Why should I switch to MSD?

[Chaps46]

I've always ran HEI's, DUI modules and distributors, and they have been pretty reliable. I've traded for an 85551 distributor and a 6AL set up off a street car. What are my advantages to running this setup. All I hear lately is people losing MSD boxes so are these things reliable or not? Whats the advantage of running these systems? Why do the boxes go out and what can I do to prevent it? Thanks.

[C10]

The 6AL is not a potted box, so make sure you mount it where it will not get wet! The MSD will make a HEI feel like an old points system, they have rev limiters, are easy to set up and last a long long time. I have had the same MSD 6AL box in my Mustang for 10 years, and the 6AL we had in our limited latemodel is now in our pick-up truck for the last 5 years, with 8 full seasons on it when we were racing.
Make sure you follow the hook up to the last letter!! Run the thick black wire and thick red wire TO THE BATTERY directly. Not the Solenoid, not to a power take off lug. The reason for this is it helps protect the box from voltage spikes when you are starting the car. On the LM I own now, we run two switches, one just for the box activation wire (the small red wire), and the other switch for lights etc. It further protects the box to be on its own circuit.
Keep it clean, make sure you use the anti vibration mounts to a SOLID piece in the car, and keep it protected from water at all times.

[Chaps46]

Thanks C10. I'm haveing a hard time realizing why the power and ground need to go directly to the battery and not the + side of the noid. Won't it see the same spikes at the battery that it will 10 foot down the + cable? I would think that the resistance in 10 ft of 10 guage wire would be more of a factor.

[stock car driver]

thats all good advice and by the book on msd install.

Ive got mine powered from the solonoid middle of the car and grounded to the chassis a few inches from the box. Ive only had one box fail and it was from a positive cable grounding to the frame and melting the battery post off the battery.

Ive chassis dyno tested my msd with a dead battery and the power was the same.

I hit the start button the other day without the coil wire hooked up and I have a coil stud on the firewall it looked like fireworks with the spark going to ground 2to3 inches from the stud.

I never realized it was that powerfull.

I run a oem ford mustang 5.0 coil. Tech west says its the best match for msd period. Its cheap also.

[C10]

I am unsure why it would be less spike at the battery then at the noid,but have seen guys have issues with powering it there and MSD does not recommend it there also. So I dunno ! lol

[Egoracing]

Ive chassis dyno tested my msd with a dead battery and the power was the same.

I have been using MSD's for over 25 years and I have NEVER seen one that would run without power. Also they will even out the power but they will still drop hp as the battery drops until the MSD will not fire any longer. With a fully charged deep cycle Optima after about 20 minutes of run time (racing not idling) you will see the rear wheel hp start to drop. It will not drop as far as it will with an HEI as they will start loosing power after about 10-15 minutes and after a 50 lap no caution feature 2 lap qualifying and 10 lap heat I have seen a car down over 40hp.

[Chaps46]

I run a oem ford mustang 5.0 coil. Tech west says its the best match for msd period. Its cheap also.

I have the Ford coil I was planning on running. After reading through some of the Techwest articles they recommend an alternator also. Anyone do that? I have rarely seen it. We ran 'em on dwarf cars with 200 horse motorcycle engines! Do they really take that much hp to run?

[stock car driver]

I have been using MSD's for over 25 years and I have NEVER seen one that would run without power. Also they will even out the power but they will still drop hp as the battery drops until the MSD will not fire any longer. With a fully charged deep cycle Optima after about 20 minutes of run time (racing not idling) you will see the rear wheel hp start to drop. It will not drop as far as it will with an HEI as they will start loosing power after about 10-15 minutes and after a 50 lap no caution feature 2 lap qualifying and 10 lap heat I have seen a car down over 40hp.

Sorry EGO as usual your wrong. Why are you insisting on following me around on here lately? Its a waste of time.

Dead is low enough to not start the car, not turn over the motor. AND it had zero hp loss to the rear wheels on the chassis dyno. We had to jump start it.

[Egoracing]

Anything below about 11 volts under load (it varies from box to box as do all electronics) and the spark from the MSD degrades, it is not a miracle box it is only a captive discharge unit you can not get solid output from it without solid input PERIOD! If you do you need to check your dyno!

[stock car driver]

Anything below about 11 volts under load (it varies from box to box as do all electronics) and the spark from the MSD degrades, it is not a miracle box it is only a captive discharge unit you can not get solid output from it without solid input PERIOD! If you do you need to check your dyno!

sorry your wrong. ive already posted the tests on here long ago when i did them.

i have a voltage gauge in my car 9.5 ish volts is as low as we could get my battery and there was no power loss.

no need to check the dyno its really quite simple about 18 runs that day then it wouldnt restart and battery was too low to turn it over, jumped it with a hot box. did 3 runs, put charger on it on BOOST and no change. went to lunch removed charger and votage was 12.5 and same power as before lunch.

Again I dont know why you bother posting at all. YOU dont personally do anything with any race cars and I dont post anything unless IVE done it myself.

[Egoracing]

Ask ANY reputible engine builder and go buy what they tell you. You have not proven A SINGLRE thing other than you can type, kinda like Dynoman. Please post dyno printouts that show voltage, temp and car to see it. Not just numbers that you typed into the box. How about info from a REAL engine builder :

Jay (not a nice word)(not a nice word)(not a nice word)(not a nice word)ens, an engine builder and contributor to Circle Track, ran a test at our request in which he dyno'd a high-horsepower dirt Late Model motor in phases. He was asked to try to find differences in horsepower as the battery that ran the ignition system was discharged.


