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Just wondering what is best single, double, or triple, and if these clutches are rated for hp or toque. Will be running a flat top 360 under new imca stock car rules with a 500 holley. Just wondering if that xtra weight is needed or not. Also what good brand plan on buying one.
Thanks in advance.
I ran Tilton and Quartemaster double and triple disk clutches on my 800hp 550ft/# ARCA engines and ran them 3 races and serviced them. Grind sliders and install new discs. I know racers that have run them 2-3 years on pavement. I would not run a single disc anything on a race car if rules allowed multiples. Unless you watch and replace the disc regularly they don't have a lot of surface to get the job done.
Like anything else dirt kills them so I would recommend cleaning every 5 races until you figure out how often you need to service them. If you can seal your bellhousing to keep dirt out that would probably help, also washing the car down with a pressure washer is not great for the clutch.
These can be picked up on e-bay for about $150-$200 but many are junk. I would buy from an individual that ran one maybe racing junk. I have sold them complete and race ready for about $500 and new they are about $1000, depending on options. Most are fine spline for Jerico's / T-10's/. All you have to do is buy coarse spline discs and swap out.
For an IMCA car I would buy a 10" flexplate ( aluminum ?) to start the engine with as the flywheel and then use a hydraulic TOB to actuate the clutch. The TOB is going to cost $50-$250 depending on how good of a deal you can find. If you don't use the makers flywheel you will have to buy a button flywheel which a smaller backing plate that takes the place of the flywheel surface for the disc to engage to.
If you can't find one and need one, I got them...not cheap but it will be right when you get it.
I ran used 3 discs from ebay and put new discs in them as needed. I easily got 20 plus nights on discs.
I have a 3 night old single disc 7.25 quarter master here for sale... that is what you want, the disc in the single has MORE surface area than the discs on double and tripple as well as more material to wear by more than double..... They have got plenty of holding power and are only 8-9lbs over the used stuff I was running at 15-16lbs.
Also you just run a stock oem flexplate with this clutch I have no idea what all that garble dynoman is babbling about above.
$300 clutch
$100 brg
$100 scat shield
First off I have never seen an aluminum flex plate. Wouldn't want to run one if they did make such a thing as it would probably come apart.
I can't understand how a 7.25" single disc has more area than a 7.25" triple disc? Obviously the triple has 3 times the surface and has more spring pressure to make the clutch engage tighter as RPM increases.
I dont know why you seem to follow me around on here and want to argue about things you clearly have no clue about.Quote:
Originally Posted by parrot69777
there is more clutch surface area on the single disc and the material is much much thicker, if you held both in your hand EVER you would know, if you called quarter master you would also know.
The discs ARE NOT the same for 2/3 and single disc from quarter master.
NHRA has been running aluminum flex plates for about 20 years and they are SFI Approved, super stocks turn 9500+ rpm with them no problem...are you scared of running aluminum driveshafts too ???
The MOI on the flexplate -vs- flywheel ( for a couple hundred bucks ) is like taking 5# off your crank.
http://www.reactorproducts.com/
As far as my babble on the flex plate, if you do not use the standard flywheel that comes with the 2 and 3 disk clutches, you are removing the rear surface for one of the discs, so you have to use a replacement backing plate to get the clutch to engage and it is called a button flywheel because it is way smaller.
Our quartermaster discs are all the same thickness as they start life about .135" friction material and have to be replaced when they get down less than .100" . The main difference is a single uses the middle of a 3 disk and a 2 disk uses the front and back of a 3 disk, and a triple uses all 3.
There are some aftermarket companies that make replacements that are thicker, but I have never used them.
You are wrong on almost all the above.Quote:
Originally Posted by dynoman14
A quartermaster clutch that is a single disc shares no PART of a 3 disc except the fly wheel...
It does NOT use the middle disc, the clutch material isnt even the same stuff, there is absolutely no comparison as they are built completely different. A single disc has clutch material attatched where a 3 disc has a thin coating of material stuck to the plates.
In street stocks we run button clutches, they are sold to be used with a FLEX plate, they have the button flywheel built in.
Please go stick with the b.s you post in the crate forum as you are clue less when it comes to this stuff.
Mr.Genius street stocker,
I have been building clutches longer than you have been racing. I guess if it shares the flywheel the rest of the stuff might just bolt right up if you know what you are doing.
It is called individual thought, creativity or just basic know-how...that is how things get invented.
Just cause the catalog don't list it does not mean it can't be built. Putting together a LW Q'master clutch does not mean the one you buy from the book. A fabbed single disc clutch from LW 7.25 is almost 1/2 the weight of the standard clutch you buy from Quartemaster. Oops did I say something you have never seen or heard of therefore it does not exist.
Just because the part number in the QM catalog do not show commonality, I have sold 20-30 of these Frankenstein single disc clutches and have run them myself in 2-BBL pavement applications. The only thing you have to do is purchase shorter bolts to bolt them together with and shim the HYD TOB to work with the recessed diaphragm position.
BTW, if a clutch disc is 7.25" od for a triple and 7.25" od for a single have you discovered a new formula for calculating surface area that the rest of us don't know about ??? Let us in on it please.
After having you jump on my posts for the last 2 years I can't imagine why you would even ask someone else why they were following your posts on here.
lol...now he builds clutches!!
How do you get through doors with your head that big? If there was anyone to follow around on here....it sure wouldn't be you. Hard not to post a comment...on a thread you haven't already posted on. Because you post on every one whether you know anything or not. Maybe some day you will catch up with your ego.Quote:
Originally Posted by stock car driver
The only time something is supposed to be a good quality race part... is if your selling it. If you had a Tilton triple disc clutch next week for sale...you'd claim the Quarter Masters are junk....just so you could sell it.
bahaha thats some funny stuff there... I just sold 3 tiltons and 2 quarter master 3 discs, lol.Quote:
Originally Posted by parrot69777
Nice try though. Until recently I had never seen the q master single disc so I had no idea about it either. Unlike you Im still learning...
