So the FBI arrested six members of a right wing militia who were plotting to kidnap the Michigan governor. That sounds more violent than anything any antifa group has done so far.
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So the FBI arrested six members of a right wing militia who were plotting to kidnap the Michigan governor. That sounds more violent than anything any antifa group has done so far.
And it was 13 charged, not 6.
It is when the trial is extrajudicial. The right wing militia members would never conspire to kidnap her if they didn't already think her guilty. It would have been like the beheadings we see from other countries.Quote:
.A trial for treason isn’t violent !
Quite possibly the worst backpedal of all time.....you may want to roll over to the other thread where you were pretty specific about antifa.
I did......it's not pretty for you considering what you just said in the above post, or the one before that.
Anyway, like I said.....yer a confusing little feller.
https://www.bridgemi.com/michigan-go...medium=twitter
Quote:
FBI claims Michigan militia group tried to kidnap Gov. Gretchen Whitmer
LANSING — Federal officials say six armed men and others piled into three vehicles late Sept. 12, traveling in the dark from a militia member's property in northern Michigan to Gov. Gretchen Whitmer's cottage about a half-hour away.
Those men, arrested and charged Thursday for conspiring to kidnap Whitmer before the November election, allegedly surveilled the governor's vacation residence and surrounding neighborhood in advance of a plot they hoped to finalize this week, according to an FBI affidavit.
"She f---ing g--(not a nice word)(not a nice word)(not a nice word)(not a nice word) loves the power she has right now," Adam Fox, who prosecutors alleged had hosted previous meetings at secret bunker below a business in Grand Rapids he worked at, allegedly told colleagues during the surveillance operation.
“She has no checks and balances at all," he continued in an apparent screed against executive orders the Democratic governor had issued to combat the COVID-19 pandemic.
"She has uncontrolled power right now.”
Prosecutors allege Barry Croft responded: “All good things must come to an end.”
On the way to Whitmer’s cottage, men in one of the vehicles allegedly stopped under a highway bridge on M-31 and looked for places to plant an explosive device, which they intended as a distraction to draw police from the vacation home and leave the governor exposed.
Prosecutors say they had already been working on it: Earlier in the evening, in a meeting secretly recorded by a government informant, Croft had allegedly used what he called a "chemistry set" to build an improvised explosive device with commercial fireworks, black powder, pennies and electrical tape.
The following morning, after completing the surveillance run, the group reconvened at a Luther property in Lake County owned by Ty Garbin, an alleged militia leader with a separate Hartland Township home that was raided by federal authorities late Wednesday.
There, prosecutors allege they discussed the cost of explosives and agreed to meet this week Wednesday to "make a final payment on explosives and exchange tactical gear" they intended to use in the plot.
Those meetings and others are described in an affidavit from FBI Special Agent Richard Trask, unsealed Thursday, that lays out a months-long conspiracy that included weapons training, meetings across three states and early talk of attempting to storm the Michigan Capitol.
Many of their meetings were secretly recorded by government informants and undercover agents.
Fox, Croft, Garbin, Kaleb Franks, Daniel Harris and Brandon Caserta were arrested this week. They are considered not guilty until proven otherwise but face up to life in prison if convicted for the alleged kidnapping plot. All are Michigan residents, except Croft, who lives in Delaware.
"Federal and state law enforcement are committed to working together to make sure violent extremists never succeed with their plans, particularly when they target our duly elected officials," Andrew Birge, U.S. Attorney for the Western District of Michigan, said Thursday in announcing the charges.
Separately, Michigan Attorney General Dana Nessel announced her office has charged seven members of the "Wolverine Watchmen" militia group with various crimes under the state's anti-terrorism act.
Those individuals allegedly called on militia members to identify the homes of law enforcement officers to target them, made threats of violence to instigate a "civil war" and trained for an operation to attack the Michigan Capitol and kidnap officials, including Whitmer, Nessel said.
Federal authorities began investigating Croft, Fox and others this year after learning about social media posts discussing the violent overthrow of government and law enforcement entities, according to the affidavit.
In a July 27 meeting at a Grand Rapids business, which was recorded by a confidential informant, Fox allegedly told co-conspirators that their best opportunity to abduct Whitmer would be when she was either departing or arriving at her Antrim County cottage or the governor’s official summer residence on Mackinac Island, according to the affidavit.
Fox described it as a “snatch and grab, man,” according to the affidavit. “Grab the f--ing governor. Just grab the bitch. Because at that point, we do that dude — it's over."
In at least one instance, conspirators met in the basement of Fox’s shop in Grand Rapids, which was accessed through a trap door hidden under a rug, according to the affidavit. Fox gathered cell phones from all attendees to ensure secrecy, attorneys allege.
