Wild West Shootout 2017

[formercrewguy]

The Jan. races in Arizona are doing away with the passing points system. The $250,000 bonus is still in play also. Should be a great series! DoD will again be doing a PPV I think.

[huskerdirt]

I don't like it. We already have too many time trial races. There are no series points involved with Tucson. It's the defacto dirt late model spring training before the season. It's ok to have something that doesn't fall in line with everything else.

However I didn't like the point system Tucson used. It was nothing like what the MLRA used. Under the MLRA system Davenport wouldn't have been starting 14th after the winning the heat from the pole. He would've been around 5th or 6th at worst. Going 8th to 5th in a heat shouldn't carry more weight than winning from the pole.... That guy is fuked everytime.

[GEAR_HEAD]

Going to qualifying is really lame. This will reduce the appeal of this event for most race fans. What do people have against passing cars? The sport is called racing, not qualifying. If the drivers don't like passing cars then they should go drag racing.

[formercrewguy]

Many of the drivers, Moyer, Clanton, and many others voiced their disdain for using the passing points system. I'm glad they are going to qualifying this time. Fast cars at the front in the mains will make for some great racing.

[NormP]

It's not surprising that Moyer and Clanton would whine about it.

[formercrewguy]

Format Change tabbed for Wild West Shootout

Robert Holman PHOENIX, Ariz. (August 8, 2016) The Keyser Manufacturing Wild West Shootout has already attracted some of the biggest names in dirt Late Model racing. Now miniseries promoters Chris Kearns and Kevin Montgomery hope to keep those same big name drivers — and others — flocking to the Arizona desert each January.

As he continues to promote the Wild West Shootout as a must-see event, Kearns is making changes to make the mid-winter meet that’s moving to Phoenix-area Arizona Speedway more attractive to racers.

For the first time in its history, Late Model drivers at the Wild West Shootout will qualify for their heat race starting position and then race for their respective starting spot on the feature grid rather than use a passing points system.

Last year it was dollar signs that grabbed headlines, as an increase in purse money and the creation of the Keyser Manufacturing Quarter-Million Challenge made a trip to the desert seem every bit as fun as panning for gold.

When Kearns announced that title sponsor Keyser Manufacturing was offering up a bonus program that would pay a driver $250,000 if he managed to sweep all six nights of the miniseries, drivers took notice. And if no driver managed to get out the broom, no worries, an added incentive provided a $100,000 bonus for winning five of the six features and a $50,000 bonus for capturing four main events.

Jonathan Davenport came oh so close to collecting the $50,000 bonus by winning half of the six features during his nine-day stay in Arizona.

While Kearns recently announced that Keyser is back on board and the bonus money is still in place, he continues tweaking Arizona's long-running Super Late Model event.

Kearns hopes his latest change will put his event in line with similar formats used in the sport’s two national touring series. Knowing that the week-long average of 57 entrants per night during the 2016 event set the bar high, Kearns hopes scrapping the passing-points system will attract some drivers who have stayed away.

“I think it’ll bring in more national stars going to the qualifying format. It seems to be more along the lines of what they’re used to,” he said. “No racer has ever told me they were definitely going to come because we were doing passing points, but I’ve had some racers tell us they weren’t coming if it wasn’t qualifying, especially the big name drivers. We’ve gotten to a point where there’s a lot of big-name drivers coming out here, so it felt like the right thing to do.”

The passing-points format awards more points to drivers who pass more cars in their heat race, relative to starting position. In a sense, it allowed drivers to determine their own destiny. But drivers winning from the pole of a heat often don’t have the best chance of a front-row starting spot in the feature.

Though fans may love the action, many drivers balk at the mention of an event based on passing points. Unlike some of the other big-money races that have adopted a passing-points format recently — like the Silver Dollar Nationals at I-80 Speedway, the North-South 100 at Florence Speedway and most recently the 2015 Dirt Track World Championship — the Wild West Shootout is six completely separate one-night events.

“I think it’s considerably better,” said second-generation Batesville, Arkansas driver Billy Moyer Jr. “Chris (Kearns), Kevin (Montgomery), and I think (DirtonDirt.com’s Michael) Rigsby there with the pay-per-view … I think they know what’s going on.
“In my opinion, there are too many good cars out there for passing points. They have a good thing out there. They keep bumping the purse up and I think Chris is really about the racers. I think there a lot of promoters out there who aren’t.”

