Lucas 2022 Schedule

[dirty-white-boy]

Is really looking like $15k to win will be the norm, with many large paydays added (WVMS and Muskingum come to mind)

Remember it was not long ago when the Hillbilly became the largest paying one day race with $25k to win.

Nice to the tracks and Rick and crew stepping the game up! This should keep some top talent on the tour.

Thoughts?

[MasterSbilt_Racer]

Is really looking like $15k to win will be the norm, with many large paydays added (WVMS and Muskingum come to mind)

Remember it was not long ago when the Hillbilly became the largest paying one day race with $25k to win.

Nice to the tracks and Rick and crew stepping the game up! This should keep some top talent on the tour.

Thoughts?

I feel they already had such an upper hand, I'm unsure what it changes.

[Josh Bayko]

All this really does is increase the nut the track has to crack, so look for much higher ticket prices. While it’s definitely very cool for the racers, there might be a point of diminishing returns on Lucas races for the promoters.

[RayCook53fan]

Where can we see the 2022 schedule?

[Pennsboro32]

Where can we see the 2022 schedule?

It’s not out.

[NeedforLM$peed]

Talking about 2022 in July of 2021...

https://images.app.goo.gl/rtdnstqWTi1omhH59

[LM1]

I think this is long overdue and the cost of doing business. How long have we had national touring races paying $10k to win on average? I've been a fan for 30 years and seems like its been $10k the entire time. The cost of racing has gone up exponentially, I think national touring series at a minimum should pay $12k to win and $1k to start to get more drivers following the series. I know they get show up money for being regulars but a lot of time that will cover travel costs but not much else. Its a fine line because DLM racing is becoming very technologically advanced but some of your fan base can't afford a $40-$50 grandstand ticket. Most nights guys are going through at least $500+ in tires/fuel alone not to mention wear and tear on the engine so the compensation needs to match the expense so to speak. There just aren't enough rich business folks that want to field a team anymore because its a no win proposition unless you enjoy racing or use it for advertising.

[MasterSbilt_Racer]

I think this is long overdue and the cost of doing business. How long have we had national touring races paying $10k to win on average? I've been a fan for 30 years and seems like its been $10k the entire time. The cost of racing has gone up exponentially, I think national touring series at a minimum should pay $12k to win and $1k to start to get more drivers following the series. I know they get show up money for being regulars but a lot of time that will cover travel costs but not much else. Its a fine line because DLM racing is becoming very technologically advanced but some of your fan base can't afford a $40-$50 grandstand ticket. Most nights guys are going through at least $500+ in tires/fuel alone not to mention wear and tear on the engine so the compensation needs to match the expense so to speak. There just aren't enough rich business folks that want to field a team anymore because its a no win proposition unless you enjoy racing or use it for advertising.
I'd argue the expenses should match the possible return. As you said, only so many folks are coming and they will only pay so much. Nascar found that out.

[ride height]

Looking at it from the stands....I don’t see how anybody can afford a big boy late model team even if it was 5000.00 to start. 2 cars...2-3 motors...a NASCAR level stacker. Lord knows how much in spare parts, and throw in a tire bill. It has to be beyond stupid money. God bless the ones who do it, but Lord it has to be expensive. 15 grand to win sounds like a lot but it ain’t squat, nobody wins....the fans have to pay $$$. Not all but a lot of racers still have to dumpster dive by mid season. We’re. Lucky we even have DLM racing at this point.

[NeedforLM$peed]

It's amazing how anyone can afford to race whether it's a 4 cylinder up to a national tour division. Let alone be in contention to win every night.

[Action10]

I'd argue the expenses should match the possible return. As you said, only so many folks are coming and they will only pay so much. Nascar found that out.Not saying it's right, but seems like the theory is to make some of your money back in race purses and have sponsors throwing lots of money at you to make a living.

[MasterSbilt_Racer]

Not saying it's right, but seems like the theory is to make some of your money back in race purses and have sponsors throwing lots of money at you to make a living.

No argument there. I consider that part of the possible return.

[4Barrel]

The sport needs to find a way to become more affordable. Dial the rules in some.

[Tireguy17]

If WRG didn’t have WoO Sprint Car dates to use to leverage tracks to host WoOLM dates instead of Lucas I feel Lucas would be looking at creating 2 series to fill tracks wanting dates. WoO is falling behind not only on their schedule but their driver lineup.

[play4kps]

You are so right 4Barrel, The sport is in trouble, every year we see a 15-20% drop in supers, its unfortunate, but there are teams out there that will spend a million to make a dime. Love him or hate him, Scott Bloomquist showed and proved to us that at tracks like Eldora its all about the car. When a team like Davenport is able to after the Dream go out and buys 2 brand new longhorns without a thought, the sport is in trouble, the average team cant do that, and eventually they either leave the sport or drop down to crates, mods, or street stocks. I think it should really start with changing the aero packages they are allowing in the sport. But as long as you got corporate sponsors of Lucas, WOO and big races the problems are only going to grow.

