Max Aero, Return of the wedge!

[Dirtfan04]

Increadible photos showing how much aero tech is involved with these cars. Photo of 116 is unbelievable.

http://www.4m.net/atta


http://www.4m.net/attachment.php?attachmentid=57074&d=1487043991chment.php?attachmentid=57073&d=1487043975

[Dirtfan04]

Increadible photos showing how much aero tech is involved with these cars. Photo of 116 is unbelievable.

http://www.4m.net/atta


http://www.4m.net/attachment.php?attachmentid=57074&d=1487043991chment.php?attachmentid=57073&d=1487043975

16684120_1892536134328167_1677526825348169693_n

[ptown]

Awesome picture.

[GEAR_HEAD]

The body rules need to be reeled back in. Make the cars more square like they used to be and slow them down to make the racing better. Somebody is going to have to step in like UMP did after the wedge cars.

[musolino21]

I agree slmcrewchief

[Tireguy17]

Its good that the Dirt Late Model Council adopted new safety rules for 2017, but they should have done something about the aero stuff as well. Maybe it would create better racing, maybe it wouldn't, but reign the body rules in.

[RayCook53fan]

Call me new age, but I think DLM look better than ever. I love the rounded sides back to the quarter panel. Like Mark Martin said in an interview, DLM are the most "sexy" race car out today. I agree completely. I've been going to late model races for 25 years and the cars of today are my favorite ever. And all the griping about the racing being bad... just because the track at GIS was junk (I was there, in person) why are we blaming the cars? Did y'all already forget all the other great close races from the last few years? Heck even last year at GIS?

[Bubstr]

I contend removing Areo advantage, will make all the cars more the same speed. If you like passing, it's a bad rule. If you like innovation, it's a bad rule. It ties the hands of the innovators and promotes one lane racing. Same car, equal the same results, equal train races. You hear bad air and can't pass. Change the rule and you won't get the bite to even get the run to pass.

If we want one good rule, we should ask for tracks to have multi grooves. Make the track illegal if they don't. I know this sounds crazy, but if racers can find ways to win on non passing tracks, tracks should be able to find a way to have that track that you can pass on. It would even benefit them in fan count.

[RCJ]

How's all those rules working out for Napcar?''Run what you brung and hope you brung enough''Has always been like a badge of honor for me.

[IZZOJR16]

The body rules need to be reeled back in. Make the cars more square like they used to be and slow them down to make the racing better. Somebody is going to have to step in like UMP did after the wedge cars. agreed! these cars are turning into missiles. a lot of upside cars last year.

[Stede Bonnet]

Its good that the Dirt Late Model Council adopted new safety rules for 2017, but they should have done something about the aero stuff as well. Maybe it would create better racing, maybe it wouldn't, but reign the body rules in.

They have body rules??? I thought when they handed the controls over to the nose guy to do whatever he wanted, that they no longer wished to have body rules.

[Dirtfan04]

Call me new age, but I think DLM look better than ever. I love the rounded sides back to the quarter panel. Like Mark Martin said in an interview, DLM are the most "sexy" race car out today. I agree completely. I've been going to late model races for 25 years and the cars of today are my favorite ever. And all the griping about the racing being bad... just because the track at GIS was junk (I was there, in person) why are we blaming the cars? Did y'all already forget all the other great close races from the last few years? Heck even last year at GIS?

I agree. I love the way this current generation of dirt late models look. In my opinion, they are not only the best looking dirt late models we have ever had, they are the best looking race cars in the country period.
I love the technology side of the sport. This run what you brung division is what seperates it from all the others in my opinion. The last thing we need is for the "rule makers" to turn dirt late models into the next NASCAR COT. We all remember how hideous that thing was. The horrible looks of it alone drove many fans away from that form of racing.

[RayCook53fan]

Don't understand why folks think example B looks better than example A.

[a25rjr]

Don't understand why folks think example B looks better than example A.

I agree 100%.....I choose Door #1!

Run what ya brung, if ya get beat, bring more next week!

They were originally called "outlaws" for a reason! Theres always the hobby stock class!

[Illtsate32]

The deck is about level with Overtons sternum wow...except on left side where its dished up 8-10 inches...

[CIRF]

I say bring back the wedge and let 'em put the 6' side boards and the huge spoilers on them. Let's get 'em pinned to the track in such a way that the engines will cost $80 grand and owners will only want to race on 1/4 mile or smaller tracks. Decrease the weight requirements down to 1500 lbs. and watch 'em GO!

Today's generic dirt late model is way over the top anyway. They allow them to lay way over on the right side. The right front wheel and tire has to be 8 to 10 inches further to the right than the right rear. More than 1/2 the left rear wheel disappears ahead of the wheel well opening under full acceleration and they allow them to have different wheelbase measurements from one side to the other. The more exotic the better!!

