cells off a cliff. Just remember digital scales have an error factor that can make you show light or heavy a bit and your bite can be errored as well. Watch out for bind in the front with digitals unless your on a level floor with the scales on roller pads you can't beat good grain scales most the manfacturers still use them over digital for dirt I know Rocket And Team Zero do

[Duckhnter83]

I think a person could get more accurate and repeatable results from scaling with the driver in the seat. I'm not as lucky as some teams I only have me and one other guy to help work on my car so with that said I would always be there to sit in the seat to scale my car. That and i think I'm to ocd to let someone do it while I wasn't there. I could see though some teams needing to do the scaling without a driver for the reason of there driver not being there.

[mod88s]

Different strokes for different folks. Go by what your chassis manufacturer tells you to do. Remember, scaling a car is basically for a reference point. Its important to get a good baseline setup then adjust from there to fit your track/driving style. The baseline set up is so you can go back to it after you try some adjustments that don't work out so well. Or, if you ever get in a wreck, you can always check it on the scales to see if something is off. It really doesn't matter which way you choose to scale your car, driver in/out, right axle out, left axle out,, non of that matters as long as you do it the same way every time.

[Duckhnter83]

I guess the other side I see to scaling with the driver is some drivers are 250 plus and some are 130lbs. Now if you set it up without driver the 250 plus guy is going to make big changes to ride heights and weights when he climbs in where as the 130 guy will make less of a change.

[dirtplay18]

You sit in the seat when you race the car, scaling/ride heights should be done with you or your weight in the seat. I've never done my own any other way. One piece of advise, build yourself a set of roll-offs for your scales, helps a ton.

[DaveBauerSS6]

Scale the car without the driver. Scaling is for reference only. The only time I would put a driver in the seat is if its a brand new car and never driven before. Then Document the numbers with the driver out. After that point you tune the car with reference to the scale numbers. I prefer the driver out of the car helping on the setup.

[Duckhnter83]

So your saying the first time you would put the driver in set up the scale numbers and ride heights your looking for then remove the driver then write down the numbers? Then you could.always go back to the nbers without the driver?

[cheaterleaddog]

I think they recommend to scale without driver so that when people call in for help the car builder does not have to take into effect the weight of driver, I think should scale with driver in car. I don't use scales to set up car I use scales to keep car set up. If car gets bent can ensure will get back to where it was before a crash. Or if new setup doesn't work can put it back to where it was.

[DaveBauerSS6]

So your saying the first time you would put the driver in set up the scale numbers and ride heights your looking for then remove the driver then write down the numbers? Then you could.always go back to the nbers without the driver?

Yes.

I scale my cars after the race just to see if anything has moved.