If you were doing a new super late model series???????

[FASTRAKPR]

I hear a lot of suggestions on how to and how not to run a super late model deal. If you were building a new super late model series and lets keep it on a regional basis for now, what would you do? What rules would you use?

Body Rules
Tire rules (or not)
Engine rules (or not)
Chassis and components
Electronics
Purse
Misc

REGIONAL SUPER LATE MODEL SERIES PLEASE

This truly could be either a very informational post or eye opening one or if we get really lucky, maybe even both. Have fun!

[HoosierDirtFan]

I hear a lot of suggestions on how to and how not to run a super late model deal. If you were building a new super late model series and lets keep it on a regional basis for now, what would you do? What rules would you use?

Body Rules
Tire rules (or not)
Engine rules (or not)
Chassis and components
Electronics
Purse
Misc

REGIONAL SUPER LATE MODEL SERIES PLEASE

This truly could be either a very informational post or eye opening one or if we get really lucky, maybe even both. Have fun!

This is a good idea - see what the thoughts are between racers / teams and the casual race fan.

BODY RULES - STARS/ HAV-A-TAMPA Body rules. 1900-1995 body rules some where in between.

TIRES - Hard Tires or the hardest tire the locals run <> Hoosier, American Racer, or Goodyear.

MOTOR - Max 430 motor with 4 bl carb. Chip Rule.
Steel Head allowed at 2275 LBS, 525 Motor allowed at 2250 LBS, & Crates Allowed at 2200 LBS.

COMPONENTS - Some type of safety cut off for fuel line <>Go back to rules from the mid 90's and do a better job of controlling cost before they get out of hand.
1 shock per corner of car medium or hard shock.
7in Spoiler at 65 degree angle, Crates 8in spoiler at 70 degree angle.
Car weight 2300 LBS

ELECTRONICS - no Electronics except for Raceciever, transponders, and gauges around the steering wheel - $3,000 fine if caught <> drive the car and use the talent and brains given to you.

PURSE STRUCTURE - Payout #1 $2,500 to win, $250 to start, 30 laps, & $110 tow.
Payout #2 $3,500 to win, $350 to start, 35 laps, & $125 tow.
Payout #3 $4,000 to win, $400 to start, 40 laps, & $135 tow.
Payout #4 $5,000+ to win, $500 to start, 50 laps, & $140 tow.
2-Day Shows
Day #1 $2,500/ $3,000/ $4,000 to win, $300/ $350 start, 35 laps, & $135 tow
Day #2 $5,000/ $7,500 to win/ $10,000 to win, $500/ $800 to start, 50/60 laps, & $140/ $150 tow.
All Heat Races $150, $140, $130, $120, $110, $100, $90, $80, $70, $60, & $50 on down
Fast Qualifiers $100, $90, $80, $70, & $60

MISC. - Chemical Alteration of tires $5,000 fine 1st offence, $10,000 fine 2nd offence and 1 year suspension.

Something close to what the old Northern All-Stars Late Models Series (NALMS) had.
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I'm sure others could do this better then I could. just some brief thoughts.

[Krooser]

Body rules... about the same as now... although these things are pretty ugly IMHO.

Tire rule... any make or compound but you have to run the same RR all night.

Engine... no wide bores. 23 degree heads for Chevy... Mopar/Ford any OEM style head. 100# weight break for iron heads/block.

Chassis... Twin tube shocks only.

Electronics... 7000 rpm chip rule.

Purse... $2,000 to win. $500.00 to start main. $500/400/300/200/100 to top five qualifiers. Three cars time in at same time. Two laps timed per car. 12 cars start the main based on time... 2 cars transfer from B-main. Winner transfers from the heats . Heats pay $300-$200-$100. Fast time starts at the tail of the main. Last weeks winner starts last row. $100.00 tow $$$ if on the 'plan'. B main pays all the way down to last place.

Putting the fast guys at the tail makes for a better show and gives the lower buck guys a shot at making some $$$. If you race you get paid...