[Highside Hustler25]

Call me new age, but I think DLM look better than ever. I love the rounded sides back to the quarter panel. Like Mark Martin said in an interview, DLM are the most "sexy" race car out today. I agree completely. I've been going to late model races for 25 years and the cars of today are my favorite ever. And all the griping about the racing being bad... just because the track at GIS was junk (I was there, in person) why are we blaming the cars? Did y'all already forget all the other great close races from the last few years? Heck even last year at GIS?

What a great post ! It's all about track prep and configuration. It has been quite a while since I've witnessed a race like the one at GIS. I've seen races where the top or bottom might be a little more dominate than the other but the overall racing is good.
And I agree with M.M., they are sexy. That pick of Overton is no different than the picks of Richards last year, Davenport the year before. These pictures are taken at the perfect moment and angle that they really show the pitch of the car. Pretty cool but they've been this way for a while. I say leave it be.

[COKEandaSMILE]

When the drivers talk about aero push, it's an issue. What more do you need to know?

[Hoosier_Dirt]

I keep hearing multigroove tracks. Watch the lates..they will run the same line lap after lap after lap, then it turns 1 groove. I'd change the nose pieces, the right front deal would no longer be able to tuck up under the fender, make to where there cars aren't glued to the track.

[dirtdobber45]

Makem go back to wedge noses. Maybe an inch lip on BOTH sides...max.

[Josh Bayko]

I keep hearing multigroove tracks. Watch the lates..they will run the same line lap after lap after lap, then it turns 1 groove. I'd change the nose pieces, the right front deal would no longer be able to tuck up under the fender, make to where there cars aren't glued to the track.

I've seen plenty of races over the last few years where the cars were "glued to the track" that had passing and more than one groove.

[Stede Bonnet]

Goodbye, Dirt Super Late Model

It was great while it lasted and you will be missed. You died from perversion, apathy, greed and ineptitude. Sadly it came about because those who don't know their history are always doomed to repeat it and they did. This is, a most corrupt, self centered, narcissistic and perverse generation, so sure of their own superiority, tech savvy and awesomeness... Killed by the, "Baby on board" crowd, run over by the, "Oooh, let me get a selfie" bunch.

Bon Voyage'

[stock car driver]

http://www.msn.com/en-us/autos/classic-cars/the-yenko-1-a-top-gun-1970-camaro-dirt-late-model/ar-AAmWPYn?li=BBnb4R5

Click the link, thats a good looking late model.

Flat sided bodies are not good looking cars, modifieds and late models are not good looking cars they are all the same.

[RayCook53fan]

Goodbye, Dirt Super Late Model

It was great while it lasted and you will be missed. You died from perversion, apathy, greed and ineptitude. Sadly it came about because those who don't know their history are always doomed to repeat it and they did. This is, a most corrupt, self centered, narcissistic and perverse generation, so sure of their own superiority, tech savvy and awesomeness... Killed by the, "Baby on board" crowd, run over by the, "Oooh, let me get a selfie" bunch.

Bon Voyage'


This is the dumbest post I have read today, and that's really saying something.

[Josh Bayko]

Goodbye, Dirt Super Late Model

It was great while it lasted and you will be missed. You died from perversion, apathy, greed and ineptitude. Sadly it came about because those who don't know their history are always doomed to repeat it and they did. This is, a most corrupt, self centered, narcissistic and perverse generation, so sure of their own superiority, tech savvy and awesomeness... Killed by the, "Baby on board" crowd, run over by the, "Oooh, let me get a selfie" bunch.

Bon Voyage'


You whine about rules, you whine about no rules. Your points would make more sense if you weren't such a hypocrite.

[Stede Bonnet]

"Alas, poor Yorick! I knew him well."

I've taken the same stance all along, already plenty of rules exist, no need for new ones. Selective enforcement has led to outlandish looking cars and increased expense and favoritism. So where is my hypocrisy? Enforce the rules you have equally and consistently.

[RayCook53fan]

"Alas, poor Yorick! I knew him well."

I've taken the same stance all along, already plenty of rules exist, no need for new ones. Selective enforcement has led to outlandish looking cars and increased expense and favoritism. So where is my hypocrisy? Enforce the rules you have equally and consistently.