Moyer added that because of the continued growth of the six-race miniseries, scrapping the passing points system in favor of qualifying was simply the right thing to do.

“There are just too many good cars out there now for passing points,” said Moyer, who recorded two top-10s and a best finish of fourth in four feature starts during this year’s WWS. “You go back four years ago when there were seven good cars out there … and I’m not knocking anybody … but now you have (Moyer’s Hall of Fame father, Billy Moyer) and (Shane) Clanton and (Jimmy) Mars. You have (Terry) Phillips, (Don) O’Neal, (Steve) Francis, (Darrell) Lanigan and myself. There’s 14 for 15 that can win the race.

“Five years ago there were four or five good cars and then four or five more who could win as well. Now, when you get in that stacked heat race and you run your balls off to get to fifth from ninth and you’re still in the B-main, it’s tough. When you qualify, you hold your own fate. I have qualified good and pushed and finished last, and that’s my own fault.

“Kevin and Chris … I really appreciate them. I think Clanton was pretty outspoken about this as well. I appreciate them for listening.”

In the last two years — a span of 12 races — the Wild West Shootout has seen five different winners, with Davenport, of Blairsville, Ga., and Darrel Lanigan, of Union, Ky., winning three apiece. Indiana native Don O’Neal and Tennessean Jimmy Owens have two victories each, while Tony Jackson Jr., Lebanon, Mo., and Rodney Sanders of Happy, Texas, each have one win.

Sanders is no stranger to passing points. Racing both a Late Model and an open-wheel modified, the 26-year-old driver comes across a number of qualifying formats and has to adjust likewise.

“Almost everywhere we go with the mod, it’s passing points,” said Sanders. “With them it seems like you may can get by with it a little more. It seems like you can move around a little more with them than you can the Late Model. I wish they would do (time trials) with the mods.

“I do think (time trials) is better, just because if you are fast you are kind of rewarded. If you qualify bad, that’s kind of your (own fault). It just seems like there isn’t as much work involved.”

Sanders pulled double duty during the 2016 Wild West Shootout. In his Late Model, he was fast enough to race his way into the show all six nights, recording three top-10 finishes along the way. His best finish was a seventh-place on the fourth night of action. In four nights of running his modified, Sanders notched a pair of runner-up finishes.

When it comes to putting on a show for the fans, both Moyer and Sanders are in agreement.

“I do have to say this. Some of the fans like the passing points, and we have to put on a show for the fans,” Moyer said. “But I think they will like to see the best six cars starting in the front three rows and duking it out. Now I feel like that’s what they’ll get to see. I think the fans will see a good show.”

Sanders echoed Moyer.
“I kinda agree with that,” Sanders said. “A lot of times you may have the fast guys up front. I think you would rather have them up front putting on a good race than have maybe just one or two guys coming from the back.”

It’s hard to top an event that averaged nearly 60 cars each night and continues to pick up steam, but Kearns is always eyeing improvement. From the addition of the Keyser Manufacturing Quarter-Million Challenge last year, to the move to a more stable facility this year, and even the switch from passing points to qualifying, Kearns and Montgomery are doing what they can to enhance the experience both on and off the track.

“I think now, with Kevin and I promoting it and the stability we’re trying to bring to it, I definitely think it will continue to grow,” Kearns said. “We’re expecting it to be even bigger. Most of the drivers that came out this year have told us they plan to come back, and we’re expecting some others to join them. We expect another great turnout.
“We’re going to keep doing our best to do things right and make it better each year.”

The 2017 Keyser Manufacturing Wild West Shootout kicks off Jan. 7 with the next two events Jan. 8 and Jan. 11. The miniseries finishes with three straight nights of action Jan. 13-15, leaving a handful of off days in between for drivers and fans alike to take in the sites or recharge their batteries. For more information, visit <www.wildwestshootout.net>.

[153J]

what needs fixed is the gap in dates

[GEAR_HEAD]

Many of the drivers, Moyer, Clanton, and many others voiced their disdain for using the passing points system. I'm glad they are going to qualifying this time. Fast cars at the front in the mains will make for some great racing.

