New Rocket car???

[jrkracing54]

Sounds like the blue/gray cars are going to be going by the way of the black front end cars. I just got a 2014 car. Figures. Should be interesting to see how they go. Who knows, it could be a flop like the orange front cars. John 1*

[onlyfacts]

[QUOTE=jrkracing54;1969161]Sounds like the blue/gray cars are going to be going by the way of the black front end cars. I just got a 2014 car. Figures. Should be interesting to see how they go. Who knows, it could be a flop like the orange front cars. John 1*[/ I don't think it means your car is out dated. Sheppard just won at Charlotte with a 2014 car. This is No different than any other Motorsport new models come out all the time. I am sure the 2014 car you have will still be competitive. I think it is great that we have competition... Think about how boring the racing could be if these chassis builders didn't make improvements. It would be the same old thing.

[jrkracing54]

Yea I'm not actually upset about it. It was more tongue in cheek that I just got caught up and they put a new car out. It's not like I'm running a national series or anything. John 1*

[Kwoods25]

Flop like the orange car? I really like my orange car. I'm not running no open motor class I'm running crates but it works really well. My buddy just ordered the new car said they were 81 behind

[jrkracing54]

I'm not trying to insult any car but I'm sure you would have to agree that car did not have the impact that they were hoping for when they put it out. Even Steve at Rocket told me if I bought an orange front I should change the ball joints and spindles and make it a gray front. I'm sure there are several people who love those cars but I'm just saying they did not live up to their expectations. John 1*

[Kwoods25]

No they didn't, I changed mine over to the gray. They are all good cars. Old to new

[DEKconsulting]

They said this new car is alot more $ anybody get a price yet

[RoundNrOUND]

There is a package that will cost quite a bit more, but you don't have to purchase that package. It's about a weight saving idea and that costs money.

[tsand]

They said this new car is alot more $ anybody get a price yet we was told the least way you could buy a car was chassis,(not a nice word)(not a nice word)(not a nice word)(not a nice word)pit,decking and a body kit, not mounted for 12 grand. That was what rocket quoted us.

[Freezer19]

There is a package that will cost quite a bit more, but you don't have to purchase that package. It's about a weight saving idea and that costs money.I will say that's exactly why Darrell's club cars are always fast when someone buys a new car. He requires you to buy the car complete and scales it before you leave. Most people assume they can "do it themselves" and they struggle and blame it on the car. ie: running a different school package, springs, and weight placement. You can't buy the cheapest model on the lot and expect to out perform the builder.

[3wheelinphotos]

Freexer19 you are million % correct! Every customer who buys a are from us with all the required componets and how we say to start off ALWAYS goes faster and is MUCH happier than the guys of I don't need that or I can get that part on a deal or so an so makes that it's close to it an cheaper i'll get that one. That guy who don't buy all the stuff from us soon is back spending 2 times the money to get all the correct stuff after struggling for a season. And yes chassis builder is the easiest person to blame if the car don't work...

Mike @ Warrior Race Cars

[dirtdobber45]

I just dnt understand all those "color" packages they have at Rocket .... seems like you'd want sumthin versital

[Josh Bayko]

I just dnt understand all those "color" packages they have at Rocket .... seems like you'd want sumthin versital

The thinking behind it is the different "colors" cater to different driving styles, and you buy the car that's supposed to cater to your driving style.

[dirt FANatic 11]

I wonder if they offer a Leather Recliner "color", for all of you full of wisdom Recliner Drivers

[McCool 57J]

Back on the cost of the car, rolling from rocket is around 38K from what I understand.

[W2Racing09]

Back on the cost of the car, rolling from rocket is around 38K from what I understand.

Isn't that about in line with Longhorn, Club 29, etc.?

Thanks,
Jeff.

[dirtMAN007]

There is a package that will cost quite a bit more, but you don't have to purchase that package. It's about a weight saving idea and that costs money.

I'm quite sure it is not all about weight !!!!

[zyoung25]

Isn't that about in line with Longhorn, Club 29, etc.?

Thanks,
Jeff.

The last I heard, longhorn was 37k, black diamond 43-45k, and add 3-4k for Lanigan's touches.

From what I was told, all of these cars come with the body sat on them and a few select parts.