If you hate the "outlandish" cars so bad, why do you care if the have rules or don't? Why don't you just watch old videos from pre-1982? because I'm 100% certain the last 35 years the cars classified as "dirt late models" have looked outlandish in their own ways. Do you want to see a stripped out, souped up 2017 Ford Mustang or Taurus, or a brand new Chevy Camaro or Malibu going around a dirt track as a dirt late model? This isn't 1978. Don't get me wrong I love seeing races and cars and photos from back then, all the way through today. But times change. Freddy Smith's 1983 wedge car didn't look like Charlie Hughes 1978 Camaro, nor did Scott Bloomquists 1998 Warrior look like Scott Bloomquists 1991 Mastersbilt, you get the picture. Times change. I think the cars from the late 90s and early 2000s were the ugliest DLM in history. I personally LOVE the early 90s semi wedge cars, and cars of the last 5-7 years or so. But that's simply my opinion, just like you seem to hate the DLM of today.

[rickybrown1952]

16684120_1892536134328167_1677526825348169693_nWow is that really legal?

[Tireguy17]

I don't think anyone, like myself, who think the body rules need some work, are stating to turn the dial back 15 years. Fix the deck height/slope issues, the out of control nose/front fenders, and fill in the rear posts. The doors and rear quarters are fine. What they are doing with the suspension these days, pinning the RF and hiking the LR up all around the track, makes that deck sloping a big down force/traction gain. They aren't doing it for looks!

Theres a reason no one has filled in rear roof posts anymore, its all about getting air to the spoiler for traction.

I for one am tired of hearing the 2 main excuses for losing being "The winner had clean air and I missed the tire compound."

[Bubstr]

When the drivers talk about aero push, it's an issue. What more do you need to know?

It isn't a issue that will be fixed by a rule. If there is more than one lane on the race track, they seem to pass. These discussions come up, right after stinker races like GIS had. Was that Areo or just a bad track? I don't care what Areo rules you put in place, you can't make a silk purse out of a sows ear. If these tracks put the time effort and thought into making a great race track, like the teams do for racing on it, there wouldn't be a problem.

[Stede Bonnet]

If you hate the "outlandish" cars so bad, why do you care if the have rules or don't? Why don't you just watch old videos from pre-1982? because I'm 100% certain the last 35 years the cars classified as "dirt late models" have looked outlandish in their own ways. Do you want to see a stripped out, souped up 2017 Ford Mustang or Taurus, or a brand new Chevy Camaro or Malibu going around a dirt track as a dirt late model? This isn't 1978. Don't get me wrong I love seeing races and cars and photos from back then, all the way through today. But times change. Freddy Smith's 1983 wedge car didn't look like Charlie Hughes 1978 Camaro, nor did Scott Bloomquists 1998 Warrior look like Scott Bloomquists 1991 Mastersbilt, you get the picture. Times change. I think the cars from the late 90s and early 2000s were the ugliest DLM in history. I personally LOVE the early 90s semi wedge cars, and cars of the last 5-7 years or so. But that's simply my opinion, just like you seem to hate the DLM of today.
Spoken like a true liberal, "don't speak unless you agree with me." One day, Sonny you'll understand why letting the aero stuff take such a dominant roll and lackadaisical rules enforcement is such a bad thing. Letting things slide, that's how crates came about. Wedge cars were outlawed because it was driving engine costs thru the roof. Sound familiar? You want to take pot shots at me, hurl insults, that's fine, but you don't know me, or maybe you do and you just don't realize it... Later.

[RRRKKK]

The best rules are no rules

[RayCook53fan]

Spoken like a true liberal, "don't speak unless you agree with me." One day, Sonny you'll understand why letting the aero stuff take such a dominant roll and lackadaisical rules enforcement is such a bad thing. Letting things slide, that's how crates came about. Wedge cars were outlawed because it was driving engine costs thru the roof. Sound familiar? You want to take pot shots at me, hurl insults, that's fine, but you don't know me, or maybe you do and you just don't realize it... Later.


I sir am most definitely not a liberal. All I am saying is that things change. Intelligent individuals have determined multiple ways whether it be aero/shocks etc to make these cars faster, why stop innovation? As far as the aero goes, no matter how you bend it (or don't bend it) a sheet of aluminum costs the same amount. At my home track I've watched for years the guys with spec motors (Ronnie Johnson in particular) beat up on the guys with the 400+ CI all aluminum engine (Chris Madden in particular) Because he got the power to the ground. I know a lot of these people personally. I talked to Skip Arp last fall at a race about his shock behind innovation in 1998. That was a HUGE innovation for our sport, it made the cars faster. Why is this discussion any different? In racing in any form, teams are always being innovative, using ingenuity to be the fastest and win races, I guess I don't understand why you seem so adamant on moving in reverse is all. I do apologize if I was "hurling insults"

[Tireguy17]

What 15 years in DLM racing looks like. 2002 to 2017

[Illtsate32]

Idk if rules have changed but for instance in Ump you were not allowed any rake from front to back on the deck or the roof line and now days ive seen up to 6 inches of rake on the roofs...you can stick your whole arm in between the roof and the roll bars...crazy...

[bullring]

At least get rid of those stupid looking humps on the front fenders.