"The attendees discussed plans for assaulting the MIchigan State Capitol, countering law enforcement first responders, and using 'Molotov (not a nice word)(not a nice word)(not a nice word)(not a nice word)tails' to destroy police vehicles,” Trask wrote of that June 20 meeting.
The affidavit lays out a series of meetings involving various members of the plot, including gatherings in Ohio and a firearms and combat training in Wisconsin, where Barry Croft and a member of the unnamed militia group allegedly attempted to build an explosive device using black powder, balloons, a fuse and BBs for shrapnel.
At the late July meeting in Grand Rapids, Fox said the group “would remove Whitmer to a secure location in Wisconsin” for a trial of some sort.
In previous meetings, members had called Whitmer a “tyrant,” echoing complaints over her COVID-19 business closures.
In a July meeting in Ohio, Garbin allegedly said he did not want to attack the Capitol but was “cool” with going after the governor’s vacation home, even if it only resulted in property destruction.
Talks eventually began to focus on action at the governor’s official and personal residences.
At one tactical training exercise in Munith, south of Lansing, a man named Daniel Harris allegedly suggested “one person go to her house. Knock on the door and when she answers, just cap her.”
The men were expected to meet on Wednesday to "make a final payment on explosives and exchange tactical gear," according to the affidavit.
The federal felony conspiracy kidnapping charges filed against each are punishable by up to life in prison and a fine of up to $250,000.
In rural Munith, 15 miles north of Jackson, the home where two of the alleged militia members lived was in disarray Thursday afternoon. A woman who described herself as a family friend told a Bridge reporter that a shattered window on the side of the home happened during a raid just after midnight on Thursday morning.
Outside, a Confederate flag fluttered along with a Betsy Ross-style flag with “liberty or death” emblazoned in the space inside the circle of stars. The yard was littered with old furniture, children’s toys and other belongings. Car tires were piled on one end of the house.
The home is adjacent to a campground where visitors said they heard helicopters buzzing overhead for more than two hours the previous night.
One neighbor interviewed said he was happy to see authorities taking action, noting that the activities taking place at the raided home had troubled him. “They’re not the only morons around here,” he said.
The neighbor, who asked that his name not be used to protect his safety, said the people living in the home had moved in two or three years ago and “it slowly became the cesspool that it is now.”
Three months ago, he said, roughly 20 people showed up in military fatigues carrying firearms and gathered in the yard. At least twice in recent months, he said he had called police after hearing what sounded like machine gun fire coming from the property.
“They never came out,” he said of police, instead telling him that what he heard was likely something other than gunfire.
The neighbor’s recollections loosely match the sworn statements of federal authorities, who said the people charged in the alleged conspiracy conducted tactical training exercises in Munith on June 28 and again on Aug. 9.
The woman who identified herself as a family friend told Bridge that the nine people (six adults and three children) living in the home are now “homeless” following the raid. “I have no clue what they are going to do,” she said.
She said she was speaking for the family because “I’m probably the most calm person you’re going to talk to. Everybody is worked up.”
Things were calmer Thursday afternoon along the quiet, tree-lined street in northwest Michigan where Governor Whitmer’s family has a modest lakeside cottage. No vehicles were in the driveway and a few people walked along the road.
“This is horrible,” said one woman, a retired teacher who lived on the lake, of the alleged plot. (Bridge Michigan is not identifying the woman or the lake to protect the governor's security.) “I was very upset when they came to the Capitol with guns," she said of armed protests over the governor's lockdown restrictions during the pandemic. "Now this.”
"All of us in Michigan can disagree about politics," Detroit U.S. Attorney Matthew Schneider said Thursday, "but the disagreements must never, ever amount to violence."
This is a classic case of stochastic terrorism. Trump incited these "militia" members to act with his "liberate Michigan" rhetoric.
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Ej0irK3X...pg&name=medium
Mcnugget,You are a slave to your hate for him.........but a slave nonetheless.
Sounds like it sux to be you sometimes, hope you get well soon.
It's interesting that nobody here wants to step up and say what these militia members were planning to do was bad.
I don't denounce CHAZ and they aren't comparable.
Exactly as I thought.
So you support a plot to kidnap the Michigan governor?
On what grounds? Why can you not denounce a plot to kidnap a governor?
I sure hope that in all these meetings they speak of, that Roberts Rules of Order were employed. Meetings must proceed in an orderly fashion.
I might regret posting the below.