[D. Tidrow]

The last I heard, longhorn was 37k, black diamond 43-45k, and add 3-4k for Lanigan's touches. From what I was told, all of these cars come with the body sat on them and a few select parts.I was saying a couple nights ago, the 2015 season will be a major turning point in dirt late model racing. If you want to be a winner on the national stage, it will take a lot more money. You will see a lot of teams fold in 2016 or after. That is all.

[blncfn57]

The last I heard, longhorn was 37k, black diamond 43-45k, and add 3-4k for Lanigan's touches.

From what I was told, all of these cars come with the body sat on them and a few select parts.

From what I've heard, you take your engine, trans and oil system when you pick up a black diamond and it's ready to race when you leave. Could be false info tho.

[fastford]

I was saying a couple nights ago, the 2015 season will be a major turning point in dirt late model racing. If you want to be a winner on the national stage, it will take a lot more money. You will see a lot of teams fold in 2016 or after. That is all.

agreed ....

[oldfart50]

Does it matter? I thought everyone knew if you wanted to win in this day and age you need a Longhorn. I am sorry you bought the wrong brand of car.

[FlatTire]

A few months back a longhorn was $32k and a Black Diamond was $33.5k as complete rollers and thats the only way they will sell them.

[dirtdobber45]

Jus another way to get your money use to you could buy jus a frame its BS to me

[MasterSbilt_Racer]

Jus another way to get your money use to you could buy jus a frame its BS to me

Get your money, but give you the best product too. A lot of folks get their cars all jacked up putting them together themselves. Binds, wrong bump steer, all kinds of issues. You can't afford to give anything up and expect to run well.

[Austin34471]

Get your money, but give you the best product too. A lot of folks get their cars all jacked up putting them together themselves. Binds, wrong bump steer, all kinds of issues. You can't afford to give anything up and expect to run well.
^This. If I ever sold cars, I'd ONLY sell them as rollers. Heck I might even make the customer bring me their engine so I could put that in too.. You sell a car as a bare frame and you end up having your name and your company on a car that billy joe put a 1998 rearend with the wrong length tubes in, put the uppers on backwards, used some used/locked solid 4 link heims, and runs like a pile of you know what with a giant ______ racing chassis sticker on the spoiler. And these guys don't make any money on just the frame either.

[TheJet-09]

I understand that logic but at the same time disagree. What happens once you leave their shop? Rayburn used to preach that guys were the fastest in his cars when they first left his shop, and he was right. Look at Auckland back in the day or Erb in present day. But as soon as you struggle you start turning things and just screw it up from there. That's also why he joked he was going to build a car where the only adjustable thing was the seat belts. It's virtually impossible to put a price on workmanship and design but when I hear the prices on some of these cars I'm blown away. Good way to kill the sport.

[hucktyson]

So there's guys buying brand new chassis ... And using components off a 1997 bullett leaf car ??? Your telling me a guy capable of fabricating his own stuff can't tell if a heim end is rusted solid ? Guys that have been fabricating their whole lives can't measure a 4 link rod center to center or use a bump steer gauge ??? Or a camber gauge ? Or
Read ride heights ? Or read scale numbers ? By this logic racers should throw away their fab equipment because the only one qualified to use it is the guy making 15 an hour working at a chassis builder ...

[tsand]

So there's guys buying brand new chassis ... And using components off a 1997 bullett leaf car ??? Your telling me a guy capable of fabricating his own stuff can't tell if a heim end is rusted solid ? Guys that have been fabricating their whole lives can't measure a 4 link rod center to center or use a bump steer gauge ??? Or a camber gauge ? Or
Read ride heights ? Or read scale numbers ? By this logic racers should throw away their fab equipment because the only one qualified to use it is the guy making 15 an hour working at a chassis builder ... your totally right the guy that are winning on consist basis don't need the chassis builder to tell them what to do. It's been my experience that most chassis builders rely on there customers feed back to know what to do. A lot of times it's the changes a customer makes that is incorporated in their new design. Most racers are just as smart as the chassis builders. It's when the builders start Beliving that they are smarter then their customers is when they become irrelevant. CJ is a prime example he's always thought he was smarter the the next guy and his way is the only way. Where have that gotten him . Now he's just an after thought in the business.

