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Torn carotid artery, I assume from the flip in St. Louis.
This should be sending shockwaves through the DLM world in my opinion. He could have been killed in that wreck. First, why didn't the series he runs for have him get evaluated before allowed to race the series? Second, was he using the safety equipment properly and if so what failed and are there modifications that need made? Safety equipment should be constantly be evaluated and updated as cars get faster and things like that.Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffreymo
Do any top national series' have a procedure that the driver must be evaluated by his doctor or series doctor before returning? This is not only for the drivers safety but other drivers, crews, fans, officials, etc...
You can all the top notch saftey equipment and using it properly but chit happens and when it's your turn it's your turn. Ask Kyle Busch. He just happen to hit a section of wall at Daytona that didn't have a SAFER barrier.
I know that and why I was curious if something failed?Quote:
Originally Posted by MI Dirt Fan
You worry too much.Quote:
Originally Posted by wfo2007
Haha, maybe. I call it being realistic.Quote:
Originally Posted by ptown
There have been a ton of injuries that sidelined DLM drivers this year. Ah, let's just wait until someone is killed to make changes. Good example is the Charlie Floyd tradegy and drivers then making sure to have a fire bottle in their cars. It really sucks that it takes tradegy for safety changes to be made.
Too much saftey equipment can cause a driver to get out of a car slowly or not at all if there is a fire before saftey personal can reach them. Either upside down or right side up.Quote:
Originally Posted by wfo2007
Good post!!!Quote:
Originally Posted by wfo2007
if people are worried how fast a driver can get out of a car in case of a wreck. Maybe it's time for a body style change. Like make the window openings bigger or an excape hatch in the roof. Of course we all know it'ii never happen untill someone gets killed. Just look at all the saftey things that came about after Earnhardt Sr was killed.
Racing is kind of a reactive sport for better or worse. In nascar you saw the roof hatch being used and experimented for the 8 races Michael Waltrip was actually good in a race car and not annoying us in the booth, but the hatch never made it in nascar or any other division which given the size of some of the dirt track guys and the lesser aero dependence of dirt classes I figured roof hatches would have become popular. After BC's tragic wreck I see some experimenting with new halo bars over drivers heads in non-wing and midgets. watching non wings and midgets might even be my favorite racing to watch, but there's no chance I'd race one at anything bigger than 1/4 mile with the current cages.
I believe Izzo66 was saying the same thing after Eric wells flipped it at fairbury, and he got blasted on here about worrying for driver safety after a nasty flip or crash. I think he was getting at the driver should go to the hospital to get checked out before being able to get in the car again. I hope he posts his thoughts on this.
I do think that a tall roof line/low decking is a great thing. I am not as sold on the roof hatch. The driver should be able to exit the car on the right side and the left side, however on many cars the right side is not an option. Typically when the driver is trapped in the car, it is when the car is on its lid, so the roof hatch is not useful. Also I like the double upright and the roof bracing on my Swartz to take a hard hit in the roof, all of those bars I am afraid would make a roof hatch in-useable. I would rather have the extra bracing over the exit ability. That said the right side decking is low enough and roof high enough I could get out on that side if needed.
I think that many racers take a it won't happen to me approach to racing, still seeing drivers without gloves floors me, let alone proper underwear. I also see cars with steel driveshafts and ball spline transmissions... We have made great improvements by full containment seats, Hans devices, etc. but we still can improve.
I am not sure what would help in Landers' case, but I do think that we can improve a couple spots of our race cars.
1. Driveshaft safety, carbon fiber should be mandatory if you run a ball spline.
2. Left side door, seen a couple cars pancake the left side and driver really get beat up, very little room. I have thought about building a crash absorbing foam box in my left door in case, probably will this off season.
3. Being able to safely exit the right side of the car.
I could not agree more that WFO2007 has a great post. We can always improve and should always try to. Saying you worry too much or it won't happen to me does not solve anything. Injury and death can always be a part of racing but we should do what we can to minimize our chances of it happening. Sponsors will leave the sport, fans won't bring their children and the sport will loose a racer. Nothing but good comes from safety improvements. Hopefully in a few years we will look back and think how dumb were we for not having that. Think of the ideas that took many years to become widespread that now we can't fathom people racing without: roll bars, window nets, racing seats, full containment seats, belts, fire bottles, fire suits, Hans...