That may be the dumbest thing I've ever read on here. Starting the fast cars up front creates freight train racing. When the cars start out sorted from fastest to slowest how is there going to be any passing? You don't seem to know how racing works. Stay with pill draw and let the wussbags stay home! The fans and drivers should both get a vote. The promoters are basically saying screw the fans.

[Barbecueboy]

It's not surprising that Moyer and Clanton would whine about it.

I didn't think it would be long at all before somebody brought this up......

[grt74]

i thought it has always been a great deal but now with all the heat that went out there last year i think it will run some off

[Barbecueboy]

guys like to get out of the snow and cold..........I think it will be good out there this year, curious to see how the different venue works out.

Would be a cool vacation to take.

[NormP]

I didn't think it would be long at all before somebody brought this up......

It's the truth though, ain't it?

[SLIDING SIDEWAYS]

To dam far to go to get screwed over no matter how cold it is here!

[dirtdobber45]

To dam far to go to get screwed over no matter how cold it is here!What are you talking? All that great racing and look at all that money you would be making with all those truck stops between your house and Tuscon....BONUS!!! LMAO

[flagone]

Just a little note of clarification. The time trials will be hot lap time trials. Meaning no extra laps involved. Secondly it will be in groups meaning that they pill draw and then are broken into equal groups that time trial and heat race within that group which means there could be a really stacked heat race here and there and vice versa. There will still be plenty of passing and there will still be "faster cars" not up front. If the overall fast qualifier comes in group 6 they will still start 6th of they win their heat.

[old fan]

why do you think open wheel racing is so popular yep you start the fast guys toward the back

[GEAR_HEAD]

Just a little note of clarification. The time trials will be hot lap time trials. Meaning no extra laps involved. Secondly it will be in groups meaning that they pill draw and then are broken into equal groups that time trial and heat race within that group which means there could be a really stacked heat race here and there and vice versa. There will still be plenty of passing and there will still be "faster cars" not up front. If the overall fast qualifier comes in group 6 they will still start 6th of they win their heat.

It's still a joke that nobody asks the fans what they want to see. Without the fans those whining drivers wouldn't be able to go out there and have fun. By forgetting about the fans like these promoters are it doesn't matter if 200 cars show up, if no fans show up it won't be a success. I'd rather Clanton and Jr Jr stay home and watch real racers like Shaw, Gustin, Moriarty, etc RACE to earn their feature spots. This event doesn't need the whiners.

[Bubstr]

The fans do have a voice. I exercised mine this morning and canceled my reservations. Not going to travel 2K miles to see a train race on a unknown track, even if it's warm. I wasn't completely sold on their type of passing points, as it wasn't the same as I80, Florance or Knoxville, but it was better than a train race.

[dalemcfan]

Why can't they do three nights with the passing points format and three nights with qualifying format so the fans are happy at least half the time and the drivers are happy half the time?

[waaac77]

Do you really actually think by tweaking the format a bit this way that it's going to guarantee a train? Even enough to make you return your tickets??? Wow. Sounds to me like the fans are the whiners here

[victorylane]

well the crybabies that claim to be racers but don't want to have to pass cars got their way. this is total BS but I guess what the sport has come to. Promoters listening to the few big dollar guys crying about having to pass cars. I will spend my money at tracks that try to cater to the fans and all teams not just the few that feel we are to bow down when they pull into the track. For BM jr to say that the fans want to see the fasted six cars in the front is ridiculous along with him putting himself up on a pedestal with the other fast guys( laughable).

[flagone]

The racing won't be any different. This format was used for the majority of the event back in 2014 and the racing was still excellent and fans saw no differences then in the racing action.

And I think promoters have to listen to both fans AND drivers. To your point about fans not showing up the same can be said about drivers. Why not give it a chance and see how it goes before condemning it? If at the end of the event you have seen a significant difference then say your piece. But to bash something that you don't know what the outcome will be is wrong.

And as far as "train races" I have been to just as many shows with no passing that featured an invert as I have with those that started straight up. The difference has always been how well the track is prepared and how well it races. Arizona Raceway is widely known for good side by side racing. Today's cars are very equal and just because a guy lays down a single good lap doesn't mean he can string them together for a heat or a feature with changing track conditions.