[Kwd1253]

Well here my idea, I do a regional but I would work with the ones already have today 4 to 5 different regional areas 20 races for each one. Work and help promote add more money to the pot but do my own points for my promotion side. Ill post which race through the year are for point for my promotion side. For south comp cam, MSCCS.. for southeast all stars, Ultimate "when in the south". For the north ufo and ultimate "when in the north".. mid west think I would have to split it in have mars and blue grass one side other side cornbelt and big 10 something like that.... Each regional will have point championship winner gets 25k and last race for each regional will be 25k 100 lap.. do note to enter for the 25k race, you will have to qualified 85% of 20 races. what ever you have the most points of the 5 regional areas will can only race in that 25k regional championship race. 100k National Regional Championship Race....every one that entered and qualified for regional championship race will be invited to enter. Payouts will start from last place in b-main to feature winner.. b-main last place to 3rd place 3k-6k payout. Feature last to first $7500-100k... points , what ever race you race it will go into that regional areas. It will not cross over into another regional area. Purse $500-$2500 on top of other promoter purse that is paying 5k+.. if promoter payouts are less my promotion will put more money into winnings. Body, misc,electronics, chassis and components, tire rules will follow the national series rules lucas and woo.Motor rule. No wide bore motors...

[kidrock]

Body rules... about the same as now... although these things are pretty ugly IMHO.

Tire rule... any make or compound but you have to run the same RR all night.

Engine... no wide bores. 23 degree heads for Chevy... Mopar/Ford any OEM style head. 100# weight break for iron heads/block.

Chassis... Twin tube shocks only.

Electronics... 7000 rpm chip rule.

Purse... $2,000 to win. $500.00 to start main. $500/400/300/200/100 to top five qualifiers. Three cars time in at same time. Two laps timed per car. 12 cars start the main based on time... 2 cars transfer from B-main. Winner transfers from the heats . Heats pay $300-$200-$100. Fast time starts at the tail of the main. Last weeks winner starts last row. $100.00 tow $$$ if on the 'plan'. B main pays all the way down to last place.

Putting the fast guys at the tail makes for a better show and gives the lower buck guys a shot at making some $$$. If you race you get paid...

Man if I had the dollars I would hire this guy in a heartbeat and let him get started. The only thing I might and I say might differ on is the any tire but, I do like the idea of running the same tire on the rr all night.

Good post Krosser

[Krooser]

Wow... thanks. I know it would never work because so many guys want to save money by spending more.

My last track promoting deal failed miserably when I wrote economy rules for my street stocks and the big guys stayed away in droves... so my track champ drove a near-stock 80's Pontiac Grand Prix with a Pontiac motor and made $1500.00 in prize money over five nights of racing. While I paid $250-300 to win the main (and paid three spots in the heats) the fast guys ran for $200/win and zippo in the heats...

That tire deal is just an idea... may or may not work. But we are killing the sport when we "have" to have $1000.00 adjustable shocks (weekly show) so we don't need as many then hang $20,000.00 worth of shocks on the trailer wall all the while insisting we are 'saving' money.

[Josh Bayko]

I'm going to be pretty realistic with my suggestions, like if I was going to start a series right now. I mean, you're going to need cars and requiring mass changes of any sort is going to impact car counts in a negative manner.

Body rules: UMP/WoO rules. No templates like Lucas or whatever. Different spoilers based on engine package.

Tire rules: I'd go with an adjustable tire rule that changes depending on the track the series is running, similar to what the WoO has been doing.

Engine rules: Current Lucas/WoO/UMP rules. Provisions made for steel blocks and CT525s.

Chassis/suspension: No inerters. Max of 6 shocks on car. Weight rule differences based on engine package.

Electronics: No telemetry. No traction control. No electronic adjustable suspension pieces of any sort.

Purse: 4k to win, 400 to start. Extra 400 bonus money per show to tour followers who make every show, though if they had to use a provisional, they forfeit start money. Point fund winner would get 25k and it would pay back 12 spots. Fast time is 100 bonus. Heats and consis pay 100 to win as well.

