car? or driver? or both?

02 Masters Wide/combo car

RR on 3" BS wheel to add clearance for tire rub that is common on these cars.

Springs RF 350; RR 225; LR 200; LF 500

Weights: 55.1% Left, 52.3% Rear; 100 pounds bite

Bars in vanilla positions: 1 down both uppers; Lowers in top holes, short RRL;

5th coil 300, 2nd hole out.

406 engine steel block, 650-700 hp.

Car literally will not rotate. Turns in okay after I let off throttle. tap brakes, rear will NOT come around. Will stick to bottom or middle groove of corner but rear will not come around at all. By the time I get the throttle applied enough, it's too late and it feels like it just wants to snap loose like it's going to spin out. Video of the car literally looks like it is a pavement car, and one that pushes at that, as I can't get into the throttle soon enough. Then, once I get going, it buzzes the tires halfway down the straight. Was able to get car to rotate a bit with a hard stab of three wheel brakes, but it wouldn't hold for me to get it to work right.

Do I just have no idea how to drive? Is my low rear percentage that detrimental? Is the 3" BS wheel hurting me? Stiffer 5th coil?

1/3 mile moderately tight flat oval (Eriez Speedway, PA)

get rid of the short rr lower, run the standard length bar there, put the 5th coil out to 34-36 inches from the center of the rear end to the center of the shock bolt (bottom of the shock) if it still won't turn in lengthen the rr bars 1/2 inch
if it won't turn in with the 52 rear, i wouldn't add to it
and where are you running the 3" bs wheel?
does the car have the correct rear end in it???

Let's see the video, then it might be easier to tell if you need to adjust driving.

If I'm picturing the correct chassis, you can cut out a section of the RR frame rail and weld it back in (flip it over) to the inside, and that will give you some clearance for the RR. I would focus on that RR (specifically the need for 3" backspacing) first. You've essentially widened the rearend by 2". I agree with going back to the standard length RRL as well.

At first glance, with the info you provided, I would picture your car having no side bite. But you left out a key piece...what is the J-bar at?

If the car already won't turn in moving the rr tire 2 inches further under the car isn't going to help, if anything it will make it worse. Do you have any stagger in the car ? That place gets slicker than hell, I only went there once but I was way loose on entry..

Raise the j bar 1'' to 2'' on both sides.
Drop front springs 25lbs both sides.
Add rear steer at the r/r

If there is no bumpstop, this car has to be bottoming out.

Ballast placement could also be an issue.
Gotta have body roll if you want hike.

I'm going with masters, been long time ago but always had pair of 500's up front. Think lowest on rf was 450 with 650lf. Those cars were tough to get going

I was happy when we junked out ours....a long time ago. This is an old car that requires old school setup/thinking, soft RF just isn't going to work. Does it have the lr coil behind the axle? I recall ours made a great drag car but didn't turn well compared to the Narrow car that replaced it.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Jim11h

I'm going with masters, been long time ago but always had pair of 500's up front. Think lowest on rf was 450 with 650lf. Those cars were tough to get going

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I second that.

Put a panhard mount on the right side mirroring what is on the left. Run a straight bar over to the right side of the pinion mount, as high as you can get it. Aim for the 14 to 15" range in length. It will steer great.

500lf 475rf
175lr 225rr

55% left 55% rear
120# bite

Finally got to the car today.

The J-bar: Pinion side level with center of pinion. Frame side: There are four holes. Mine is one down from top.

The RF is absolutely bottoming out. This probably explains everything I was experiencing.

So, should I go through everything you mentioned, Masters? Or, do you think if I:

Change RF to 475
Change 5th to 350
Put regular length bars LRL and RRL
Put some ballast to bring Rear % to 54-55, I should be good...

Thanks

Quote:

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Originally Posted by dfhotlm33c

Finally got to the car today.

The J-bar: Pinion side level with center of pinion. Frame side: There are four holes. Mine is one down from top.

The RF is absolutely bottoming out. This probably explains everything I was experiencing.

So, should I go through everything you mentioned, Masters? Or, do you think if I:

Change RF to 475
Change 5th to 350
Put regular length bars LRL and RRL
Put some ballast to bring Rear % to 54-55, I should be good...

Thanks

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You can try what you have there first. It should help a lot.

What's the length of your lower bars?

By the way, my LR spring is behind, with dummy in front. Let me know if that changes your spring recommendations. Thanks

I only seem to have a 10" 475 around. Is this okay? Or do I need to run a 12 on the RF?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by dfhotlm33c

I only seem to have a 10" 475 around. Is this okay? Or do I need to run a 12 on the RF?

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That should be OK for a 475 rate.

something else that i seemed to recall was i think we had to square rearend up in car by pulling RR ahead. car was always loose and this got it back under control.

if you can come across jerry bowersock phone # try getting in touch with him. he had them things running pretty darn good back in the day