The initial base run was done, as is customary in his shop, with a fully charged battery and a charging system attached to the battery. This ensured a full and consistent voltage output to the MSD 6ALN ignition system that was in use.

Once the horsepower curve was established, a battery was attached just to power the ignition system and not start the motor. This battery was not aided by a charging system, either. That battery was slowly drained after each run and the engine horsepower levels were noted. The first run was at 13.6 volts, and then backup runs were at 12.8 and 12.1 volts.

When the next dyno pull was run at 11.4 volts, the motor started running rough. A further drop in voltage to 11.1 volts caused even more disruption in the firing of the motor, and the run was stopped to avoid hurting the motor. It would seem, according to this test, that when the battery reaches a level of less than 11.5 volts, the motor will not only begin to lose power and run erratically, but also may cause damage to engine components.

This correlated somewhat with what Todd had told us. He predicted a drop to 9 to 10 volts would cause problems, but the threshold appears to be a bit higher. The CD ignition works the same through different levels of voltage unless it drops to a certain level-then the system will not function properly. This is understandable. At least we have a consistent output through a wide range of voltage levels with the CD system.


Read more: http://www.circletrack.com/techartic...#ixzz1SZKTk700

So rather than set on here and try to prove your is bigger by posting JUNK call Jay (not a nice word)(not a nice word)(not a nice word)(not a nice word)ens and argue with Him or better yet, call MSD and argue with them because they say the same thing and see how far it will get you!

[stock car driver]

Ego, why dont you post something YOU have actually done yourself?

NOBODY else on here doubts my credibility and what I have to share, so there is no reason for me to post pictures of dyno runs for YOU, you dont race, dont work on cars, dont crew for any cars, NOTHING you are a nobody lurking on here for some sort of self satisfaction you get from argueing and re posting information you can google search.

I have dynoed with my battery low on volts well below 11 with ZERO hp loss that is a fact.

I ALSO have won a bunch of Special Big events from Iowa to Texas and Alabama.. Where have you EVER even raced?

[Chaps46]

Wow! Way to hi-jack a post fellas. Thanks for the info.

Would yall like me to pull out the measuring stick?.........

[stock car driver]

Wow! Way to hi-jack a post fellas. Thanks for the info.

Would yall like me to pull out the measuring stick?.........

Sure, do you want to measure racing success?

Ive won about 60 features.

Or how about racing business? I build race cars, floaters, gears, etc. jnjfab.com

Im not sure what to measure for EGO here, maybe just his ability to google search?

Like I said in my first reply to him not sure why he does this but he seems to get off on argueing information on here that he has no first hand experience about. Its really kinda weird.

I would go msd as I said in my first post, also use the ford coil it works great. HUGE spark and maybe its why the big shop Ego quoted cant run below 11.5 volts, lol.

[MasterSbilt_Racer]

MSD claims you get full voltage at the plug down to a supply voltage of 9.

Common sense tells you at some point the ignition will peter out as the MSD does not create energy and the laws of conservation must be obeyed. I have seen a competitor lose a race because his battery died. I have no idea what voltage was left in his battery, but a new one fired the car back up.

I'm not here to argue and would have to see some tests to know for myself. I do know that taking the checkers first does not make one more of an expert than the guy who ran last. A valid test would, however.

[stock car driver]

MSD claims you get full voltage at the plug down to a supply voltage of 9.

I do know that taking the checkers first does not make one more of an expert than the guy who ran last.

Your right but your supposing both are in a race, in this case we have one poster who has NEVER been in a race car or owned one or worked on one for that matter, lol!!

[Graff Spee]

HEI all modded up with DUI stuff is fine. If you run a MSD it will idle much nicer and you can expect a possible HP gain in the 4 to 7 HP range above 7000 rpm. I like alternators, not arguing. Run what you have and enjoy yourself. Thats what its all about!

[4bangerhotrod]

just a couple weeks ago, our team was in a 100 lap feature and we for got to charge the battery before the feature, this was in our backup car with a optima 12volt red top have 16v turbo starts in primary car but we was getting ready to line up for feature and went to start car and the battery didnt even have enough juice to crank it, it just clicked an didnt have time to change the battery so i jumped on the 4 wheeler and push started it went up to the gate and ended up sitting for about 10 min idleing then went on the track and ran 100laps. i was worried the ignition would start cutting out but it seemed to run fine when the driver come in i asked him if it started cutting out or anything the lights on the dash were really dim and he hit the button and the lights went out and wouldnt even make a noise and he said he couldnt tell any differance and never felt any hp loss. i forgot to check the volts when i hooked the battery up to charge but im sure they were pretty low considering 10 min idling and 100laps on a battery that wouldnt even start to turn the engine over. so im not sure about all this hp loss below 11 volts. ego you could probably unhook the battery and run the ignition off the static electricity created by running that mouth about your 38 1/3 yrs of crewcheif of the yr awards for asphalt crate cars.

[Chaps46]

Got 'er all hooked up and I will tell ya the DUI I was running ain't got nothin' on this! Unhooked the coil wire just to see if I had everything hooked up correctly and it was throwing bright blue flames everywhere!!! I love it!!

Since it came off a street car it had just a 6000 chip in it. Can I run it without a chip and it be ok?

[stock car driver]

I agree I went from dui to msd and theres a big difference no doubt about it. I regret waiting until my 15th year of racing..

You dont have to run a chip but might as well stick one in there 2-400 over what you turn on the track to save your motor if the throttle sticks in a wreck etc.