Wehrs Lift Bar

[Matt49]

This one:
http://www.wehrsmachine.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=4&products_id=486

Looking for any opinions on durability...looking at putting one on a crate car.

[grt74]

would save the money and spend it elsewhere,the weight is in the center of the car but if thats what you want get it,ppm makes a nice one also,both should hold up,i like steel and i make my own

[Matt49]

Yeah...I'm looking to save on unsprung weight more than anything. This one says it is 12 pounds shipping weight which I assume means including the brackets and hardware that come with it. But I'm worried about strength. Don't want to compromise too much especially at that price.

[Kwoods25]

I haven't seen anyone running them in my parts, everybody I know runs standard rocket lift bars. That' 325 price tag is a little high

[MBR Performance]

I have a crate guy running the out - pace version. Really nice piece.

[setup479point2]

We tried an aluminum lift arm on our crate this year( not a Wehrs ) , only thing we changed chassis wise . Car lost forward drive , fought it all season . Finally got it working better , but we're going back to a Rocket arm this year . Don't know if that was our problem , can't really think it would be , but we didn't change anything else.

[Rayburnt1]

i know of a handful of guys running that lift bar with open engines. i don't think strength would be an issue at all. if an aluminum pinion mount doesn't snap on some of the rough tracks we've been on....

[hucktyson]

Whers makes really nice stuff. I haven't used their liftbar but I use the outpace with the aluminum top and I've used the birky style with the aluminum top without issue. I'm 99% sure feger runs the lift bar your talking about and if he doesn't break it I
Doubt anyone will

[Canadian]

Chads stuff is A1 in our books, we run a lot of his stuff just so we don't have to worry about normal steel lift bar braking, yes its more money but it lasts for ever so if you want you take it from car to car.

[Matt49]

Thanks for all the replies...
I think MBRacer was referring to some stuff a while back about stresses on aluminum versus steel but now I can't find the thread. When I research and go through reading on fatigue limit it actually seems that steel would be more reliable but obviously the structure of the piece comes into play I would think.
Seems like if we can get away with aluminum j-bars then an aluminum lift bar should last too.
I bet we'd all be surprised to see how much load in on a j-bar through corners on a fast track.

[PushinTheLimit]

What does a typical lift bar weigh vs. one of these aluminum pieces? Have you thought about going to a light weight battery Matt? That's something I would like to try (especially the new lithium battery since it's about 7lbs) but it's $$$$.

[Matt49]

What does a typical lift bar weigh vs. one of these aluminum pieces? Have you thought about going to a light weight battery Matt? That's something I would like to try (especially the new lithium battery since it's about 7lbs) but it's $$$$.

Good question. I'm going to weigh our MB steel lift bar to see what that weighs.
I'm focusing mostly on rotating and un-sprung weight this off-season. Battery being sprung weight hasn't crossed my mind...yet. That being said, battery is high and left in our car which should be helping with weight transfer back to LR on corner exit. That's my thought process right now anyway...that could change. 7 pounds is a pretty light batter. We run Optima's and they aren't any lighter than a standard car battery.

[MasterSbilt_Racer]

Thanks for all the replies...
I think MBRacer was referring to some stuff a while back about stresses on aluminum versus steel but now I can't find the thread. When I research and go through reading on fatigue limit it actually seems that steel would be more reliable but obviously the structure of the piece comes into play I would think.
Seems like if we can get away with aluminum j-bars then an aluminum lift bar should last too.
I bet we'd all be surprised to see how much load in on a j-bar through corners on a fast track.
Steels have an S N curve where a low enough stress yields an infinite fatigue life. Aluminum does not exhibit the same behavior. It will eventually fail at any stress.

[grt74]

Steels have an S N curve where a low enough stress yields an infinite fatigue life. Aluminum does not exhibit the same behavior. It will eventually fail at any stress.

this is the reason we stayed with steal,there is a ton of load there,and it takes a ton of abuse,ive seen well built torque arms out of .120 wall fail after a while(years of abuse)its just not worth the chance for me,ive seen some bad things happen when a torque arm breaks,but i would hope they have done there research and if they did it should be fine

[MasterSbilt_Racer]

this is the reason we stayed with steal,there is a ton of load there,and it takes a ton of abuse,ive seen well built torque arms out of .120 wall fail after a while(years of abuse)its just not worth the chance for me,ive seen some bad things happen when a torque arm breaks,but i would hope they have done there research and if they did it should be fine

My comment ignores the fact that welds operate as flaws in fatigue. So the steel will eventually fail also.