[MasterSbilt_Racer]

So there's guys buying brand new chassis ... And using components off a 1997 bullett leaf car ??? Your telling me a guy capable of fabricating his own stuff can't tell if a heim end is rusted solid ? Guys that have been fabricating their whole lives can't measure a 4 link rod center to center or use a bump steer gauge ??? Or a camber gauge ? Or
Read ride heights ? Or read scale numbers ? By this logic racers should throw away their fab equipment because the only one qualified to use it is the guy making 15 an hour working at a chassis builder ...
There are plenty of people out there that are not capable of assembling it correctly. Take a walk around the pits at a regular Saturday night show.

[tsand]

There are plenty of people out there that are not capable of assembling it correctly. Take a walk around the pits at a regular Saturday night show.there is people in all sports that don't know what they are doing just like there is chassis builders that can build a first class car then don't know what to do with it once it gets to the track. One set up or one design won't work for ever driver. Someone can do the opposite of what the builders tell them to do but it might work for their driving style. I've seen things on cars that I would say that won't work then seen that same car blister the field. What might be wrong for you might be right for someone else.

[00Hdmn]

I was saying a couple nights ago, the 2015 season will be a major turning point in dirt late model racing. If you want to be a winner on the national stage, it will take a lot more money. You will see a lot of teams fold in 2016 or after. That is all.

I think I agree with you, it will look like the sprint car circuit in the next few years. Crate racing sucks, its going to be a sad day. The steel block class was the best for low budget teams and the racing was really good too. Miss them days.

[MasterSbilt_Racer]

there is people in all sports that don't know what they are doing just like there is chassis builders that can build a first class car then don't know what to do with it once it gets to the track. One set up or one design won't work for ever driver. Someone can do the opposite of what the builders tell them to do but it might work for their driving style. I've seen things on cars that I would say that won't work then seen that same car blister the field. What might be wrong for you might be right for someone else.

I don't think you get my drift. Missing bumpsteer shims and tie rods on the wrong side of the steering arm won't make you faster. Neither will bound up 4 links from incorrect spacer locations.

[hucktyson]

Mb racer if guy can't even install spacers in the correct location or have the common sense to move the suspension through its travel and look for binds it's highly unlikely he's going to run well reguardless of who assembled the car. Keyser has bearing uppers on sale for 89 each today ... Is the 8" 13 degree bearing upper from the builder with a keyser decal for 140 superior to the 8" 13 degree upper wih the keyser decal for 89 ??

[hucktyson]

Are the grade 5 4 link bolts without the head back cut that builders provide superior to the exact length grade 8 bolts with the back side of the head chamfered back for extra clearance ??? Builders don't have the time to be meticulous with minor details because they can't change enough to take 100 hours to body a car . The builders provide exact measurements as to where everything goes and the proper component sizes in my opinion if you can't follow those instructions you should find another hobby. It's funny people complain about cost but clowns come
On here with the opinion that unless your buying a club 29 complete with decals you shouldn't race lol lol lol. Building the car is one of the best parts of racing ..

[SuperEight]

There are plenty of people out there that are not capable of assembling it correctly. Take a walk around the pits at a regular Saturday night show.

You my friend, "Hit the nail on the head and drove it thru the board and out the other side!!!"

[MasterSbilt_Racer]

Are the grade 5 4 link bolts without the head back cut that builders provide superior to the exact length grade 8 bolts with the back side of the head chamfered back for extra clearance ??? Builders don't have the time to be meticulous with minor details because they can't change enough to take 100 hours to body a car . The builders provide exact measurements as to where everything goes and the proper component sizes in my opinion if you can't follow those instructions you should find another hobby. It's funny people complain about cost but clowns come
On here with the opinion that unless your buying a club 29 complete with decals you shouldn't race lol lol lol. Building the car is one of the best parts of racing ..

I laugh at the guys who buy a club car and don't go any faster. I envy the guys who can afford to do so and now you can't beat them.

There are guys who are very talented drivers, but lack the knowledge it takes to do it right. That is a fact. Those folks need someone to do it right for them.

[TheJet-09]

^^^ We used to say those guys had "all dollars and no sense!" I agree that there is much enjoyment in building a car. Anymore, I think I get more satisfaction out of working on the car than actually racing it. I feel like I live in the wrong era. I would've like to have raced when you had to salvage or fabricate most everything on the car. Now you just buy it off the shelf (or on-line...which I did today as well).

[let-r-eat]

I like to see the guy with the home-made trailer, towing it with a 30 year old van, driving an old car he bought off some rich team who thought it was junk, who builds his own engines and shocks and stuff and just smokes that high dollar junk.

