Spring Rates (rear)

[Hodrod7]

When changing from a 10" spring to a 16" ish spring what changes would need to be made with the spring rates? (Running 175 lbs 225 lbs now)

[let-r-eat]

What's the compressed length of the 225lb spring at ride height?

[Hodrod7]

Not really sure the total compression of each spring right now. (Car is tore apart for the winter) I read on a forum page someone had, there was a way to measure compression and figure what spring you would need! Their example was something like 13" 200 lbs spring would be a 16" 100-125 lbs spring. (Using a equation they came up with to get that). Stock car driver I should forget I saw that forum page and go with what the car knows and use what I have now just taller? (Trying to get more forward bit)

[Confused?]

SCD is correct. A 200 pound spring is 200lbs/in,doesn't matter if it is five inches long or twenty inches long

[fastford]

I think your wanting more stored energy, by using a taller, weaker spring and maintaining your current ride height and spring seats. this is not hard to figure out if you know your specs for your 10 inch spring,

[Hodrod7]

Gotcha! Thanks everyone for your help!!

[Hodrod7]

Guess now the question would be... Is 16" what I should go with? Height isn't a issue, I have adjustable bucket with a 10" spring now.

[fastford]

That only comes into play if a spring is becoming unloaded like a 4 link car.

Daaa , once again , thanks for clarifying my statement with you expert knowledge....just remember, 2 can play that game.....

[Hodrod7]

More bite! Always struggled with pull off the corner! Guess I'm just going with the trend of what some of the front runners seem to be doing! Going threw the car this winter and wanted to try taller rear and softer front. (RF 1300 lf 1100 now.)

[Hodrod7]

Is that why guys are running say RF 900 and LF1000? I saw a thread were someone posted that you had a thread about spring rates! I couldn't seem to find it! Instead of me asking dumb questions is that thread still around?

[fastford]

I doubt it, Ive erased all my posts on here several times..

I would start
900/800
275/250

that's a conservative start that a lot of people have tried and liked. Spring rates can vary based on how high your motor is mounted, cell, even the cage etc. The last car I built myself everything was really high, I had to run stiffer springs in that car than my previous car.

you had a post a while back that you said you were about to retire from driving, I can see why with that 10 year old set up. theres stock cars down here on way softer springs than that and flying. it may not be a late model, but some of the modern day late model stuff works on stock cars to.

[Hodrod7]

I appreciate your help!!

[Hodrod7]

Fast ford what's your spring package?

[let-r-eat]

If the 10", 225 pound spring has an installed height of 8.5" there would be 337 pounds of preload on the spring. Going to a 150 pound spring that is 16" long would have an installed height of roughly 13.75 inches requiring 5 1/4 inches of jackbolt available to maintain the same ride height.

[fastford]

Fast ford what's your spring package?

the car that's winning a lot of races all over the south east is on a 400 lb right front with a bump stop , I know this for a fact , I don't know what rt frt shock he is on but Im sure its a high rebound shock.

[fastford]

Ha ha, good one. I thought you wanted to play a game of knowledge, not sling silly person insults?

I won all 34 of my stock car wins in the last 9 years... My 50 plus pavement wins were all 94-2002.

Not sure what down here is but Ive been south in my IMCA car a few times.

Bama Bash in Alabama Champion
Ice Bowl at Talladega Short track in Alabama, Champion
2 out of 3 mains at Abilene Ice breaker

what year did you win the ice bowl ? ive been to all of them since 1996 and would like to verify that. if it was in the late 90s or early 2000s , you guys were ahead of the street stocks down here then, however for that race the rules were bent to accommodate folks from out of town . things are a lot different DOWN HERE now. why don't you come on back with the springs you mentioned earlier and try it again? and I don't care how much you blow your own horn advertising all your wins, I will bet you will get your azz handed to you........next

[fastford]

http://www.jnjfab.com/

Heres a bama bash victory pic for you.

I won it in 2011 I think. There were no changes made for out of towners, when I won it, I ran a legal engine and a 2 barrel against their 4 barrels and added 300# to my car to make their rules.
There were cars with alum bodies against us stock body junkers.

I wont be coming down there again, I already won it and GAVE that Big Silver bowl trophy to a little kid in the stands.

I race modifieds now as you could tell by my signature under this if you had half a brain. What races have you won? You keep posting about what others are running yet nothing about yourself, lol..

I don't go to the bash, besides green valley is gone, now what year did you win the ice bowl ? and its best you don't come down here again, or that little kid will be greatly disappointed....

