604 Oil leak.

[A ron]

Bought a grt with 604 a month or so ago supposedly only 7 races on engine. Good oil pressure, no visable leaks when I bought it. Cranked it the first time this weekend (been trying to get tools, safety gear together), and now I have an oil leak behind the harmonic balancer. What are my options? If I pull the engine and take it to a certified engine builder will they fix leak or only do a full a rebuild? These are questions I should've asked before buying but was so anxious to get going . Also, the oil inspection bolt is on the drivers side in front of the oil line on the flat top of the oil pan correct? And it has to be checked with the engine running? Any tips for doing this without burning my arm off on the headers?

[brad hibbard]

chances are your oil leak is in one of the lower corners of the the timing cover----where the timing cover, oil pan and block all come together
clean it off real good with brake clean and then hot soapy water----once it is completely dry pack a quality brand silicone sealer into the area ---try to actually push it into the intersection ----let it dry 24 hours and it should be fine

as for checking oil level----loosen the level inspection plug before starting the engine so that it is easy to remove when the headers are hot

Note:
if your oil level is too high it will lessen your chance for a successful leak repair---not to mention rob power and overheat the oil-----too high is just as bad as too low

Brad
www.race-1.com

[Krooser]

Why does the engine need to be running to check the oil level? Just wondering...

[A ron]

Thanks Brad. I sure hope that works. I am looking at the correct bolt aren't i? Also I another stupid question: I'm guessing that would be the where to put oil in the engine? Are there any technical books or other sources out there on these crate engines? I've found tons on chassis adjustments but Other than this site, I have not found a lot of info as far as engine service and maintenance. Thanks again for your quick response. I'd probably be putting a big for sale sign on the car if it wasn't for you guys on here

[Matt49]

We put the oil in through the front breather on the valve cover. With the breather removed obviously.

[powerslide]

Brad i am going to kind of highjack this thread... I am installing an oil cooler on a USMTS type motor with a sandwich adapter(will use CV to keep bill happy RIP buddy). I read your webstite and it states anytime using a cooler you should check it running. My question is how do i check the oil running, i dont have a plug in the side like these crates do. I just changed the oil every two weeks and pulled the plug on the right kickout to make sure it was close to the top.

[brad hibbard]

powerslide-----CV does not make a sandwich adapter (that i know of) and i know exactly what you mean about Bill's diligence on this subject-----when using a Canton sandwich adapter we do some port work on it as an upgrade

the plug you are refering to "should" be a oil level inspection plug and that is where you will check the level with it running

Krooser
then engine has to be running in order to completely pressurize the lines and cooler-----without it running the level will show over full but by how much --no one can know

A ron
for more information you can check our website www.race-1.com under the "Race-1 Answers you questions"---its a tab just below the champions cup on the left hand side
also check out www.crateinsider.com

Brad

[powerslide]

Thanks Brad, Yeah when i counted the oil and put them in it was usually right at the top of that plug. I will go with that running then. I was having a hard time finding a CV version but i think i found CV780 in a catalog that "looks" like a sandwich deal. If not i will get the canton one.

Thanks

[brad hibbard]

CV780 is just a block adapter and then you have to use a remote filter

if you use Canton the # is 22-541 oil goes to filter and then to cooler---this is the recommended oil flow by GM and others

#22-540 goes to cooler and then the filter (not recommended)

Brad

[ncracer1st]

why is the 22-540 not recommended?

[powerslide]

why is the 22-540 not recommended?

ruins the cooler if the motor blows?

[brad hibbard]

wrong answer powerslide (but i do see you ended in a question mark)

it has been found that there can be a pressure drop if the oil map is cooler>>filter>>engine
and that best oil flow is achieved filter>>cooler>>engine

as for powerslides reasoning----I totally disagree with that thought
ANYTIME there is an engine failure REPLACE the cooler and dillegently clean and inspect the lines

coolers are $250 how much is an engine?
in many cases its recommended to replace the lines as well-----debris becomes in-bedded in lines and coolers and then releases when it feels like it

YOU CANNOT WASH AN OIL COOLER ----PERIOD...

Brad

[powerslide]

Thanks for sharing Brad. I didnt think that was the only reason but took a wild guess.

What brand cooler are you suggesting?

Most stuff i read suggest setrab. I emailed them and they suggested two different ones $454 and $383. I found the exact same part# new on ebay for almost $100 less.

[brad hibbard]

we have been using a deck mount cooler marketed by Allstar performance (not sure who makes it)

it has 2 built in -12 fittings and a 1/2 pipe bung for temperature----its a quality piece at an affordable price

we searched for this type of combination to ease the pain of cooler replacement----it retails at $250 part #30145

we are always open for suggestions from the racing population for more options

[Krooser]

One bit of advice… don't use any 90 degree fittings on that oil cooler plumbing… way too restrictive to flow.

[brad hibbard]

great advice Krooser but not practical-----that is why we use all -12 full flow ends, fittings and hose

it would be near impossible to plumb most modern day race cars with all straight or 45 degree fittings

-10 is an adequate size if everything is ABSOLUTELY perfect and that would be without any angle over 45 degree and ALL fittings were of a high flow design but to be more practical its easiest to jump up to -12 and be sure that oil flow is sufficient in all situations

this advice came to us primarily from Peterson Fluid systems but has been confirmed by other respected sources and our own expierience

Brad

[Krooser]

When running 100 lbs of oil pressure on our 351C engines (the hot set-up to keep 'em alive in the 80's) we blew the threads out of four block adaptors… two cheapys and two high quality ones (one from Jack Roush the other from Bud Moore). It took a neighbor who designed hydraulic systems to find the problem in 30 seconds… four 90 degree forged Russell fittings in our -12 lines.

We switched to a radius'd tube fitting and had zero problems in two years racing two nights per week.

[brad hibbard]

agreed ----that is actually what I am referring to when I say "high" or "full" flow

great point---thanks for posting

[CrateInsider]

Thanks for referring A Ron to the site, Brad!

[A ron]

Yeah I need all the help I can get haha

[Krooser]

Don't we all….

[A ron]

Think I found the leak. My timing cover seems to be loose and the bolt heads are about stripped. The cover is sticking out on the bottom to where part of it has been grinded off by the harmonic balancer. If I push in on the cover it actually moves in and out I'd say about 1/16 of an inch. I can't see a crack in the cover just from looking at it, but the way it moves it almost has to be. Guess I'm going to start pulling everything this afternoon. I have another dumb question. I see a way to loose the tension on the power steering but how do I loosen the tension on the 2 belt? Please forgive my ignorance.

[A ron]

Here's a photo of the bottom of the cover. I'll upload a video if how much it moves when I get to the office.

[A ron]

nevermind the site doesn't support video.