[pink floyd]

I like to see the guy with the home-made trailer, towing it with a 30 year old van, driving an old car he bought off some rich team who thought it was junk, who builds his own engines and shocks and stuff and just smokes that high dollar junk.

when is the last time that happened??

[late96]

We've done that, not smoked the big dollar team, but we show up every week with our car on open trailer, buy used tires from big teams, and are proud to win now and than whether be heat race or feature

[let-r-eat]

I don't see it near as much nowadays but I do still see it happen every once in a while.

[catgo22]

Let-r-eat said: I like to see the guy with the home-made trailer, towing it with a 30 year old van, driving an old car he bought off some rich team who thought it was junk, who builds his own engines and shocks and stuff and just smokes that high dollar junk.

I'd say Kevin Weaver here in central Illinois is close to that. He beats some awful good cars and drivers on a small budget.

[dirtMAN007]

Let-r-eat said: I like to see the guy with the home-made trailer, towing it with a 30 year old van, driving an old car he bought off some rich team who thought it was junk, who builds his own engines and shocks and stuff and just smokes that high dollar junk.

I'd say Kevin Weaver here in central Illinois is close to that. He beats some awful good cars and drivers on a small budget.

Brain grey ...................that's who it is !!!!

[chupp n bloomer fan]

Let-r-eat said: I like to see the guy with the home-made trailer, towing it with a 30 year old van, driving an old car he bought off some rich team who thought it was junk, who builds his own engines and shocks and stuff and just smokes that high dollar junk.

I'd say Kevin Weaver here in central Illinois is close to that. He beats some awful good cars and drivers on a small budget.Kevin Weaver is sponsored by corporate Jimmy John's. Not just a local Jimmy John's, the actual Jimmy John's guy/corporation.

[oldfart50]

Why do new cars cost 70% more than they did 10 years ago? I can think of nothing else that has increased that much in price over the last 10 years. Someone help me out here please.

[hucktyson]

It's called " juice " lots of juice

[turnleftandgasit]

Kevin Weaver is sponsored by corporate Jimmy John's. Not just a local Jimmy John's, the actual Jimmy John's guy/corporation.

While you are correct about it being from corporate, it is not a national level deal.

[SuperEight]

Why do new cars cost 70% more than they did 10 years ago? I can think of nothing else that has increased that much in price over the last 10 years. Someone help me out here please.

Its more like 30%, but its a lot and it has to do with several factors like inflation, devaluation of our currency and globalization. Not to mention more and more light weight parts and shock packages that cost as much as a nice used car. Try buying a new truck, they have increased at least that much too.

[oldfart50]

In 2004 complete rollers were less that $20k. I sold a lot of them...

[hanginitout]

Its more like 30%, but its a lot and it has to do with several factors like inflation, devaluation of our currency and globalization. Not to mention more and more light weight parts and shock packages that cost as much as a nice used car. Try buying a new truck, they have increased at least that much too.

I believe the crates have a lot to do with it, they were the futrue of racing.. GM and fastrac and other sactioning bodies are making it $$$. Racer are spending it to go faster, IE light weight parts shocks. which is not all bad because i believe racer have contributed some much to technology its not funny.....Racer are very resourcful... I do believe they need to bring back the saturday night home built motor if you want, and racer can do that when the class starts to faulter the tracks will look another way to bring cars in... I was a beliver in the crates at first.. But now see it different... I believe they can set the rules to as such if you want to build your own motor you can.... You can rebuild them cheeper than what they want you to build them for, yourself. JMO.....

[fastford]

I believe the crates have a lot to do with it, they were the futrue of racing.. GM and fastrac and other sactioning bodies are making it $$$. Racer are spending it to go faster, IE light weight parts shocks. which is not all bad because i believe racer have contributed some much to technology its not funny.....Racer are very resourcful... I do believe they need to bring back the saturday night home built motor if you want, and racer can do that when the class starts to faulter the tracks will look another way to bring cars in... I was a beliver in the crates at first.. But now see it different... I believe they can set the rules to as such if you want to build your own motor you can.... You can rebuild them cheeper than what they want you to build them for, yourself. JMO.....

this is what I said all along, the crate engine was supposed to save the racer money over all and be for the less funded beginners, yea right, the racers with plenty of funding are gone spend it to win, if not on the engine , then elsewhere to get an advantage. Be honest with yourself, when was the last time you say a crate racer pull in with an open trailer and an older car with old style oil shocks and a box stock crate engine win a race????? I do think the theory in the beginning was ok, but I also knew that a lack of policing and series catering to these specialized parts suppliers would destroy the original purpose of this class.

