I am looking to have a Super Late Model engine built . I am looking for suggestions . Chevy or Ford ? What would be the best cylinder head to use ? Right now I am thinking of something in the area of 380 - 390 CI . Thanks
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I am looking to have a Super Late Model engine built . I am looking for suggestions . Chevy or Ford ? What would be the best cylinder head to use ? Right now I am thinking of something in the area of 380 - 390 CI . Thanks
i personally like the 410 ford with the earlier sc1 heads, they are less explosive to me than the d3 heads. if I was a chevy man, and I have built quiet a few, I would run same bore and stroke combo with sb2,s JMO
can a 23 degree head on a 410 still compete with super lates?
On a very short track or a very slick racetrack they can but you will never see a 23* head engine in a Lucas or World of Outlaw car.
What about the Mullins 23 degree heads that make 1500 hp on a stock 350 bottom
End ??
you have to be more specific. what rules ,tracks, ect it all make a big difference. have you driven before ? a good motor builder should ask everything . it depends on your budget also.
A Mullins 23* head that makes 1500hp is done by using turbocharger or blower or nitrous.None of which are legal in dirt late models.
Some 23 degree stuff is now making 950hp NA, not sure it would live in a dirt late model environment though as it is used for stock valve angle straight line stuff.
Any 23* engine that makes 950hp is done with power adders.If you could make 950hp with a 23* head with a carburetor then you wouldn't need SB2.2 and all the other great heads on the market.
this is true, also I would love to see that 1500 hp engine with the stock 350 bottom end that hucks talking about.....Quote:
Originally Posted by perfconn
I would build an aluminum 400+ cubic inch 18 degree motor. The 18 degree stuff has been around, you can pick up parts in a pinch, the bolt ons are mass produced and readily on the shelf, and it works well. A steel block can be hard to make weight work out well in a super late model. Put a 8,000 rpm chip in the motor, going past that limit will increase the build cost and shorten the lifespan. Depending on time of year often guys like perfconn have good quality used pieces ready to go for good prices that are similar to what I am talking about.
Not to step on any body's toes, but if you gonna run Super Late Model, money better not be no object. The wide spaced big bore engines are king, so is the price.
On a local level, a good set of used 18's, or SB2.2's can be competitive, and like mentioned, used ones are around.
We still build 23 degree stuff for the Modified guys because of cost. Our 380'ish CI engines make around 715 to 725 on a Stuska dyno with a Depac. We can run with, and ussually outrun those 1500 hp engines mentioned, so they must not make that much from the center of the corner to the flag stand, where it's needed.TB
P.S. I've seen on other sites where Big Joe gets super large #'s out of a 23 head. I worked 6 years in NC, never saw anybody named Big Joe walking though the garage area..................just sayin.
we will be running on a big 5/8 mile real slick momentum track . iron block . a head , bore / stroke combo would be greatly appreciated . Any thoughts perf conn ???
I would not attempt to run anything less than a 13* head on that big of a track.Like Barker said,you can pick up 18* stuff fairly cheap but it can't run with the wide bore stuff.The steel block won't hurt your power,it will probably make more than an aluminum block but the setups will be harder to hit.The latest greatest topends run by the big guns are the Brodix 10* and they are running around 460ci.There are other good topends around such as the SB2.2,Little Chiefs,Brodix 13*,Brodix BD,Brodix GB and on and on.Stay away from the Dart 8* & 9* stuff.Everyone that has tried them say they just won't run.They look good on the dyno but not on the track.
So Uratchko is not telling the truth when he is claiming 950 out of a set of 23 degree all pro's? He asked if they could compete, not if the could compete on a budget
Honestly it depends what the competition is like. Our local late model class has 8-10 cars. Not a lot of big budget guys and you can compete on a big 3/8 with a 406 w/ 23 degree heads pushing 750hp, the mods at the same track are probably running similar motors. But like tony and perf have mentioned if you have guys running the wide bore motors it will be tough to compete. A set of good -12's, 18 degree, or sb2.2 are all going to put you in the good at most local tracks.Quote:
Originally Posted by stryker
When trucks were running Pro Stock, with SB2.2 heads, or similar, with 2 dominators, they made around 950.
Making that much with 23 degree heads??? I seriously doubt it. TB
I know Chris U. well and I don't recollect him ever saying he made 950hp w/23* all pros without using power adders.
http://www.yellowbullet.com/forum/sh...ee+head&page=2
"Bought my first set of All Pro's and won a bunch of races. Built many, many All Pro 23 degree engines.... last one made 960 hp single 4 cast intake."
Its in the NA section so I assumed it was NA. I understand that is not the norm and it is basically a 18 or 13 casting with the valves installed at 23 degree so the average dirt track guy isn't going to get anywhere near that and they probably had more in the heads/top end than he would if he bought a used 18 degree set and built a whole 18degree motor.
OK,he did say it.I would like for him to put that engine in a dirt latemodel and try to get it off the corners at 4500rpm.We are talking dirt track here not 11,000 rpm 5 speed drag racing.Big difference.
Big difference! The difference between night and day for sure.
18 degree engines still win their share of local races but are fading fast.
I'd get a good 13 degree setup and learn how to hook it up and then go for broke if the pocket book allows.
Terry , what do you think of the old 14 degree pro action head ? 230cc on alcohol ?
14* aluminum or steel?The 14* aluminum head won't make the power of a good 13* or 11* or SB2.2 but on a local level they can be competetive.14* steel head is best steel head ever made but very heavy.
We are starting to look into getting ready to make an up grade to late model, I hear about these 9,11,14,18 degree aluminium engines. My question is which would be the best all around motor, right now we run a 3/8 high banked oval ( you know the conditions dry when hot, wet tacky when cool & everything in between) I can only afford to do this investment once plus of course keep maintained.Thank you in advance
What are the tire rules?Quote:
Originally Posted by JDME
Quote Originally Posted by JDME View PostWe are starting to look into getting ready to make an up grade to late model, I hear about these 9,11,14,18 degree aluminium engines. My question is which would be the best all around motor, right now we run a 3/8 high banked oval ( you know the conditions dry when hot, wet tacky when cool & everything in between) I can only afford to do this investment once plus of course keep maintained.Thank you in advance Tires rule would be UMP & ALMS rules
I have several customers that win consistenly in Supers with all steel 360ci but they get a 12" spoiler & the big all aluminum engines only get 8" spoilers.This is on local weekend racing not Lucas or WoO.If you want to compete on the Lucas then you better have two cars,stacker trailer,at least 3 all aluminum engines in the 430-460ci range and lots of money.
I think the 18 degree with an alum block would be a minimum in that area of the country. 13 degree or sb2 or something on top of a wide bore block would be better. Call one of the big motor builders and see what they have to offer.