DYNO- now you build clutches... funny stuff, 4 posts ago you said that we couldnt run a flex plate because the first disc would have no place to seat on,lol...
You are seriously one funny cat. For someone who claims to have all these customers on here and claims to be making a living off all your knowledge you sure do go in circles when you are wrong.
fyi the 7.25 single disc HAS more material because the material cross section is WIDER.. 7.25 od and about 5.5 id vs the 3 disc discs which have the clutch material glued or dipped on only have 7.25 od and about 6.25 id....
Since your so worried about it and your so STUPID... I will take pictures of both discs for you tomorrow or monday and post them for you here. Ill even take a picture of the flywheel we all use with a flexplate for you!!
You forgot to mention you have to mill off the stands on the cover so that the short bolts will even have the threads exposed, not to mention the cover kinda needs to touch the disc in order to work.Quote:
Originally Posted by dynoman14
post some pics of your custom fabbed clutches please!
i'm sure he will after you post the pics of your single disc having more surface area than a triple disc. This is going to be good. I can understand you saying it has more material but surface area....Quote:
Originally Posted by stock car driver
no makey any sense to me hillybilly boy.
He's talking about the i.d. affecting surface area.
Ive got a grand that says Dyno man posts no pictures of any such clutch hes BUILT EVER....Quote:
Originally Posted by powerslide
If you dont understand the inside diameter of the single disc smaller thus giving it more material I doubt a picture will help you.
But anyways...
single disc is 1 inch wide for clutch material.
tripple and double disc has 7/8 of clutch material.
Here are two pics....
http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/u...b/100_0593.jpg
http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/u...b/100_0594.jpg
http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/u...b/100_0596.jpg
Here is a picture of the boss that dynoman would need to also shorten for a cover to work, where he said just buy shorter bolts.
http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/u...b/100_0590.jpg
Here is a picture of the fly wheel we all use with a oem type flexplate which he said we couldnt do.
http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/u...b/100_0589.jpg
And this is it. I am going to try and refrain from making any more posts on here. I had signed off a few days ago and saw this post asking for my pics.
So here they are, scrutinize all you want but the facts are the single disc is better, I ran 3 discs for the last 8 years and now know I had a better option. Quartermaster told me their single was enough but I never saw it in person to understand why. The cover has more clamping force and there is way more material to wear in thickness as well as a 1/8 inch more surface area to work with.
I got this single disc in a car I bought turn key and tore apart. I run glides now.
It has now happened twice that a guy who I have helped with information and set up locally has ran me over and beat on my car on entry. Ive also gotten really tired of all the arguing on here every time someone doesnt agree with what a person posts. See the saginaw or muncie thread its rediculous.
Its unfortunate because there will be dumb replies that are absolutely incorrect on here like there are now, go look under the stock car section, there are guys saying a 1 inch lowering block shouldnt lower the guys camaro a inch... jeez how basic can you get.
I will do my best to move on and just take care of myself and my racing program. I will reply to pm on here as I have been it seems daily lately but it wont be daily.
And notice I didnt say NEVER.
This will be my last post as well....maybe. :)
You have proven a single disc has a 1" wide disc and a triple has a 7/8" wide disc. That would be fine if you are only running one disc. However you are failing to realize that a triple disc has 3 - 7/8" wide disc's clamping on 6 surfaces. Some grade school math here.....3 x .875 = 2.625. There is no way in hell a single disc can clamp any more than a triple disc. If this was the case....they never would of made the triple in the first place.
As you lose thickness in your single disc....you also lose clamping force. A triple disc too....but since you are wearing 3 disc equally.....your clamping force remains some what equal.
The part that is even more comical....is after running your mouth for quite some time....you now say you run a powergilde. The reason your getting beat is because of the glide. When IMCA mandated a single disc clutch a few years back....many thought the glide was the way to win. Since IMCA went to allowing a triple disc....I know of very few who run a glide. Most everyone either has a sag, munice, or even the new type direct drive.
Where am I getting beat, lol....thats really funny. Name some front runners who run a manual trans. I know of one... I quit running them 12 races ago which is common knowledge and Ive spoke about it plenty on here.Quote:
Originally Posted by parrot69777
Single disc has MORE than 3 times the thickness of material as I clearly stated much earlier and according to quarter master it has way more clamping force in the cover to allow it to work while it wears all that down.
In the 10 years I ran 3 discs I NEVER wore the discs evenly, apparently youve never ran one or pulled one apart, the first disc releases first and gets most of the wear, 2nd 2nd and so on.
Its funny though as I was told in PM you cant fix stupid thanks for proving that. And also thanks for reminding me why I dont care about helping on this forum any more, you just sling unproven b.s around on here and I would need to make it a part time job to keep up with you alone.
Anyways, post the list of IMCA stock car front runners who run MANUAL trans.
AUTO and winners of about 200 features last year alone
mike nichols national champ
dustin smith 2nd in national pts
donovan smith
dave smith
brian blessington
keith knopp
jeff anderson
tim bengard
rod richards
doug adamy
darrin adamy
kenny hansen
duane pritchett
jeff turner
eric jones
manual
but he only has one disc... Surface area defined http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Surface_areaQuote:
Originally Posted by 50j
Yes his disc will have more than one single disc of a tripple but not more then the 3 combined. He also greatly exaggerated the difference between the two in his original banter. His measurement on the tripple looks a little off as well i'm not going to split hairs on him though.
Stockman have you ran the single disc more than 3nites yet? How long did the disc hold up?
I will honestly say i havent ran one.