[Josh Bayko]

this is what I said all along, the crate engine was supposed to save the racer money over all and be for the less funded beginners, yea right, the racers with plenty of funding are gone spend it to win, if not on the engine , then elsewhere to get an advantage. Be honest with yourself, when was the last time you say a crate racer pull in with an open trailer and an older car with old style oil shocks and a box stock crate engine win a race????? I do think the theory in the beginning was ok, but I also knew that a lack of policing and series catering to these specialized parts suppliers would destroy the original purpose of this class.

The ONLY thing crate sanctions EVER promised was reduced engine costs. The whole notion that it was supposed to be "affordable" racing is something that people took completely out of context. They're late models, which are already prohibitively expensive to an awful lot of racers before you add in the engine costs. The fact they they allowed blueprinting to sealed motors should have been an instant clue that the class wasn't exactly "affordable".

If the class was supposed to actually be "affordable" racing, Blueprinting, the exotic shocks and lightweight rears and super special crate carbs and headers would have been outlawed from the jump.

Another thing people fail to realize about crate late model racing. the class wasn't developed with the racer in mind. It was developed with the promoter in mind. The line of thinking was "You can have late models, but you don't have to pay a late model purse."

[fastford]

I didn't figure it would take you long to chime in, we've done this before , and down here it was pushed just as I described, a beginner and affordable alternative. you keep believing the crate is the best thing since sliced bread and I will keep believing there a fad....

[hanginitout]

The ONLY thing crate sanctions EVER promised was reduced engine costs. The whole notion that it was supposed to be "affordable" racing is something that people took completely out of context. They're late models, which are already prohibitively expensive to an awful lot of racers before you add in the engine costs. The fact they they allowed blueprinting to sealed motors should have been an instant clue that the class wasn't exactly "affordable".

If the class was supposed to actually be "affordable" racing, Blueprinting, the exotic shocks and lightweight rears and super special crate carbs and headers would have been outlawed from the jump.

Another thing people fail to realize about crate late model racing. the class wasn't developed with the racer in mind. It was developed with the promoter in mind. The line of thinking was "You can have late models, but you don't have to pay a late model purse."

The sactioning bodies are'nt going to outlaw all that stuff, like blue printing. the engine builder have to pay so much a year to them just so they are an approved builders. headers shocks, carbs, cause they are getting promotion money from tjhose companies, just like the hard hoosier tire. that was suppose to last several races. some get 4 new ones a nights. They sold it, as a begining racers class and affordable class then paid large purses to get the guys to pay the fees every year to be able to compete,, and so forth came the davenports ,and all the others.... Good marketing for them... Not the little guy in mind as sold...... And don't get me wrong no form of racing is cheep..

[Josh Bayko]

I didn't figure it would take you long to chime in, we've done this before , and down here it was pushed just as I described, a beginner and affordable alternative. you keep believing the crate is the best thing since sliced bread and I will keep believing there a fad....

Where did I say crates were "the best thing" ever? If anything, I described the class as an absolute farce. They have done more to hurt racing than actually help it. They've more or less destroyed the steel block and super late model classes in a lot of places. Up my way, lots of folks have realized that the class isn't all it's cracked up to be and are moving up to supers.

[hanginitout]

Where did I say crates were "the best thing" ever? If anything, I described the class as an absolute farce. They have done more to hurt racing than actually help it. They've more or less destroyed the steel block and super late model classes in a lot of places. Up my way, lots of folks have realized that the class isn't all it's cracked up to be and are moving up to supers.

Amen..... A lot more need to realize,,, and if not supers to mods....This class at your local saturday night track, guys tear up more stuff than mods ever did... They no if your not upfront you have no chance of winning...... So its all out in the heats and feature, to get to the front....even if you have 5th place car.....

[fastford]

Where did I say crates were "the best thing" ever? If anything, I described the class as an absolute farce. They have done more to hurt racing than actually help it. They've more or less destroyed the steel block and super late model classes in a lot of places. Up my way, lots of folks have realized that the class isn't all it's cracked up to be and are moving up to supers.

I apologize, I think I got you mixed up with some one else from a wile back that was a huge crate supporter .

