Lead on rear end

[Jim11h]

So started catching back up with LM tech couple years ago and there was lead mounted on lr of axle tube at the time that shortly was banned. Help me out in understanding why there, how much using, and biggest reason asking is I'm on multi leaf now and wondering if would work to add lr drive. My initial thought was no, too many leafs to wrap etc to have effect then thought more and said yes it should because the weight directly where needed and would counter act lack of rear % due to division and adding 500# to rear. Can y'all help a dumb*as out to understand? This is a mid size full frame truck (s10, Dakota, ranger) class and with some weight the rear 51.7%. Any thoughts or am I crazy day dreaming something to gain here? Thanks y'all

[grt74]

two reasons to do this, a car with alot of left side weight will have a ton of forward drive but at a cost of losing right side grip

so if we can put it on the axle we can now have the heavy left side and rear and not lose the right side grip, the best of both worlds

[RaceEngineer]

two reasons to do this, a car with alot of left side weight will have a ton of forward drive but at a cost of losing right side gripso if we can put it on the axle we can now have the heavy left side and rear and not lose the right side grip, the best of both worldsYou can still have the effects of excess lr weight on entry. But, it doesn't effect roll the way sprung left side weight does. You also have the negatives associated with unsprung weight. It's no silver bullet.

[Highwayman]

Just do it!

[Krooser]

Why don't I see shocks mounted with the body mounted to the axle... More weight on the rear!

[Highwayman]

Tis true, greater static weight, less dynamic. Kinda funny how for so long it was lighter, lighter, lighter. Whats funny is the argument that this is a trade off on handling, its not. Here's why, the LR is mostly rigid 95% of the time anymore, so there is no worry over having to deal with heavy suspension components because the LR is for all practical purposes NOT suspension, merely a prop rod holding up the rear of the car. The LR on DLM's hasn't been usable suspension since 98' when all this hook junk first got going. Nowadays its even worse since they've figured out how to keep the car up on the bars nearly all the time, except in the pits or after they flip over.

[RaceEngineer]

Tis true, greater static weight, less dynamic. Kinda funny how for so long it was lighter, lighter, lighter. Whats funny is the argument that this is a trade off on handling, its not. Here's why, the LR is mostly rigid 95% of the time anymore, so there is no worry over having to deal with heavy suspension components because the LR is for all practical purposes NOT suspension, merely a prop rod holding up the rear of the car. The LR on DLM's hasn't been usable suspension since 98' when all this hook junk first got going. Nowadays its even worse since they've figured out how to keep the car up on the bars nearly all the time, except in the pits or after they flip over.If your LR is still 100% rigid in 2018. You are lapped traffic.

[fastford]

agreed /\ /\ /\ /\ /\ .......

[Twenty-Five]

If your LR is still 100% rigid in 2018. You are lapped traffic.Can you elaborate on this? I was under the impression locking the LR in full extension was still ideal, for consistency?

[fastford]

really not for consistency , instead of the old style solid chain or letting the axle tube hit the under-slung rail solid , the trend is more toward a cushion of some type , such as a spring or rubber on the chain or rail to achieve some suspension on LR at all times ........

[billetbirdcage]

really not for consistency , instead of the old style solid chain or letting the axle tube hit the under-slung rail solid , the trend is more toward a cushion of some type , such as a spring or rubber on the chain or rail to achieve some suspension on LR at all times ........

Too add to that^


Compliance should be in both directions, compression and rebound. Not just rebound like the limiting devise.

[Twenty-Five]

Too add to that^Compliance should be in both directions, compression and rebound. Not just rebound like the limiting devise.With low speed compression control? Like a high zero number?

[Jim11h]

So adding weight on tube in simple terms adds rear percentage without body roll effects? Here I was thinking more magic to it like holding LR into dirt better for more grip

[Doc88D]

It does also help to keep the sidewall of the tire loaded. Which in turn means you don't pick up, or un-load the LR

[RaceEngineer]

It does also help to keep the sidewall of the tire loaded. Which in turn means you don't pick up, or un-load the LRYes, that weight does not leave the LR when the sprung mass is transferred during cornering. However, when your tire hits a bump, it's more mass your LR suspension has to stop from flying off the track surface and push back down.

[grt74]

So adding weight on tube in simple terms adds rear percentage without body roll effects? Here I was thinking more magic to it like holding LR into dirt better for more grip

more left side weight = more forward drive, more rear weight = more forward drive, with it on the tube its not so much of a sacrifice because you haven't had much of an effect on the sprung weight,there for the car will act like it has less left side weight in roll = tighter entry to a point depending on how you drive, but as newton has always said for every action there is a reaction, it is by no means a fix all, and there are times it will hurt you, its going to be a trail an error thing, your not going to be able to just bolt it on and win, there are other factors to consider here when you do this

[Kromulous]

GRT does that apply to the LF suspension parts as well? More LS% static, and would be unsprung weight.

I am thinking it would help the car steer better?

[grt74]

GRT does that apply to the LF suspension parts as well? More LS% static, and would be unsprung weight.

I am thinking it would help the car steer better?

too much of anything can hurt you but yes a car with more left side will turn better (left that is)

[Aggressor]

What happens when you take the left rear front shock off the birdcage and clamp it thus leaving the left rear behind shock and spring on birdcage.

[RaceEngineer]

What happens when you take the left rear front shock off the birdcage and clamp it thus leaving the left rear behind shock and spring on birdcage.You have a shock with a more linear travel vs. axle travel, until you wrap up or wrap down the lift arm.

[hunterracing]

How much ls weight static are we talking

[Matt49]

You have a shock with a more linear travel vs. axle travel, until you wrap up or wrap down the lift arm.

I disagree. Assuming we are talking a single indexing birdcage, the shock on the front of the birdcage is going to have a significantly higher motion ratio than a shock clamped to the front of the tube.

[RaceEngineer]

I disagree. Assuming we are talking a single indexing birdcage, the shock on the front of the birdcage is going to have a significantly higher motion ratio than a shock clamped to the front of the tube.That's what I said. Attached to axle more closely matches axle movement 1:1.More linear. Not more travel.

[LRtireCHANGER]

When I watch the xr1 rockets and the Longhorns, many of them seem to have the perfect setup, only they are loose on the very end of corner exit, I think weight on the left rear tube would help with this(along with the wider left rear tire).

[Matt49]

That's what I said. Attached to axle more closely matches axle movement 1:1.More linear. Not more travel.

Yup. My bad. When I first read your comment I read it that you were saying it would mean more linear shock movement (as in top to bottom linear distance) than when it was on the cage, but you meant the graphed relationship between axle movement and the shock movement.

[CCHIEF]

Haven't all sanctions, Super or Crate, banned this practice anyway, no matter how you do it?? (yet likely not policed well, if at all, for the less visible implementations)

[RaceEngineer]

Haven't all sanctions, Super or Crate, banned this practice anyway, no matter how you do it?? (yet likely not policed well, if at all, for the less visible implementations)Probably most. But it hasn't stopped people from piling on axle weight, if they want to.

[Matt49]

Why bolt lead on the axle when you can just buy on of these?
https://ppmracingproducts.com/product/ppm2604-lh-heavy-left-rear-birdcage-5/

[grt74]

Why bolt lead on the axle when you can just buy on of these?
https://ppmracingproducts.com/product/ppm2604-lh-heavy-left-rear-birdcage-5/

they make em heavier than that

[Matt49]

they make em heavier than that

Oh yeah....tungsten, baby!