Spring change

[pig tracker]

If you have a car that is pushing like crazy do you soften or stiffen the RF? I now have a LF 650 and RF 550. Tried other chassis changes with little or no improvement. Thanks

[drtrkr244]

on the gas-soften rf
off the gas-soften lf

[pig tracker]

I just discovered I have a LF brake that is dragging. That seems like it would pull me down into the corner though. Rotor seems to be worn badly on the inside.

[powerslide]

is the RF traveling? Inside of rotor sometimes hits the lower control arm if you are turning left a lot(pushing). Where is the car tight?

[pig tracker]

RF is using all but 1/2 inch of shock travel. Entering. Will not turn.

[pig tracker]

It's a metric clip. Shocks all good. I'm still thinking it might be brakes. LF doesn't spin freely and has a grinding sound. When I pry the caliper piston back, spins and doesn't have a grinding sound.

[smirk]

Get your brakes straightened out. Even up your frt springs. Lf stiffer will stick your RR too hard on entry...soften it up it will turn. Maybe take a little rake out of jbar

[powerslide]

Take the spring out, put the shock back on, cycle the RF until the shock is at that last 1/2in of travel. I'm going with the frame is hitting the lower a-arm.

[powerslide]

Do you have nova lowers or stock metric lowers?

[HEAVY DUTY]

Take your RF spring out, and run it through its travel with the RF shock hooked up. You will probably find that something is bottoming before the shock. A 550 on the RF of a metric car with stock metric a frames is WAAAAAY too soft. If it is nova lowers it is 100 lbs too soft. You are probably bottoming out something giving you a solid suspension which is causing your push. If the lf brake is dragging and/or locking up, the car should be very loose on entry. Fix the brake issue, and then check your shock travel without a spring. If you have stock metric lowers, put a 1000 in the rfand a 900 lf.

[pig tracker]

I have nova lowers with pinto spindles. I just got done swapping the front springs(moved 650 to RF and 550 to LF) Replaced caliper also. I have run 550 on both sides before and had no problems. Sometimes I would change RF to a 600. Readjusted ride heights-rear were real close but fronts were off too much. Tomorrow I will take springs out and check. Don't really think that is the problem, but better safe than sorry. Also notice my LR rise was a little too much so I shorten that two turns. Thanks everyone for all the suggestions.

[stock car driver]

Throw 600-650s in front and depending on track do 200 LR and 175-225 RR. Moving 1/2" on rf you can easily do just by bouncing on front bumper. Think there is something binding if only achieving 1/2" of travel. Btw what shocks?

He uses ALL but the last 1/2 inch as it says above.

[pig tracker]

RF shock is a AFCO revalved by shock man and it is a tie down. SCD is right; I use all but the last 1/2", which is what we always shoot for.

[stock car driver]

you haven't said entering on or off the gas

on gas I would be looking at rear steer, trail the rr back 2 turns more

If off the gas front springs can play more of a roll but rear steer still is a factor, off the gas your down to whatever initial rear steer you set at ride height like on your scales etc.

lf brake would free u up on entry unless you've got no rear brake or improperly working rear brakes.

do you run a lr brake floater? that frees you up on entry and allows you to run a tighter car every place else. when its right I really like it, my first car didn't seem to like it and I never got it right my new car its great.

[pig tracker]

It's kind of weird; it really doesn't want to turn whether I'm off gas or on gas. Off gas is worse, but on gas it just seems to want to go straight off the corner faster. I've got some work to do(this is a different car than last year-soo)

[pig tracker]

Yes I do have a LR brake floater. I'll have to recheck rear steer, can't remember what it is off my head.

[powerslide]

Brake Floater in the hands of an inexprienced driver/crew chief is just another tool to dial the car out. Plenty of other stuff to work with until you are in the ballpark

[stock car driver]

Yes I do have a LR brake floater. I'll have to recheck rear steer, can't remember what it is off my head.