[fastford]

yea I remember you ,things are different now, how ever your accomplishments are a drop in the bucket as to what ive done myself and thru others over 30 plus years of racing. but im going to give you the win by default because I will not expose my personal info on an open internet forum. I have gained a lot of knowledge from this site, and yes ive learned things from you, im not ashamed to admit it, the problem I have with you is every time some one post something on here , you try to come back and belittle them with all your knowledge, don't ask me to elaborate, just look back thru your post here and in the power train section. any way , im done with this thread as it has gotten away from the OP question. you have a good day jeff joldersma.

[dirtplay18]

If you want more drive off the corner increase your cross weight. I would suggest running the rates stock car suggested, except run the 900 in the rf and 800 in the lf. I will tell you that I switched from 11" rear springs to 13" rear springs between races a few yrs ago and went from a 8th place car to a winning car. The rates were the same between the 11 and 13's but had so much more traction with the 13" I couldn't believe it. Haven't ran 11" rears since lol.

[turtle1hp]

Yes ladies and gentlemen! He has won again! He is the undisputed champion of the "Bench Racing 100"! LOL Lighten up dude.... people are on here trying to learn and share experience.... just sayin....

[outlaw4j]

ride rate check is useful anytime you want to change a spring and maintain ride height

spring rate x (free length - installed length) = ride rate

Using this if you want to go from a 250# to a 275# it will tell you how much you need to shim or jack to maintain RH

In upper Midwest (Wissota & northern tier of IMCA) there are guys fast on all different setups. Just need to not be afraid to try. There is no right or wrong answer.

[turtle1hp]

At this point I only have an opinion, so I did not offer information. However, from what I have read, raising and lowering the spring table at the frame, does have an effect on the way weight is transferred to the spring and to the tire contact patch. I hear of claims that one is better than the other, but no reason as to why.... What are the physics involved when the spring table is raised or lowered? Think about it.... How does it create more grip at the tire contact patch?

[Hodrod7]

5 days of being on this forum and I stir this up! (not a nice word)(not a nice word)(not a nice word)(not a nice word) I'm good!! Lol Thank everyone for your help! PM me if you have anything to add! Lol

[r3tracing]

yea I remember you ,things are different now, how ever your accomplishments are a drop in the bucket as to what ive done myself and thru others over 30 plus years of racing. but im going to give you the win by default because I will not expose my personal info on an open internet forum. I have gained a lot of knowledge from this site, and yes ive learned things from you, im not ashamed to admit it, the problem I have with you is every time some one post something on here , you try to come back and belittle them with all your knowledge, don't ask me to elaborate, just look back thru your post here and in the power train section. any way , im done with this thread as it has gotten away from the OP question. you have a good day jeff joldersma.

I second everything he says about your sarcastic comments and try to make everyone seem stupid compared to you. I am really glad others see you the same way.

[r3tracing]

Yes ladies and gentlemen! He has won again! He is the undisputed champion of the "Bench Racing 100"! LOL Lighten up dude.... people are on here trying to learn and share experience.... just sayin....
I agree after awhile you just ignore everything stocky has to say. The sad part is that he probably does have some useful information for some people and could help but his sarcastic smart mouth just makes you just not even want to read anything or even care about any of his posts.

[fastford]

That only comes into play if a spring is becoming unloaded like a 4 link car.

here is where a taller weaker spring comes in to play with out leaving the spring seat, lets say you have a 200# spring compressed 2 inches at ride height , that's 400# of spring pressure , now if you use a taller 100# spring , it will be compressed 4inches at the same ride height and 400 # of spring pressure. lets say your car hikes 1 1/2 inches, the 200 # spring will have 100# of spring pressure and the 100# spring will have 250# of spring pressure. so can you explain to me how it doesn't come into play?

[turtle1hp]

here is where a taller weaker spring comes in to play with out leaving the spring seat, lets say you have a 200# spring compressed 2 inches at ride height , that's 400# of spring pressure , now if you use a taller 100# spring , it will be compressed 4inches at the same ride height and 400 # of spring pressure. lets say your car hikes 1 1/2 inches, the 200 # spring will have 100# of spring pressure and the 100# spring will have 250# of spring pressure. so can you explain to me how it doesn't come into play? I agree with fastford on this point. The car sitting on scales shows "static" wedge, this changes as the car moves and suspension travels. Running the softer spring rates changes the "dynamic" wedge during weight transfer and suspension travels. I would only change to a taller spring, if I were changing to a softer spring and I was concerned about coil binding during suspension travel. But this is only my opinion.

[powerslide]

I agree after awhile you just ignore everything stocky has to say. The sad part is that he probably does have some useful information for some people and could help but his sarcastic smart mouth just makes you just not even want to read anything or even care about any of his posts.

Its a pretty simple fix.

[dxtc]

Tried the 20 inch soft left rear spring in an IMCA stock car. Good when tacky. Absolutely no forward drive when slick..