[bleedblue55]

If WRG didn’t have WoO Sprint Car dates to use to leverage tracks to host WoOLM dates instead of Lucas I feel Lucas would be looking at creating 2 series to fill tracks wanting dates. WoO is falling behind not only on their schedule but their driver lineup.

So Port Royal, I-80 and Knoxville all have WOO sprint dates but their biggest Late model shows are all Lucas Oil, try harder there Tireguy17

[3 wide]

Well I agree the purses need to be raised and a lot of them have been but they also need to increase the laps yes it's true it's been 10 grand for a while but a lot of them races were 100 laps now they are 50 laps most of the races are 50 laps now not many 100 laps races.

[Pennsboro32]

Well I agree the purses need to be raised and a lot of them have been but they also need to increase the laps yes it's true it's been 10 grand for a while but a lot of them races were 100 laps now they are 50 laps most of the races are 50 laps now not many 100 laps races.

50 laps is fine with me. I don't think every national sanctioned event should be 100 laps.

[waaac77]

No need to increase purses. These race teams don’t make their money off the purse payout. Tracks need to lower their prices and get more folks in the place so they buy more food, drinks and souvenirs

[BloomerHarvickFan]

Well I agree the purses need to be raised and a lot of them have been but they also need to increase the laps yes it's true it's been 10 grand for a while but a lot of them races were 100 laps now they are 50 laps most of the races are 50 laps now not many 100 laps races.

I was thinking the same thing. Back in the HAT days, the 10,000 to win races were the 100 lap, 2 day shows. You'd have qualifying and Heats on Friday, and B mains and Feature on Saturday. If you think about it, this was actually very good for the promoters/tracks. You had 2 days of admission (albeit Friday was cheaper) and 2 days of concession sales and souvenir sales.
They only paid 5,000 for the 50 lappers.

[Crossbones]

I was thinking the same thing. Back in the HAT days, the 10,000 to win races were the 100 lap, 2 day shows. You'd have qualifying and Heats on Friday, and B mains and Feature on Saturday. If you think about it, this was actually very good for the promoters/tracks. You had 2 days of admission (albeit Friday was cheaper) and 2 days of concession sales and souvenir sales.
They only paid 5,000 for the 50 lappers.

No way!! 100 lap races are terrible with few exceptions! Two day shows are even worse especially for fans.

The trend seems to be 40 laps now and thats about right IMO.

[LM1]

I love how Fairbury does the PDC, good show for the fans and not as much wear and tear on equipment for the teams. 25 lap qualifying features on Friday with no heat races. I used to love how Cedar Lake did the USA Nationals back when it was a 2 day show as well - time trials and 20 lap heat races Friday, each heat race was like a mini feature.

[TS FAN]

Dirt LM racing is alive and well. Don't mean to rain on anyone's parade, but there are plenty of LM racing everywhere. Now as far as the series like Lucas and Woo, I am surprised to some degree how many teams still follow them.

Dirt LM racing at local tracks has slowed down because weekly purses are competing every week with an assortment of added purse races in their areas. I have been around racing for seventy years and its healthier now than its ever been.

As a final thought, the days of large car counts are going to remain limited. Reason, drivers have other opportunities to run for added purses the same days as the big shows. Maybe the World 100 might be the last race where most promoters choose not to compete against it, but even that seems to be changing

[MasterSbilt_Racer]

Dirt LM racing is alive and well. Don't mean to rain on anyone's parade, but there are plenty of LM racing everywhere. Now as far as the series like Lucas and Woo, I am surprised to some degree how many teams still follow them.

Dirt LM racing at local tracks has slowed down because weekly purses are competing every week with an assortment of added purse races in their areas. I have been around racing for seventy years and its healthier now than its ever been.

As a final thought, the days of large car counts are going to remain limited. Reason, drivers have other opportunities to run for added purses the same days as the big shows. Maybe the World 100 might be the last race where most promoters choose not to compete against it, but even that seems to be changing

You are fortunate to live in an area where it's not dead, but even there, I can't agree at all. When you have 10 cars taking the green at Florence Speedway, something is very wrong.

That's not even taking into account places in the Southeast where large super counts became large limited counts became meager 604 fields.

[TUTY]

Keep paying $10,000 to win but add $10,000 to the rest of the purse. My god everyone needs to make more money to keep running.

[zyoung25]

I had a car owner tell me it cost 5-7k a weekend to unload his race car on the lucas tour. We're talking traveling to, pit passes, full paid crew, etc. Granted they haven't fielded a car now for a few years, but it gives ya an idea of what it costs to run a race team. Their shop wasn't in a ideal location for most races.

The guy I helped regionally would make a few hundred bucks when he won moler on a normal night (1200.) His shop was about 30mins away from moler.

[0_VodooChild_0]

I feel they already had such an upper hand, I'm unsure what it changes.Other than the fact that WoO & LOLMDS are going to work together & stop scheduling on top of each???? Would be great to see all the top drivers show up for EVERY super late model special.

[champion24]

O Would be great to see all the top drivers show up for EVERY super late model special.

That's a dream, but NOT happening! The World 100 is probably the closest we get now.