No, once again this isn't Nascrap. Take your mandatory someplace else Mr Obama.Quote:
Originally Posted by wfo2007
did any of you see the wreck in person I did it was a violent wreck to say the least
Too much safety can be just as bad as too much. Some on here think they know all the answers and continue to want more legislation that "they" deem appropriate. Some of these full containment seats are over kill in a dlm and would hinder escaping the car upside down or damaged in a huge way. I'm all for recommendations and raising the roof line and lowering the deck, but last week this Wfo2007 was claiming paramedics incapable of checking drivers out after an incident to see if they have a brain injury, he insisted it must be a doctor on site and that they force the racer to go to the hospital against their will and have test run before they can compete.Quote:
Originally Posted by zeroracing
wells wreck and landers not even in the same leaqueQuote:
Originally Posted by racecar1127
How could you have such a great post about the young drivers driving styles and then not agree with something that is directly related? The young guys attitude of being invincible is the exact reason why safety needs to be worked on continuously. These guys are putting themselves and other drivers in some very bad situations. The examples you gave about Pierce and Davenport are spot on. Another one was the move Tyler Erb made in one of the late Summer Nats races where he never lifted and clocked Unzicker (i believe) and both cars upset very quickly from the impact. Really, we could list these things all day. The reality of it stinks though - driving like this does fill the grandstands as many 'fans' want to see the wrecks and the super aggressive driving.Quote:
Originally Posted by Aces&Eights
Not in person but yes it was very nasty and I agree that it cant be compared to Wells wreck.Quote:
Originally Posted by old fan
again no comparison erb is out of control where peirce and davenport are notQuote:
Originally Posted by wfo2007
Sorry but most paramedics at our local tracks only have your basic first aid, aed and cpr training and that is it. Yes, they can tell if someone is suffering from a brain type injury as well as you or i can but they are far from being able to give the correct diagnosis or treatment plan. I know it sounds far fetched but I think the series having a medical person who has more experience would be a great idea.Quote:
Originally Posted by Aces&Eights
Yeah, they are all pretty much the same and as a matter of fact Pierce is probably the most out of control of the 3.Quote:
Originally Posted by old fan
If that is the case your local tracks do not have paramedics. Paramedics are State certified, licensed and trained in advanced life saving, advanced cardiac life support, trauma care, etc.Quote:
Originally Posted by wfo2007
You really have no clue as to brain injury recognition as many can not be diagnosed without a CT scan and many people seem perfectly fine and refuse treatment that have no symptoms until days or weeks later when they finally do have the CT scan and find they have a concussion.
IE: Dale Earnhardt Jr.
pierce wins tyler erb doesn't big differenceQuote:
Originally Posted by wfo2007
I hope Landers comes out of this OK.... bad deal but very rare.
All of the ambulance personnel at my tracks have been certifies paramedics... $150.00 per night and a contribution to the local fire dept. is cheap insurance.
If Landers is concerned about his safety, perhaps he shouldn't put others at risk with blatant attempts to wreck them
You misunderstand me, I'm all for safety, but I'm not for imposed regulations on how I outfit my car. The CF incident was bad, but from what I understand it was more about him not being able to get out, than not having an extinguisher in the c@ckpit. Upside down your not gonna be able to fight the fire and extricate yourself from a full containment seat with the interiors setup the way they are now. I'm also not in favor of the roof hatch idea either as I'm building my car with expanded metal welded over the halo. The reason for that is what happened to the guy from kentucky, #41. He was racing on a heavy tacky surface and flipped, but during the flip his roof was torn off. When he landed, with the cage down, it sunk into the surface and allowed his head to impact the track surface breaking his neck and ending his career. My idea with the welded in expanded metal would prevent this from happening and allow the cage to act like a snow shoe on impact and spread the force of the impact out over the entire cage and keep your head from impacting the track surface. I'm all for safety, I just don't like rule by committee, they usually get it wrong, like their stupid, "Rumley Rule". I'm sure your heart is in the right place, but legislating everything always makes things worse. Do something about making it easier to get out of the car, don't right rules that trap me in there...Quote:
Originally Posted by wfo2007
Hopefully back by Knoxville.
https://www.dirtondirt.com/story_9227.html
Landers is out for probably six weeks. Going back for another CT scan in three weeks. It is starting to heal on its own. This is from his Dad on DoD.
Letting a driver decide if he's fuked up or not is retarded. Same with any professional athlete. If they ain't dead and can half a$$ walk, they will try to compete. Like this deal, Jared wants to race now. He had to have been so freakin close to internally bleeding out it ain't funny. He tore 3 of the 4 layers or your carotid artery.
The door openings on the drivers and passenger side need to be accessible for an escape. We know they are not. Certainly wouldn't go away from the good seats. And just making sure your safety stuff is up to snuff.
More drivers, athletes, just need to be honest with theirselves. If your body doesn't feel right, get it checked out. If you don't like their opinion, get another. Their is more to life than racing or any other sport out there.
Since the Charlie Floyd deal was brought up, something in his fuel line didn't have the correct fitting, is what they think happened. He switched car from alcohol to gas or vice versa and they think some line wasn't plumbed properly. Was in Speedway Illustrated, their best guess. The other glaring issue, which I will never watch the video, is how long it took them to get to him. Supposedly the proper vehicle was there, couldn't reach the scene, then their generator for the Jaws if Life wouldn't start. Not getting to the scene because of d!p(not a nice word)(not a nice word)(not a nice word)(not a nice word)s in the way, pi$$ on that. Get the fuk outta the way or I'm moving you any means necessary. The generator, it happens, but if you didn't test it before that nights racing, also a failure.
No you shouldn't mandate everything, but ignorance and doing it the way it has always been done ain't the right answer either. Wonder how something as serious as a torn carotid is on page two, but fifteen Bloomer jerkin off threads are on page one.
When he leaves this sport, you fukers are lost. The lovers and the haters.
Quote:
Originally Posted by chupp n bloomer fan
Very good post!!!
This is some thing that may need too be looked at after a Bad crash .. Some one getting back on the track with something or a part of you hurt that may get someone else killed....People dont seam too care..Quote:
Originally Posted by chupp n bloomer fan
I dont Love or Hate Bloomer..He is what he is (and hes good at it)...Bloomer could have gunned it and Bobby would not have won .. then the Bloomer haters would have come out in groves..If he had dumped him I would of come on here and Been on Bloomers side on it....
I post on Bobby cause he has time too change and he WANTS to go to NASCAR.. Moves like the one he did will not get him there...
Would you post a picture of how/where you added the expanded metal on your rollcage - I like the idea very much -- thanks