soft RF why and what.

[Egoracing]

The point was that the softer spring is getting more weight to transfer onto the rf than a stiffer spring.

[4bangerhotrod]

the force on the rf tire is less with a softer spring than it is with a stiffer spring at the same amount of travel.

[Egoracing]

the force on the rf tire is less with a softer spring than it is with a stiffer spring at the same amount of travel.

With the same travel the load would be less, that is correct as 4 inches on a 400lb spring is 1600lbs and 4 inches on a 250 is 1000lbs, BUT the travel is not and will not be equal, you will get more travel with the softer RF and that can easily equal more weight. There is not a setup in the world that will compress a 400 lb spring X amount and then you put a 250 on it and it still compresses it X amount. You will gain travel which puts the springs contact point on the chassis lower on the weight center line which will increase the load that the spring sees. It is basic physics on how the chassis works with the springs. The lower the top of the spring to the weight center line, the more the same weight will effect the spring.

[4bangerhotrod]

stockcar i wasnt asking i was seeing what everyones thoughts were on this, to see if it wouldnt spark a new idea.
ego, a car dont need a soft spring when the track is heavy so with a stiff spring on a heavy faster track your goal should be to get all the travel out of your rf that you can. as the track slows down the the car needs a softer spring to get the same amount of travel. on the same track conditions a stiffer spring wont have as much travel as a softer spring. the cars not turning better because of the rf its turning better because of the rr mostly

[4bangerhotrod]

i was looking for something to spark a new idea but evidently ive come to the wrong place. you need to know why it works and how it works before you can make it work. i quess thats why you run steet stocks and we contend for national championships. we dont change springs anymore, we run a a stack rf, it works and has won alot of big races this yr i just dont enjoy setting shocks with laptops, and using computers at the track. it looks like it will be this way for the next few yrs but i know guys who's having alot of success running a conventional rf spring setup we just never was able to get it figured out like them.

[Egoracing]

stockcar i wasnt asking i was seeing what everyones thoughts were on this, to see if it wouldnt spark a new idea.
ego, a car dont need a soft spring when the track is heavy so with a stiff spring on a heavy faster track your goal should be to get all the travel out of your rf that you can. as the track slows down the the car needs a softer spring to get the same amount of travel. on the same track conditions a stiffer spring wont have as much travel as a softer spring. the cars not turning better because of the rf its turning better because of the rr mostly

I can not remember when I have ever seen any top racer change out springs at the track. If you ever watch the top guys they unload and run the event unless they are WAY OFF. Randy Weaver told me straight out that he does not touch the springs on the car unless he is out in left field and he typically does not even touch the bars.

[4bangerhotrod]

we dont change springs anymore but we used to, but yes alot of top drivers change springs at the track they do it in the hauler so you just dont notice. we usually dont change anything at the track now days cause everything is controlled by these high dollar shocks. im not the driver i just do setups i figured out i couldnt drive along time ago.

[sj valley dave]

I know we changed springs when we went to a pavement track...LOL

[grt74]

Im getting a kick out of this,just simple physics

[Egoracing]

we dont change springs anymore but we used to, but yes alot of top drivers change springs at the track they do it in the hauler so you just dont notice. we usually dont change anything at the track now days cause everything is controlled by these high dollar shocks. im not the driver i just do setups i figured out i couldnt drive along time ago.

I do not car where they do the actual change you would still see them take the shock off and carry it into and out of the trailer. It does not happen that much at all.

[jedclampit]

Rf springs are changed more than you may notice, usually as an assembly (shock & spring/s). And usually when track conditions swing from the extremes of grip.

[Egoracing]

Rf springs are changed more than you may notice, usually as an assembly (shock & spring/s). And usually when track conditions swing from the extremes of grip.

I had already pointed out if they were WAY off of the setup but I just have not see the drivers that are close in a tacky track start changing as the track dries unless they were off to start with.