[Matt49]

My comment ignores the fact that welds operate as flaws in fatigue. So the steel will eventually fail also.

We're going down a wormhole but I started the thread so I guess I'll take it where I want :-)

This is what I kind of had in mind:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fatigue_limit

Pretty interesting...

[grt74]

totally off subject but i have a friend that owns an industrial fab business and he has shown me the properties of different metals and i will have to say it really surprised me,i will leave it at that,hes an engineer and im not,matt i would run it,i did see it at indy and it looked like a good piece but i would make it part of my weekly maintenance program,at least for a while,also i dont think its been out that long (i think its a newer version),so the feed back may not be there yet

[MasterSbilt_Racer]

totally off subject but i have a friend that owns an industrial fab business and he has shown me the properties of different metals and i will have to say it really surprised me,i will leave it at that,hes an engineer and im not,matt i would run it,i did see it at indy and it looked like a good piece but i would make it part of my weekly maintenance program,at least for a while,also i dont think its been out that long (i think its a newer version),so the feed back may not be there yet

People have a lot of misconceptions about what moly does for them and plenty of other things when it comes to chassis constructions, etc.

[tworrick]

Matt I saw at PIR Show they already have a new one out. Was even more money like 350 and lighter yet.

[Matt49]

Matt I saw at PIR Show they already have a new one out. Was even more money like 350 and lighter yet.

Well I went ahead and ordered the one I linked above. I was already ordering some other stuff from them and figured I'd give it a try.

[kiwi1955]

I have run the Wehrs for 4 meetings, no problems.

[Bubstr]

When figuring un-sprung weight, any thing that is connected to the chassis, is only figured at half of the weight, is considered un-sprung. This would include J bar, Coil overs, Driveshaft, ect. The things attached to the Axle assy, at the south end of the spring, are figured at full weight, such as wheels, tires, brakes, rotors, bells, tubes, gears ect. Some of the time, what is saved is not enough to make up for loss of strength.

Someone should invent a new metal called unobtainium, weighs nothing and stronger and harder than Superman's knee cap, and all the weak links will be solved.

[Matt49]

I weighed a MasterSbilt steel lift bar with all mounting hardware and the Wehrs aluminum. The MasterSbilt was only about 1 pound more so not much weight difference.
But I will say this about the Wehrs: it sure is nice looking. Almost a shame nobody's going to see it.

[FlatTire]

I tried to explain this concept a while back and was told to go pound sand. Glad somebody else used their brain and actually compared the aluminum to the steel piece. By the time you get the strength you need in the aluminum part, your weight savings will be gone. This holds true for pretty much any part. For strength, pound per pound, steel can't be beat. Until "unobtainium" is commercially available this will hold true!

[PushinTheLimit]

It's the same concept on most of the constructions that go on around the world. Everyone would love to use aluminum for their structures, but steel ends up being the best option in many cases.

[MasterSbilt_Racer]

I tried to explain this concept a while back and was told to go pound sand. Glad somebody else used their brain and actually compared the aluminum to the steel piece. By the time you get the strength you need in the aluminum part, your weight savings will be gone. This holds true for pretty much any part. For strength, pound per pound, steel can't be beat. Until "unobtainium" is commercially available this will hold true!

Unless Titanium is in the budget!

[powerslide]

Unless Titanium is in the budget!

I think that is his "unobtainium"

[jcm51]

We run Wehrs everything. Including the lift bar and we've yet to have any issues. Worth the money in our opinion. Ran it with open motors, crate motors, stell headed motors it don't matter.

[powerslide]

We run Wehrs everything. Including the lift bar and we've yet to have any issues. Worth the money in our opinion. Ran it with open motors, crate motors, stell headed motors it don't matter.

Where are you from? What tracks do you run? I feel like running in the south on the dirtfalt is waaayy different than banging the cushion at FALS.

[slingindirt83]

We ran one all year at FALS and had no issues with it. Seems like guys break steel ones around here quite a bit and then it tears up alot of stuff when they do.

[Bubstr]

A quick question, do any of you see a tendency for the frame attachment mount, bending or braking before the J bar?

You may want to think about, how the driver gets on the cushion and set up for running it, for longer J bar life among other things like axles and drive shafts or gears. If you do a slide job, you will bang the cushion, you give it a tough test and are allowed some, but just running the high groove with success is dependent on how you get on it and being just a tick loose. This changes how strong it has to be. You can try to make cars fool proof, but we never make them driver proof.