Madden at Charlotte ?!?!

[Matt49]

What in the world kind of car was that?!?!?

I just saw a picture of him passing Richards for the lead in a heat he won and I swear that car must be articulated. No "down links" from the roll bar to the rear clip and the entire center section of the frame is at a different attitude than the rear. You can clearly see the rear of the chassis through the LF wheel opening and there is no way that is directly attached to the center section of the car. Not to mention the LF is about 2 feet off the ground.
And you can see something UNDER the car that doesn't look normal.

See DoD slide show for the picture if you haven't seen it and chime in with ideas but this is some strange stuff.

[billetbirdcage]

What in the world kind of car was that?!?!?

I just saw a picture of him passing Richards for the lead in a heat he won and I swear that car must be articulated. No "down links" from the roll bar to the rear clip and the entire center section of the frame is at a different attitude than the rear. You can clearly see the rear of the chassis through the LF wheel opening and there is no way that is directly attached to the center section of the car. Not to mention the LF is about 2 feet off the ground.
And you can see something UNDER the car that doesn't look normal.

See DoD slide show for the picture if you haven't seen it and chime in with ideas but this is some strange stuff.

http://www.stlracingphotos.com/The-D...s/i-3CbPJds/X2

You don't see the bars cause of the angle it was taken from, longhorns bars only run down to the bar in front of the fuel cell not all the way back to the back of the car. I see nothing frame wise out of line, not sure what you're seeing.

That being said, I said there are some things going on. Going to be a really fun year next year, I'm really excited.

[Matt49]

Okay, I now see the optical illusion I was getting on the rear down-tubes.
But what about the "object" in front of the LR in the pic you provided. I think this is what I'm seeing in the picture I'm talking about. Is this part of Rumley's LR birdcage system? It's more vertically "aligned" with the axle than it is the frame.

[Austin34471]

That being said, I said there are some things going on. Going to be a really fun year next year, I'm really excited.

Me too. This is an exciting time to be in the sport. These next few years are going to really separate the innovators and the imitators

[billetbirdcage]

Okay, I now see the optical illusion I was getting on the rear down-tubes.
But what about the "object" in front of the LR in the pic you provided. I think this is what I'm seeing in the picture I'm talking about. Is this part of Rumley's LR birdcage system? It's more vertically "aligned" with the axle than it is the frame.

Madden doesn't have the Rumley devise, I'm pretty sure (about 99% sure) I know what that is on maddens car and it's not the Rumley devise.

[Matt49]

Well...I guess I'll wait for more pictures to come out :-)
I don't know what's more difficult: convicting a pro athlete of a crime or finding out what is going on under some of these guys' cars.

[Austin34471]

Well...I guess I'll wait for more pictures to come out :-)
I don't know what's more difficult: convicting a pro athlete of a crime or finding out what is going on under some of these guys' cars.

I think that's just the Longhorn lift bar mount on the rearend you are seeing. You can see it better in this pic. Those ears are sticking down pretty far in most pics of the longhorns.
http://www.stlracingphotos.com/The-D...s/i-JTLgK8s/X2

But what Mr. Billet is referring to I'm not sure. Ive been pretty far up underneaths Madden's car and didn't seen anything too exotic. But that doesn't mean there isn't more than what meets the eyes

[billetbirdcage]

Well...I guess I'll wait for more pictures to come out :-)
I don't know what's more difficult: convicting a pro athlete of a crime or finding out what is going on under some of these guys' cars.

We are past outside the box, I think the box got thrown away. Tons of people trying all sorts of stuff some of it silly some of it looks like a decent idea. I can tell you I have a least 400 hours in CAD work that I've done in the last 2 months. There are major changes coming.......

Rumley lite a fire under all of our azz's, like I said it's brought the fun back into racing least for me as I was so burned out it wasn't funny. We all got complacent

[billetbirdcage]

I think that's just the Longhorn lift bar mount on the rearend you are seeing. You can see it better in this pic. Those ears are sticking down pretty far in most pics of the longhorns.
http://www.stlracingphotos.com/The-D...s/i-JTLgK8s/X2

But what Mr. Billet is referring to I'm not sure. Ive been pretty far up underneaths Madden's car and didn't seen anything too exotic. But that doesn't mean there isn't more than what meets the eyes

If you find the pic matt is talking about you will see it's not the lift bar brackets on the rear end.

Edit: On 2nd thought, it could be after going over more pics. it's a little hard to tell distance initially I thought the brackets looked closer to the wheel then the center of the rear end. If they was towards the LR, then I have a pretty good idea of what it might be (reason I said I was 99% sure).

http://dirtondirt.com/photoGallery.php?id=5436 5th or 6th from the end

[Matt49]

^^^ Yes that is the pic that sparked my interest.
There are a lot of interesting things going on these days. All good for the sport if you ask me. Makes the thinkers think smarter, the builders build better, and the drivers drive harder.

[hucktyson]

Sounds like you guys have it all figured out .... Surely the next Lucas champion and world 100 winner is coming from the tech section of 4m ..... I need
To see if Vegas if taking odds so the 4m wizards of smart can make me some money !!!