Misc:
• Would consider going to a chip rule. Would hold open test session where the chip was mandatory. Would poll drivers after test to see if it would be a practical idea.
•Format would be group qualifying. Drivers pull pills to determine heat going through gate. Cars would time trial only against the cars in their heat. Fast time in each group spins an invert wheel 2/4/6/8 for their heat. Feature is set from heats. Consi cars fill in after.
•Would have 20k to win, 1k to start show to close the season.
•Would require a raceiver and transponder at every show.
•Mandatory autograph session at before every show. Also, would get a tractor and hay cart to give kids tours through pits. Driver racing that night leads tour, and gets 100 bucks for his trouble.
•Would avoid conflicts with WoO/Lucas races in my region, or inquire about co-sanctioning on this dates.
•Would look into local television coverage of races. At least a mention during sports reports on local news.
•Would be extremely stiff penalties for cheating. Would be even more extreme for intentional rough driving. Would be banned for life if found to be intoxicated while racing.
•Would keep races within a 500 mile radius, and look to schedule in weekend swings.
•Would keep an open forum with all drivers at all times. Would look to have meetings/conference calls with all touring drivers in attendance at least once a month, to air greivances, take suggestions, and just ask drivers how they're doing.
•Would do whatever it took for Rick Eshelman to be my announcer.

[FlatTire]

The only engine rule i would hav is a max hp/torque @ specified rpm. Cars would come off the track and be dyno'd immediately. Run any suspension you want. Spec shock rule. Winner has to trade his shocks in for a new set issued by track.I would leave some freedom in the body rules. Hoosier white dots only. Thats the best and most economical tire they ever made. I want a series thats provides a platform to those who want to get creative and work harder than the rest. Innovation should be rewarded, not shot down because a bunch of cry babies got their asses handed to them.

[Hoosier]

Total end of single car qualifying. Try using hot laps for qualifying times.
Maybe draw for heat race starting spots, and then full invert for a second heat race.

Feature race starts at 9:30 or 10:00.

[SuperEight]

I hear a lot of suggestions on how to and how not to run a super late model deal. If you were building a new super late model series and lets keep it on a regional basis for now, what would you do? What rules would you use?

Body Rules
Tire rules (or not)
Engine rules (or not)
Chassis and components
Electronics
Purse
Misc

REGIONAL SUPER LATE MODEL SERIES PLEASE

This truly could be either a very informational post or eye opening one or if we get really lucky, maybe even both. Have fun!


1) Body Rules -
1995 HAT/UDTRA rules.
NO MD3 type noses.
8 inch spoiler, adjustable OK.

2) Tire rules -
Open Tire, but must run tires you qualify on.

3) Engine rules -
Wide bore engines #2400,
All others #2300,
All steel 2" more engine setback.

4) Chassis -
Minimum 2" SQR or 1-3/4" RND .083 wall.

5) Components -
No Carbon Fiber or Titanium

6) Suspension -
1 Shock per wheel,
NO interconnected shocks,
NO driver adjustable suspension.
NO phone adjustable shocks.

7) Electronics -
No data acquisition during competition,
MSD and Mallory OK,
Coil Pack systems with brain box OK.
NO traction control.

[MasterSbilt_Racer]

Man if I had the dollars I would hire this guy in a heartbeat and let him get started. The only thing I might and I say might differ on is the any tire but, I do like the idea of running the same tire on the rr all night.

Good post Krosser

The rr tire all night deal is the only tire rule that really saves money and makes sense.

[1Jthejuice]

any tire, same RR all nightany motor, but a carb restrictor plate and each header must flow into a minimum 3' 1.5" od tail pipe ( you can spend 40g's but i'm not sure why you want to)all shocks must be solid steel body, no adjustable shocksbody rules as they are.no electronics outside the raceiverno carbon fiber drive lines

[tsand]

They are starting a new late model series in the Carolinas old school late models. One rule is a shock rule . a common shock package from pro shocks at 70$ a shock stamped with series name .initial order of 100 shocks were sold out in a few days.

[kidrock]

The rr tire all night deal is the only tire rule that really saves money and makes sense.


I agree 100% with running the same tire on the rr all night.

[Catfish N Rice 11]

"Run whatcha brung"

[HEAVY DUTY]

I would make the tires be chain link tread design, and not allow any grooving or siping. Tires take too much time for the average guy. The big well funded teams have one guy to do just tires. The racing would be the same if the tires were untouched, and that would free up some time for the smaller teams that are struggling to get everything done while they are having to work a full time job. Anything that adds work, and cost to racing, but doesn't make the quality of racing better isn't needed. Ingenuity is a good thing, technology is what costs so much.

[SuperEight]

I think a MAXIMUM nose height rule might help slow the technology creep. Say 5" or 6" MAX at RF corner.