[PushinTheLimit]

Seems like there is so much hate toward the crates. I know for a very small operation that I have, no way I could afford to run supers at this point in time (but certainly would like to move up to them in the next 2-3 years). We don't have a local track that runs supers on a weekly basis so it's either run crates or steelheads if you want to run late models. Closest one is about 2 hours away and doesn't pay well at all. Our tracks for the most part combine crates and steelheads and are fairly competitive with one another. The upside is that we have a couple good crate series around that pays pretty good and the fields are very competitive. If you run good in them, you've done something.

I don't think it's a beginner class anymore (we have a Sportsman class around here that's more like that) but it's been good for a guy like me that had never driven on dirt and get my feet wet before I moved up a division.

[latemodel86]

Back when I raced, we ran the crate class. I agree with both sides of the argument concerning how crates have helped and not helped late model racing as a whole. It was definitely the only way we could race a late model but, obviously, we were up against guys with ten times the financial budget that we had, making it pointless, as we all know it to be most of the time, if you are a budget racer.

I read an article a few months back where Tim McCreadie gave his opinion on spec/economical racing. One of his points was that the more you try to cut costs on engines, shocks, tires, etc. the more expensive you actually make it. Thus, you will have to buy multiples of those items, in order to achieve the performance you could have gotten from the "open" items if that makes sense.

I would love to get back into a racecar and after not racing for 3 years; the itch has gotten worse. My goal would be to at least get back to crates, but with these high budget teams running crates and with all of the advancements to the technological side of it all, there is no way in h e l l I could even be serious about being competitive or even racing it enough for it to serve its purpose. Even the street stocks are becoming the next "crates." The same thing happened to kart racing 4-6 years ago with the clone engines overtaking the flathead classes. Bottom line to this thread, "Money... If you do not have it or access to it, it is nearly impossible to be competitive, and is not getting any cheaper." The days of pure talent overshadowing the quality of your machine are dwindling just because the money makes such a difference in these new parts. I still think that engineering some little differences into these cars to gain an advantage, will always be around, as Rumley and Davenport showed us this year. However, the budget racer cannot afford to buy it or will most likely not come up with this on their own. The only way, is to use resources and test those theories, which also goes back to needing money to do these tests. Just my 2 cents

[fastford]

Back when I raced, we ran the crate class. I agree with both sides of the argument concerning how crates have helped and not helped late model racing as a whole. It was definitely the only way we could race a late model but, obviously, we were up against guys with ten times the financial budget that we had, making it pointless, as we all know it to be most of the time, if you are a budget racer.

I read an article a few months back where Tim McCreadie gave his opinion on spec/economical racing. One of his points was that the more you try to cut costs on engines, shocks, tires, etc. the more expensive you actually make it. Thus, you will have to buy multiples of those items, in order to achieve the performance you could have gotten from the "open" items if that makes sense.

I would love to get back into a racecar and after not racing for 3 years; the itch has gotten worse. My goal would be to at least get back to crates, but with these high budget teams running crates and with all of the advancements to the technological side of it all, there is no way in h e l l I could even be serious about being competitive or even racing it enough for it to serve its purpose. Even the street stocks are becoming the next "crates." The same thing happened to kart racing 4-6 years ago with the clone engines overtaking the flathead classes. Bottom line to this thread, "Money... If you do not have it or access to it, it is nearly impossible to be competitive, and is not getting any cheaper." The days of pure talent overshadowing the quality of your machine are dwindling just because the money makes such a difference in these new parts. I still think that engineering some little differences into these cars to gain an advantage, will always be around, as Rumley and Davenport showed us this year. However, the budget racer cannot afford to buy it or will most likely not come up with this on their own. The only way, is to use resources and test those theories, which also goes back to needing money to do these tests. Just my 2 cents

gone be hard to out run little skinner or the mulinax clan latemodle86 , but give it a run, and by the way , when they took the un fair advantages they were giving the crates at TST over the sportsman, , look what happened, just saying....