[ZERO25]

I had a car owner tell me it cost 5-7k a weekend to unload his race car on the lucas tour. We're talking traveling to, pit passes, full paid crew, etc. Granted they haven't fielded a car now for a few years, but it gives ya an idea of what it costs to run a race team. Their shop wasn't in a ideal location for most races.

The guy I helped regionally would make a few hundred bucks when he won moler on a normal night (1200.) His shop was about 30mins away from moler.

In Rigsby's interview with Mark Richards, Richards said it cost his team $5k per race!

[thexfactor0210]

In Rigsby's interview with Mark Richards, Richards said it cost his team $5k per race!

That is on the high end I believe. They have 3 full time crew members and a full time paid driver. If you look at some guys they own their stuff and dont need to pay a driver and maybe have one paid crew guy.

[ZERO25]

That is on the high end I believe. They have 3 full time crew members and a full time paid driver. If you look at some guys they own their stuff and dont need to pay a driver and maybe have one paid crew guy.

He said in 2019, he paid them 400k in salaries, not counting the employees at the shop! His shop/toter expenses was another 200k!

[Finnfan25]

I guess I'm the exception, but from where I live in central Kentucky, every Lucas Oil or WoO race (or any big late model race for that matter) in a 4 hour drive from me is packed to the point it's difficult to even find a decent seat or sometimes a seat at all (and I arrive when the gates open), and I won't even get into trying to park and get out. So much so that I rarely go anymore (even though I'm recently retired) in the post-Covid world. The reason I'm the exception is I'd GLADLY pay twice or more what I've been paying just to get the crowd down to a manageable size. I know this will probably ruffle some feathers, but that's just my opinion. Everyone keeps talking about running fans off, but it seems like every race I've been to in the past few years they announce a record crowd. Even if that's not the case I personally SURE haven't noticed any crowds dwindling.

[zooker25]

He said in 2019, he paid them 400k in salaries, not counting the employees at the shop! His shop/toter expenses was another 200k! Any idea when Eastbay Winter nationals are?

[MRM]

There are a number of team owners and drivers not thrilled with this year's schedule. Many of them think the Midwest road trips should be combined together like this weekend and next weekend. They've made several trips that way only to get rained out.

[Pennsboro32]

There are a number of team owners and drivers not thrilled with this year's schedule. Many of them think the Midwest road trips should be combined together like this weekend and next weekend. They've made several trips that way only to get rained out.

As they should. That's a long ways to go for most teams, even if you don't get rained out.

[TS FAN]

There are a number of team owners and drivers not thrilled with this year's schedule. Many of them think the Midwest road trips should be combined together like this weekend and next weekend. They've made several trips that way only to get rained out.

i agree this is a huge problem. Going forward this problem is going to have to be addressed. BTW, WOO in Jackson Minn had 18 cars for a 10,000 and 20,000 show for example. With rain lurking around the midwest I am sure this didn't help things

[Josh Bayko]

i agree this is a huge problem. Going forward this problem is going to have to be addressed. BTW, WOO in Jackson Minn had 18 cars for a 10,000 and 20,000 show for example. With rain lurking around the midwest I am sure this didn't help things

Jackson is a really tough sell for late model touring races because there are no supers to speak of in that part of the world. They could pay 100k on weekend with no Lucas races and the car counts would still be less than 30.

[MRM]

Jackson is a really tough sell for late model touring races because there are no supers to speak of in that part of the world. They could pay 100k on weekend with no Lucas races and the car counts would still be less than 30.

What's the benefit of going to a place like that? I scratch my head when I see some of these series going into these dead zones. At least Lucas stopped going to New York when the tracks up there couldn't draw full fields.

[Josh Bayko]

What's the benefit of going to a place like that? I scratch my head when I see some of these series going into these dead zones. At least Lucas stopped going to New York when the tracks up there couldn't draw full fields.

The benefit is to the sanction. They collect the sanction fee regardless of car count. On the track’s end, it must draw some crowd if they’re willing to pony up all that cash for like 15 cars.

[castone]

anyone know the sanction fee a track has to pay for Lucas and WoO ?

[PushinTheLimit]

I know here in the southeast, many guys that used to run supers or could run supers with their funds, are running either limited or crate stuff. If you just look at it from a business side, when I can race for $2,000-$3000 regional to win races in crates versus $4000-$5000 regional super races (cause there aren't any weekly super stuff around here), money wise it's more affordable to do the crate deal. If we wanted to, we could run 6-7 crates races that pay $10,000 or more to win within a 4-6 hour radius of home. One could argue that is too much payout for crates and I get it. I personally would love to move up to a super deal. But the main thing keeping me from it cost wise is motors. If the rules ever pulled that back to where it would be reasonable and maybe go to a 4" spoiler, I think that would swing car counts. Just my opinion.

[Paradox28]

anyone know the sanction fee a track has to pay for Lucas and WoO ?From what I can remember..the track is on the hook for the purse and the sanctioning fee..at least with WoO. It is a pretty hefty check for a track to write for one of those two to come race.

[LM1]

When the touring teams tow all the way to a race and get canceled for 2 or more days (like MN or last weekend at Smoky) does the Lucas/Woo series give them show up money to cover their travel expense?