The group format also adds sort of a backdoor invert as well. Say the top 7 fastest guys are in the 4th group. That means the 8th fastest guy could be in group 3 and 9th in group 1. So that 9th fastest guy, if he wins the first heat, still starts on the pole of the feature. There is no way that one car from each group will be 1 through 6 in qualifying. It mixes the "faster cars" in more and can put the "not as fast cars" starting up front. It also brings more emphasis to passing in the feature rather than the heats. The heats don't pay anything. Not to say there won't be passing in the heats because there will be. But I would think that most fans want the majority of the passing to happen when the money is on the line. This is a similar format that is used on Summer Nats and it seems to work pretty well there. I think that shows the key is starting with a racy track.

[Bubstr]

As for me, I'll wait and see just how racy this track is, before I spend all that money on traveling and motels or taking a camper.

Before Florence went to passing points, I had no wish to go see it. It's about bang for the buck. WW Shoot out just decreased their odds of going boom. When they get in competition with these race of the year tracks, I'll reconsider.

A draw for group qualifying isn't the most fair way to qualify. As I've seen at times, when a lot of fast cars draw into one group. It makes it hard for them to get in and allows some slower cars to make it. Especially if they are early heats, and the track is heavy. Then, even if you do qualify threw the B Mains, your in a hole, you can't climb out of, unless it's a 100 lap race.

As I see it, double heat passing points is the way of the future, on good or bad tracks. If they are too bad, nothing will help them.

[dirtdobber45]

I like it. I dont want to see some slow or inexperienced driver up front holding up or spinning out and taken out half the field thats just dumb. Yall sitting here b¡tching over the format when its all on how the track is prepped. And a 'real racer' are the ones that are busting their b@lls working on their cars day and night. And if they come out to a show turn the fastest time in qualifing they should be rewarded by being on the pole for the heat or A main not stuck in mid pack.

[Bubstr]

That would be fine, if it was called qualifying, but it's called racing.

[NormP]

Yall sitting here bitching over how its more fair to qualify and how you don't like passing points, when it's all about the racing. Like Bubstr said, it's called racing, not qualifying.

The real racer is the one that is excited to get on the track and race, not have a front row spot gifted to him because he was able to be fast without any other cars on the track.

[dirtdobber45]

Yall sitting here bitching over how its more fair to qualify and how you don't like passing points, when it's all about the racing. Like Bubstr said, it's called racing, not qualifying.The real racer is the one that is excited to get on the track and race, not have a front row spot gifted to him because he was able to be fast without any other cars on the track.So what are heat races? Arent they the real racing? To battle for a spot into the main? Sounds to like your want a demolition derby. And how is it that a gift if you work your a$$ off night and day to better yourself and your car?

[dirtdobber45]

First it was heat races introduced to racing now passing points whats next? Whine whine whine

[SLIDING SIDEWAYS]

First it was heat races introduced to racing now passing points whats next? Whine whine whine

Going to start working the trk stops. Sounds like fun. You want to join in? I need a lil monkey to pop out of the box and had you in mind. Well split 50/50. Think about it

Hope you husband/ partner wont mind. I think w your skills and knowledge we could do good.
If you dont like the monkey in the box deal as you might be closterphobic, we could have you on my sholder tipping a hat?

[flagone]

Can this just stay a discussion about racing and not spiral into a pi$$ing match that is continued in every thread? Grow up a little guys.

Our society as a whole has become nothing but people looking for a reason to complain. I don't stay home from a restaurant because I am not sure about the way they cook the food. I go and evaluate the food for itself. So wait and evaluate the racing. You and I have no idea that the changes will make the racing any worse or any better so why not give it the benefit of the doubt and support racing.

I am not one of those guys who says you shouldn't have an opinion or complain when something needs to be improved. I don't think our sport is killed by by deserved criticism. But this racing hasn't even happened yet. If it happens and it sucks or is "train racing" then by all means complain. But until then give it a shot. Are you a race fan or a format fan. Because as a race fan I don't give 2 pinto beans about the format as long as the racers are able to race.

[SLIDING SIDEWAYS]

Can this just stay a discussion about racing and not spiral into a pi$$ing match that is continued in every thread? Grow up a little guys.

Our society as a whole has become nothing but people looking for a reason to complain. I don't stay home from a restaurant because I am not sure about the way they cook the food. I go and evaluate the food for itself. So wait and evaluate the racing. You and I have no idea that the changes will make the racing any worse or any better so why not give it the benefit of the doubt and support racing.