[latemodel86]

I never did understand the crates and sportsman classes being mixed together at TST and a few other local tracks... I guess to get car count up to help with a turnout for the sportsman and help pay the field??? Back in '09 when we started out on our 97 Shaw with a 602, we had no idea the challenges we would be facing... Traded for an 06 TNT at the end of the year and were actually competitive with the bone stock 602 and non adjustable afco's at TST for a little bit. Consistently around the top 5 out of 15-25 cars. Could have competed for a win a River Valley and TST on those two occasions had a few circumstances been different. However, it became more and more difficult to run as people were updating and we were running the same stuff and less and less races each year to keep learning. Times have changed in crates since then. It was tough to be a contender with a 602 and non adjustable shocks but now, that is impossible. If you tell someone that a 602, stock or illegal, with non adjustable shocks is going to win the local feature event or even finish top 3, you will get one of the most craziest looks you will ever see. Times have changed in crates, and has progressed to be a rich man's sport, just like racing as a whole.

[hanginitout]

Seems like there is so much hate toward the crates. I know for a very small operation that I have, no way I could afford to run supers at this point in time (but certainly would like to move up to them in the next 2-3 years). We don't have a local track that runs supers on a weekly basis so it's either run crates or steelheads if you want to run late models. Closest one is about 2 hours away and doesn't pay well at all. Our tracks for the most part combine crates and steelheads and are fairly competitive with one another. The upside is that we have a couple good crate series around that pays pretty good and the fields are very competitive. If you run good in them, you've done something.

I don't think it's a beginner class anymore (we have a Sportsman class around here that's more like that) but it's been good for a guy like me that had never driven on dirt and get my feet wet before I moved up a division.

If all the tracks would give an option to run a steel block with the crates, would be great.. Needed badly...

[fastford]

I never did understand the crates and sportsman classes being mixed together at TST and a few other local tracks... I guess to get car count up to help with a turnout for the sportsman and help pay the field??? Back in '09 when we started out on our 97 Shaw with a 602, we had no idea the challenges we would be facing... Traded for an 06 TNT at the end of the year and were actually competitive with the bone stock 602 and non adjustable afco's at TST for a little bit. Consistently around the top 5 out of 15-25 cars. Could have competed for a win a River Valley and TST on those two occasions had a few circumstances been different. However, it became more and more difficult to run as people were updating and we were running the same stuff and less and less races each year to keep learning. Times have changed in crates since then. It was tough to be a contender with a 602 and non adjustable shocks but now, that is impossible. If you tell someone that a 602, stock or illegal, with non adjustable shocks is going to win the local feature event or even finish top 3, you will get one of the most craziest looks you will ever see. Times have changed in crates, and has progressed to be a rich man's sport, just like racing as a whole.

I tried to argue with TST about letting the crates run with the sportsman,s, my argument was, if you have a crate class available , then ALL crates should run in that class. why should they be given weight breaks and big spoiler because they want to run with sportsman ? and were not talking about the 602, were talking about the 604 with aluminum heads which is an advantage over the steel heads in the slick anyway. plus there was no teching of the crates that ran sportsman at all. If you wanted to protest a crate, it wasn't like protesting a sportsman where you put up 300 bucks and they tore the engine down right there, it would cost 1000 and they sent the motor to a "certified" rebuilder and he would check it and let you know. LOL know to be fair, TST has pretty much fixed this by at least taking the breaks away for the most part and now if a crate runs sportsman and gets protested , they tear it down that night. Im not a crate hater , what I don't like is lack of policing and the catering to Nesmith in crates and street stocks , but as usual, this is JMO.........

[PushinTheLimit]

I totally understand your point. I haven't raced at TST yet, but plan to do so sometime if we ever get down there when the Nesmith series races there. I would think with the size of that track and how slick I know it gets... crates should run well with steelheads. Our local track alot like TST in size and typically goes black slick for the feature and crates run well there.

I know many fans don't want to see crates as the headliner of the night, but the budget for the super guys (even local super teams) I would be willing to bet is still way more than what a crate team spends in a year. Crate racing is not cheap by any means, but it's better than sitting on the couch at home lol.

[fastford]

the couple crates that's winning right now has as big or bigger budgets than the late models, as a matter of fact, in the slick, there turning times within the top 4 or 5 latemodels.....

[bb14]

the couple crates that's winning right now has as big or bigger budgets than the late models, as a matter of fact, in the slick, there turning times within the top 4 or 5 latemodels.....

The bolts are a good idea on paper. However the bolts just keep the honest people out.

I have always thought the bolts should be removed. Since people are spending so much on crates I also feel there should be one late model class. Run hard tires. 50 durometer after race. LM's are expensive. One class or watch. Our society has affected our judgement in racing now. Life is not fair and we are not equal. Just do the best you can.