Honestly if you cant remember then its likely not where it needs to be there is a reason the same guys are usually up front, they are ensuring every detail is correct when they leave their shop.

I have marks on my frame I measure rear steer to axle tube distance it seems real critical on these 4 bar cars to me. I can change my car from tight to loose with a few turns of the rs bars.

[drtrkr244]

On a Bob Pierce car I crewed for, it was too tight with a 650lf, 600rf. I put a 600 in lf and freed it up, then I just adj bars for various track conditions.

[pig tracker]

I can't remember what I did an hour ago, that's why I write everything down in my book. I have it written down but don't remember if it is 1/4" or 1/2". I think it is the front springs also. I've never ran with a softer spring on RF before and I think this is my problem. The car is not a four-bar car it is a long spear-rod. New animal to me. I knew it would take awhile to dial in.

[pig tracker]

Just got home from working on car and checked rear steer and it is set at 1 1/8". J-bar has 4.5" drop(Left chassis mount and ride side of pinion.

[powerslide]

How are you checking steer? When something is that far off standard I always stand back and give it the eye. You can tell if it really has that much by backing up behind the car and looking at the wheels.

[pig tracker]

60". Motor also has been moved back to center. Have made some changes and will get car back on track in a few days. On a side note: How many RPM drop from a 6:48 to a 6:02?

[drtrkr244]

4-500, but that will vary depending how your car handles.

[pig tracker]

OK, been gone for awhile. Ran car 2 weeks ago with some changes. Swapped springs in front(650 RF- 550LF) Car still uses all but 1/2 to 3/4 inch of travel. Also car had 165# of LR before and started out with 100#LR. Car entered a lot better but pushed on throttle at apex out during heat race. Took more LR out(about 35#) Car enters good and will take throttle immediately but at apex pushes straight to out side of track and I have to get off gas and back on. I race again on the 24th. Took a little more out of LR(now 50# LR). Also moved RR bar up one hole and changed RF to a 600 spring. Also noticed my rear stagger is only 1 1/2 inch: really want more like 2 1/2 inch so I'm going to my new tires for rear and see if I can get my stagger right.

[MM90]

More rear stagger should help your apex.

[pig tracker]

Thanks for reply.

[drtrkr244]

Are your spear rods mounted on birdcages? If so, are they floated or solid? Thanks, just curious how you have so much drive.

[pig tracker]

On cages and floated. Has hellatious bite coming out. Now if I can just get it all the way around the corners. LOL

[drtrkr244]

Thanks for the info. I think your going the right way with less bite and softer rf spring and more stagger.

Is that car a converted 3 or 4 link?

[langdonracing48]

Sorry to sound dumb, but what the Heck is a spear rod set up? I've never heard of such a thing lol

[drtrkr244]

Basically, the trailing arm looks like a Y, which hooks to the top and bottom to a floated birdcage. Usually , you see them where a track allows only a 3 link.

[langdonracing48]

Oh cool! Thank you!

[JustAddDirt]

seen that done on the RR, but never both sides.
Were are springs? top of tubes, or on birdcage?

[pig tracker]

Both on cages. LR short rod, RR long approx. 5 foot.

[drtrkr244]

Aah haa! You are probly not making enough roll steer with that long of a trailing arm. You might have to shorten the rr a lot or put a lot of angle in it. I have seen that setup on asphalt cars, trying to minimize roll steer.

[pig tracker]

Had a practice day. Car was bad fast off the trailer. Only change I made today was changed RF spring from a 600# to 550#. Slightly better turning in. Going to buy a 500# and try that Friday. Track was dry slick so I think I'm in the ball park now and can try some small changes from here. What a relief to be able to drive car and not just along for the ride to wherever it wanted to go.

[pig tracker]

Had a practice day today. Car was bad fast off the trailer. Only change I made today was changed RF from a 600# to a 550#. Going to buy a 500# and try that Friday. What a relief to be able to drive car instead of just being along for the ride wherever the car wanted to take me. Track was dry slick so I think I'm in the ball park and ready to make small changes.