I am not one of those guys who says you shouldn't have an opinion or complain when something needs to be improved. I don't think our sport is killed by by deserved criticism. But this racing hasn't even happened yet. If it happens and it sucks or is "train racing" then by all means complain. But until then give it a shot. Are you a race fan or a format fan. Because as a race fan I don't give 2 pinto beans about the format as long as the racers are able to race.


Lol sorry

I wouldnt travel all that way to get screwed again. I will stay home in the cold

[GEAR_HEAD]

Can this just stay a discussion about racing and not spiral into a pi$$ing match that is continued in every thread? Grow up a little guys.

Our society as a whole has become nothing but people looking for a reason to complain. I don't stay home from a restaurant because I am not sure about the way they cook the food. I go and evaluate the food for itself. So wait and evaluate the racing. You and I have no idea that the changes will make the racing any worse or any better so why not give it the benefit of the doubt and support racing.

I am not one of those guys who says you shouldn't have an opinion or complain when something needs to be improved. I don't think our sport is killed by by deserved criticism. But this racing hasn't even happened yet. If it happens and it sucks or is "train racing" then by all means complain. But until then give it a shot. Are you a race fan or a format fan. Because as a race fan I don't give 2 pinto beans about the format as long as the racers are able to race.

Because whining drivers are ruining the sport. They get their way when they whine, why shouldn't the fans get their way when they whine? Why is it OK for the drivers to complain but not the fans?

[Barbecueboy]

Can this just stay a discussion about racing and not spiral into a pi$$ing match that is continued in every thread? Grow up a little guys.

Our society as a whole has become nothing but people looking for a reason to complain. I don't stay home from a restaurant because I am not sure about the way they cook the food. I go and evaluate the food for itself. So wait and evaluate the racing. You and I have no idea that the changes will make the racing any worse or any better so why not give it the benefit of the doubt and support racing.

I am not one of those guys who says you shouldn't have an opinion or complain when something needs to be improved. I don't think our sport is killed by by deserved criticism. But this racing hasn't even happened yet. If it happens and it sucks or is "train racing" then by all means complain. But until then give it a shot. Are you a race fan or a format fan. Because as a race fan I don't give 2 pinto beans about the format as long as the racers are able to race.

Do y'all need a cook out there? I don't take up much room.

And can cook the hell out of a pot of pinto beans.

[Bubstr]

First it was heat races introduced to racing now passing points whats next? Whine whine whine

I don't know where you are but in my part of the country, it's always been heat races and if you look back to the 50s 60s it was total invert of the feature race. The Time trial to race the A main comes from the south. Up here we don't care how fast your race car is, we care how fast you can race your car.

[NormP]

So what are heat races? Arent they the real racing? To battle for a spot into the main? Sounds to like your want a demolition derby. And how is it that a gift if you work your a$$ off night and day to better yourself and your car?

If it sounds to you like I want a demolition derby, it's because you have the reading comprehension of a 5 year old. All I did was apply your logic to my side of the debate.

[tb1545]

The squeaky wheel gets the grease. Meanwhile the the "field fillers" are now wondering if it's worth making the trip. If luck of the draw might get you a front row heat start 1 out of 6 nights and you have the heat race of your life and make the show once, it's worth taking that shot and driving there for that memory. Now those stories and chances for the David vs Goliath moments are a lot more slim.

[fryefan]

They may get more of the guys who outspend the average driver, but this could lead to lower car counts overall. I was looking forward to going out there sometime, but I certainly less likely to go that far for the freight-train format that they are changing to.

[dirtdobber45]

Yep Im from the south. And we have heats at the tracks I go to and Ive watched a many 'davids' make right into the main cause the 'big boys' up front take each other out..thats racing. Yall talk about racing your way in then the 'davids' need to get up on that wheel and do that instead of whining and wanting a hand out.

[Bubstr]

Yep Im from the south. And we have heats at the tracks I go to and Ive watched a many 'davids' make right into the main cause the 'big boys' up front take each other out..thats racing. Yall talk about racing your way in then the 'davids' need to get up on that wheel and do that instead of whining and wanting a hand out.

I have not seen one driver complaining about the format here. We have a report that one said he would not come if the passing point format stayed in place. The fans are the ones that want the passing point format and I believe they want it with or with out a couple drivers. I don't think anyone expects a David and Goliath moment, with or with out a good format. The cream comes to the top most of the time. It's just the entertainment getting there that makes the difference.