I said:
You mentioned only CHAZ, not the others. So the way I read that is if you don’t denounce one you don’t denounces the others. Correct?Quote:
Can you please post the link or links where you denounced, The Capitol Hill Autonomous Zone (CHAZ), also known as Free Capitol Hill, the Capitol Hill Occupied Protest, or the Capitol Hill Organized Protest (CHOP).(not a nice word)
First off. Your lack of equivalent fairness on matters like this stinks to high heavens, and are baselessly absurd in my opinion. You choose to see it your way, and your way only. Selfishly and obstinate, and that is worse than sad, especially in today’s climate of Politics. Where your side, the Left, tells everyone they are the ones that are more tolerant. I call BS and I call it loudly. You, for one, are not tolerant at all when it comes to equivalent fairness in forum discussions. If you want everyone to get along and be tolerant, it starts with one’s self.
I never said or implied that. No one else here has either. Please do not put insinuations in my mouth.
As you replied to BBQboy;
This is nothing new and sides don’t matter to them: Knowing anti government militia groups that are straight-up direct, anti government militia groups, not fringe small groups like the one exposed on Thursday --- have been around, and very-very popular in certain parts of the country --- and I have followed (subjected to) their craziness since about age 12 making that the mid 70’s --- I certainly know what anti government militia groups are all about. Read the books, watched the VHS tapes, then later on watched the videos online. Been there and done that. None of it I agree with, but I was exposed to it at a young age.
I have found out factually and firsthand over the years that anti Government militia groups are neither Republican nor Democrat, just simply anti Government, and the popularity of said groups has not wavered under ANY administration or Presidency since I‘ve followed since the mid 70’s. Be it, Carter, Regan, Bush I, Clinton, Bush II, or Obama --- anti Government militia groups have been around and being a Republican or Democrat is not a precursor or condition for being involved. Some don’t identify with any Political party at all.
Now then -
As for the rejection of the premise of your question; super far-far-far-far Rightwing militia groups anti-government activisms groups and the denouncement of it, should go without being said and should be obvious or self evident to you with my (and others) lack of saying anything at all --- as I do not support “them”. Past postings from me and others postings on matters exactly like this support that statement. Right or wrong, accept that or not, it is what it is. Not sure why I needed to spell it out, but there you go nonetheless. Seriously, I don’t see your “want to” debate in this matter, nor do a prefer to debate this with you. You appear on the other hand “want to” debate this and support the likes of Antifa as you have proven, written, and described in your posting #22. That’s all that is needed to know.
No No No!!!! Those are not right wingers. You are telling a total lie with that statement. They are far leftists that are agaisnt ALL in government!
And they have not actually done any violence silly. A plot for violence is not literal violence. Your assault against Conservatism, freedom and the pursuit of happiness rages on!!!
As you try to slander the right wing with lies once again.
Buford -
That’s the way it reads to me also.
IMHO, the upheaval we are seeing from the Left, is just the tip of the iceberg ---- come after Tuesday November 3rd 2020. It’s a no win lose-lose either way. If Trump wins, it will be more of the same ol’ same ol’ from the Left. Just more of the $hitstorm we’ve seen for three plus years. The Left will cry foul, more Antifa, more domestic terrorism, then more riots, looting, anarchy and violence. Now then if the Harris Administration wins, the $hitstorm will be bigger for a myriad of reasons --- and then when they try to take away (confiscate) legal guns from legal gun owners --- its all on. Buckle up baby because everything you’ve seen up till now will be Childs play thereafter. Take that one to the bank.
Buford -
Buyback (confiscate) of legal guns from legal gun owners --- is Hitlerism at its core.
Colion Noir - Proof Joe Biden & Kamala Harris back Gun Confiscations - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MmiuD3mafeA
From CNN -
New details emerge about plot to kidnap Michigan governor - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RXvH0leEaEs
“he was in a militia and got kicked out.”
“Trump is not your friend’
“Keep up the good work chief”
Like I said, it was a fringe anti Government group.
From Channel 4 Detroit - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pFqHSNZO-V8
“He doesn’t belong in one party or the other” - attorney speaking about Daniel Harris.
The Face of American Insurgency
The Michigan plot wasn’t about Donald Trump. It goes deeper than that.
Quote:
Some of these groups—including this one, which, had it succeeded, would have been the season’s most brazenly violent—seem to be inspired not by white supremacist ideology or left/right partisanship, but rather by an off-the-cliff radical variant of a feeling deeply rooted in American culture: fear and hatred of government.
Quote:
Trump’s rhetorical assault on lockdowns and mask-wearing may have inflamed many radicals—the storming of the state Capitol came soon after Trump’s tweet, calling on his followers to “LIBERATE MICHIGAN!”—but there is no indication that the Wolverine Watchmen are pro-Trump. One of them tweeted a video some time ago (the date isn’t clear) in which he says, “Trump is not your friend, dude. … He’s a tyrant. Every single person that works for government is your enemy, dude.”
https://slate.com/news-and-politics/...n-whitmer.html
All of these people are wrong lurker......it's all trumps fault.
Every single bit of it,Mcnugget says so.