[MasterSbilt_Racer]

Sounds like you guys have it all figured out .... Surely the next Lucas champion and world 100 winner is coming from the tech section of 4m ..... I need
To see if Vegas if taking odds so the 4m wizards of smart can make me some money !!!

I know for a fact there are people on this site that have and will again come up with worthwhile things. You certainly won't get any faster with Wang jokes and dismissing everyone.

Say I find a bolt on for my car that makes it 3 tenths faster. I am too slow, like you, for anyone to realize I have anything. Give it to a top tier driver, he wins most every race. It gets attention at that point.

[hucktyson]

You don't get what I'm saying ... It's the constant search for magic and people implying that they have the magic on here I it they won't tell you what it is lol. No doubt there is some useful info on here but also an insane amount of BS. I I'll tell you this there's a lot of car owners with really deep pockets that would pay a lot of money for the info people on here claim to have ... And if your that good your selling it to them not stroking off on a message board. When it comes to residential construction I'm on top of that game and charge crazy money for what I do as a result. and there's lots of message boards in that field and I post ZERO info about anything. If your good you sell your ideas and become rich as a result... Let me know who's car billet is wrenching on and when it wins a crown jewel in 2016 the very next day I will come on here and say I was wrong.

[bb14]

The smart guys have ideas behind the Rumley device. There are several iterations of it being tested. Penske's iteration is obviously pretty darn good but I feel Rumley uses his for more than just traction. He is ahead of the others, obviously, and has a system in place to allow the whole car to be adjusted beyond what we have done the past. Just .02.

[fastford]

all this thread sounds like to me is more cost across the board and less cars at the track. the days of finding something you can build with a cutting torch and a welder that will give you an advantage are about gone. just look what happened in the shock industry alone. 10 years ago , you could spend 7oo bucks and get a decent set up, now its 7000, or more. im not knocking innovation, its just for the elite now , just look at nascar, the days of the wood brothers are all but gone.

[MasterSbilt_Racer]

The smart guys have ideas behind the Rumley device. There are several iterations of it being tested. Penske's iteration is obviously pretty darn good but I feel Rumley uses his for more than just traction. He is ahead of the others, obviously, and has a system in place to allow the whole car to be adjusted beyond what we have done the past. Just .02.

Penske...

Are you talking about the spring rod or something else?

[bb14]

Penske...

Are you talking about the spring rod or something else?

They have a device that has been tested recently. They may deny it. One of my friends is in the HoF and he first denied it. Another friend liked it. Who knows but you can bet the farm there are some out there trying to duplicate it. And it is not for sale yet.

[MasterSbilt_Racer]

They have a device that has been tested recently. They may deny it. One of my friends is in the HoF and he first denied it. Another friend liked it. Who knows but you can bet the farm there are some out there trying to duplicate it. And it is not for sale yet.

Been wondering how close the Zero was to having it.

[hucktyson]

Everyone is soooo convinced magic is happening .... Let
Me ask you this ... How many of the guys in here looking to the 4m gurus can pound the cushion on high speed race tracks anywhere near the same planet as davensnort ?? How many of
Those 22 races would
Davensnort have won using the traditional Bloomquist line instead of hammering the cushion ??? How many guys hammer the cushion anywhere near as well as davensnort ??? Bobby Pierce comes to mind but who else ??? A lot of guys run high but lack the finess to run the hub when it's dead slick.. I think the secret is that there is no secret..... I know billet has that cad designed front end that can make a U turn in the middle
Of 3 and 4 at eldora without sliding the back end or losing any speed .... It still comes
Down to once you spin the tires your done..... And the top guys do it way less than us hobby racers. And the real bottom line is being the best dirt late model driver in the world pays a small fraction of
Being the best in the world at (not a nice word)(not a nice word)(not a nice word)(not a nice word) near any other profession. Keep searching for magic and the guys who are good will keep testing and adjusting and keep winning like it's always been.

[MasterSbilt_Racer]

Everyone is soooo convinced magic is happening .... Let
Me ask you this ... How many of the guys in here looking to the 4m gurus can pound the cushion on high speed race tracks anywhere near the same planet as davensnort ?? How many of
Those 22 races would
Davensnort have won using the traditional Bloomquist line instead of hammering the cushion ??? How many guys hammer the cushion anywhere near as well as davensnort ??? Bobby Pierce comes to mind but who else ??? A lot of guys run high but lack the finess to run the hub when it's dead slick.. I think the secret is that there is no secret..... I know billet has that cad designed front end that can make a U turn in the middle
Of 3 and 4 at eldora without sliding the back end or losing any speed .... It still comes
Down to once you spin the tires your done..... And the top guys do it way less than us hobby racers. And the real bottom line is being the best dirt late model driver in the world pays a small fraction of
Being the best in the world at (not a nice word)(not a nice word)(not a nice word)(not a nice word) near any other profession. Keep searching for magic and the guys who are good will keep testing and adjusting and keep winning like it's always been.

You are right. Davenport would have won those races with a monoleaf. Engineering is useless.