[grt74]

most teams that ive been around dont change there springs unless there out in left field like ego said,now if they change there springs its usually all 4 because its changes bite and there set up,most national teams i know have 3 complete spring and shock setups ready and already scaled, and they can change them pretty quick so if your not looking you wont see it being done,and just to be clear why, they will all have different dynamic wedge setups

[4bangerhotrod]

stockcar again im talkin about dirt here not nascar, do you know the top drivers from woo an lucas

[4bangerhotrod]

im not telling you what driver i work for, well actually i dont even work for them i just do it cause i enjoy it and do it for free just get my way paid into the tracks. and stockcar i do have 27 actually 31 certs now because thats where i make my living, if crew cheif paid more i would much rather do it yr around but it dont so i race in the summer and work in the winter welding in nukes and refinerys. and if your not smart enough to figure out that the 8000rpm in the garage was pretty sarcastic its ok. i know you are the greatest stock car racer in the midwest and you build the best cars. im not doubting that its true so why do you doubt me. and yes my driver has won a championship in one of them series. and since you dont run a dirt LM there no way for you to know the technology used in them today, in the last 2yrs its amazing the difference in technology.

[4bangerhotrod]

yes stockcar i am a union pipefitter i have 31 out of the 70 some welding certs the ua offers if you've worked the fitters you will know how that works. i am done with this thread im not arguing with you, i have no reason to prove anything to you i know what i do and how hard i work at it proofs on the track an in the office at the shop.

[charcoal01]

Wheres the proof? You wont say what team your supposedly standing around with, lol.

Yes I know how welding certs work, they dont stay current forever, you cant just show up and take a cert, you have to need it for a job.... to give someone a reason to pay you to take it as well as apply the testing standards.

I would leave the thread also, you are just making a fool of yourself...

First you ran for national championships, then you dont drive, lol...

Don't really have A dog in this fight but why is it that nearly every thread I see you in you end up picking a fight with someone or are bring obnoxious? Are you an (not a nice word)(not a nice word)(not a nice word)(not a nice word)(not a nice word)(not a nice word)(not a nice word) in real life or just play one on the internet? How about you just put your knowledge where you're mouth is and provide input rather than be a pain in every ones ass? Happy Thanksgiving to all.

[4bangerhotrod]

evidently you dont know how the welding certs work,its completely different than boilermakers and sheetmetal workers. i can go to my union hall anytime i want and take a welding test and the hall pays for it, you dont need it for a job before you can take it. every six months if im working i send in welding continuity papers that the company signs an keep my certs updated, if im laid off i go to the hall and run a bead and they fill the paperwork out and update them there. when did i ever say i drove, sometimes if there's not a full field at a non sanctioned race i will drive our backup car to get the start money or when were testing i will make a few laps for fun. i started this thread to try to spark ideas but not many people understand how a dlm actually work especially you. i admit i didnt fully understand what the rf was doing either till a few yrs ago when we started working real close with the chassis builder. anytime someone doesnt agree with what you do they are automaticly an idiot, dont know what there doing and a liar. im not like you and get on here and brag about my accomplishments to everyone. yes i do help a major series DLM team i help them on setups and tires, im always looking for a way to go faster so i come up with ideas to try when testing thats all you need to know.

[let-r-eat]

I'll be setting here waiting on that soft spring to place more weight on its contact patch than the stiffer one.....I was really wanting to see what teams are doing with widening the CG and the front roll center. Why only mess with a spring and shock?Isn't it better to raise the CG and keep the same spring?

[jrkracing54]

Who is your driver than? What national title?

I live in a great place for racing, I personally know the National title holder in IMCA Lates in Nascar I believe I know 3 of the top 5 tiers National Champions, I would have to check it may be 4.

Ive never seen ANYONE load their car back up at a dlm event to change anything. But then again Ive only really been to one big dlm event. Its the 25k to win Silver Dollar Nationals held here. Maybe they all got lucky at that event set up wise. bahahaha

Girls! Girls! You're both pretty.