Don't give us the work hard to qualify well story. It usually comes down to a spread bore engine that can only be opened up when the track is heavy. Out side of 2, Hill and Rumley, who builds their own engines? The rest worked hard and bought them. Quite possibly, passing point format could be a cost saver for LMs. One thing for sure, it doesn't create a one groove track from time trials running the same line, time after time.

[dirtdobber45]

How are you saving money if your having to fix a tore up race car cause some idiot that is a 'field filler' gets lucky draw and is in front and just gets in the way and causes a massive wreck? FYI its not all about the motor. Its the setup too. So if your checking shocks springs and such hows that not hard work? Plus its up to the track to keep the tracked prepped. If they dont then it really dont matter who is where because it will be a train race as you say

[dirtdobber45]

I bet yall like the format NASCRAP has now. Instead of rewarding the most consistent driver the title now its a 'playoff'...what a fukn joke.

[dirtdobber45]

If it sounds to you like I want a demolition derby, it's because you have the reading comprehension of a 5 year old. All I did was apply your logic to my side of the debate.And you hun sound like a little school girl who cant get their way. Its ok princess better luck next time

[GEAR_HEAD]

How are you saving money if your having to fix a tore up race car cause some idiot that is a 'field filler' gets lucky draw and is in front and just gets in the way and causes a massive wreck?

That rarely ever happens so it's not a valid reason to not use passing points.

[Bubstr]

The one good thing is, They told everyone up front about the change in format. It wasn't a deal where you find out about it, after you get there. Thank you for that.

[GEAR_HEAD]

The one good thing is, They told everyone up front about the change in format. It wasn't a deal where you find out about it, after you get there. Thank you for that.

The NDRL did that to me when I went out there a few years ago. I went out there because of the passing points and Moyer whined so they changed the format and screwed the fans.

[Aluminium Block]

Tracks and series caving in to the whining demands of big name drivers has absolutely ruined dirt late model racing. Look at the results and the high majority of the winners are coming from the front with little or no passing. Who wants to spend money on gas, tickets etc to see THAT? There are a lot more entertaining options out there and people are doing them! Did the (poor) promoters of this event not pay attention to what is going on in Florence this weekend? They converted their event to passing points, with rave reviews and hardly a place to sit in the bleachers now! I-80 crowd is huge enough that they are increasing the purse big time next year. DTWC was practically sold out last year. THAT is what the fans want to see. Pay the money and the whiny drivers will still come. But caving in to their cry baby fits just eventually leads to less fans interested in the sport.

[GEAR_HEAD]

Tracks and series caving in to the whining demands of big name drivers has absolutely ruined dirt late model racing. Look at the results and the high majority of the winners are coming from the front with little or no passing. Who wants to spend money on gas, tickets etc to see THAT? There are a lot more entertaining options out there and people are doing them! Did the (poor) promoters of this event not pay attention to what is going on in Florence this weekend? They converted their event to passing points, with rave reviews and hardly a place to sit in the bleachers now! I-80 crowd is huge enough that they are increasing the purse big time next year. DTWC was practically sold out last year. THAT is what the fans want to see. Pay the money and the whiny drivers will still come. But caving in to their cry baby fits just eventually leads to less fans interested in the sport.

But according to folks involved in the sport like Carlton it's OK for the drivers to whine about the passing points before they even try it at the new track, but it's not OK for us to whine about the lame format before it happens. Where did this double standard come from? It doesn't make sense to drive away hundreds of fans so that Clanton will show up. Who cares about Clanton?

[formercrewguy]

Who cares about Clanton?

Mrs. Clanton?

[Bubstr]

The NDRL did that to me when I went out there a few years ago. I went out there because of the passing points and Moyer whined so they changed the format and screwed the fans.

That is exactly what I was implying. I believe they ran two days of passing points then changed it. Do you want to tell the good people here, what happened to the passing after the change? LOL Same track, same drivers and same year.

[GEAR_HEAD]

That is exactly what I was implying. I believe they ran two days of passing points then changed it. Do you want to tell the good people here, what happened to the passing after the change? LOL Same track, same drivers and same year.

The night of passing points 3 of the heats were won by the last place starter. The following nights the heats were freight trains.