[Stede Bonnet]

I sir am most definitely not a liberal. All I am saying is that things change. Intelligent individuals have determined multiple ways whether it be aero/shocks etc to make these cars faster, why stop innovation? As far as the aero goes, no matter how you bend it (or don't bend it) a sheet of aluminum costs the same amount. At my home track I've watched for years the guys with spec motors (Ronnie Johnson in particular) beat up on the guys with the 400+ CI all aluminum engine (Chris Madden in particular) Because he got the power to the ground. I know a lot of these people personally. I talked to Skip Arp last fall at a race about his shock behind innovation in 1998. That was a HUGE innovation for our sport, it made the cars faster. Why is this discussion any different? In racing in any form, teams are always being innovative, using ingenuity to be the fastest and win races, I guess I don't understand why you seem so adamant on moving in reverse is all. I do apologize if I was "hurling insults"

Glad to hear you aren't a liberal. True Ingenuity, True Innovation doesn't ignore the rules and require the tech man to redefine things like, "Minimum Wheelbase" or "1 Shock per wheel". I'm guessing from your screen name your arguing from a fan POV, its cheap to do that. The reason RJ, "use to" beat the open comp supers was because he was given a 12 inch blade and a weight break for his spec and his CT525. Now the innovation you speak so fondly of, along with the changes in the rules, has closed the door on the possibility for anyone else to do what RJ did a few years back. The costs of all this are why you don't see RJ running "open comp" much if at all anymore and its been several seasons since he was a regular threat, even on the Nesmith tour. I'm not knocking RJ, I respect and admire him, but the way we use to be able to race and what is allowed now are gulfs apart. Everyone speaks so fondly of the wedge cars, they looked cool, but Aero nearly killed DLM once before and add in wind tunnel time, shaker rigs, spring smashers and the rest and poor ole RJ's flash won't stand a chance. For more than a decade I've been hearing how the next level was gonna be so awesome, well its here and so far I just keep reading of more retirements and more leaving the sport, all related to cost and time involved to prepare the cars.
Be careful what you wish for in the grandstands, you may just wish away your hero's....

Done.

[RayCook53fan]

Glad to hear you aren't a liberal. True Ingenuity, True Innovation doesn't ignore the rules and require the tech man to redefine things like, "Minimum Wheelbase" or "1 Shock per wheel". I'm guessing from your screen name your arguing from a fan POV, its cheap to do that. The reason RJ, "use to" beat the open comp supers was because he was given a 12 inch blade and a weight break for his spec and his CT525. Now the innovation you speak so fondly of, along with the changes in the rules, has closed the door on the possibility for anyone else to do what RJ did a few years back. The costs of all this are why you don't see RJ running "open comp" much if at all anymore and its been several seasons since he was a regular threat, even on the Nesmith tour. I'm not knocking RJ, I respect and admire him, but the way we use to be able to race and what is allowed now are gulfs apart. Everyone speaks so fondly of the wedge cars, they looked cool, but Aero nearly killed DLM once before and add in wind tunnel time, shaker rigs, spring smashers and the rest and poor ole RJ's flash won't stand a chance. For more than a decade I've been hearing how the next level was gonna be so awesome, well its here and so far I just keep reading of more retirements and more leaving the sport, all related to cost and time involved to prepare the cars.
Be careful what you wish for in the grandstands, you may just wish away your hero's....

Done.


I made the username about 10 years ago when I was just a fan. I'm not arguing anymore. Obviously we are not going to agree on this.

[Josh Bayko]

What 15 years in DLM racing looks like. 2002 to 2017

Other than the roof height, sails and valance, they're really not that different. The left front ear is still a good 6-8" taller than the right. It's still got the right front further out than the rear.

And the roof height is probably a good thing. A lot more window space to get out in case of emergency on the XR1.

[let-r-eat]

The tracks are getting single groove because that is the fast way around. Watching from hotlaps to heats to feature you can see that the cars are constantly seeking traction. As the surface goes away they search for other ways. The problem is that the old style of racing isn't coming back because of the equipment. Everyone has a cookie cutter type approach because the non conventional approaches don't exist. Maturity of the race car. Like Davenport running the fence and passing on the outside. Others like Bobby Pierce started the same practice. Given the same surface top to bottom will always create a one groove race in today's world. That wasn't so 20 years ago.

[Bubstr]

The only one that has control of the track surface is the track. That won't change, no matter how many rules are written. Believe it or not, there are tracks that regulate groove speeds by watering, moving tires, scraping berms or even changing how they have to enter a corner. They even change the banking degrees. There should be track maintenance schools like there are chassis set up schools. If the tracks worked half as hard at making a good track, as the racers do at winning the next race. we wouldn't have a problem.