Penalties For Tire Tampering- REVOLUTION Super Late Model Series

[MidTnDirtFan]

I wish you luck getting this and any series started. I am not a tech man so this is a fans perspective. Send sample of winning car and the so called hard charger. If they test positive then suspend them for on month and include a fine. Word of mouth is a great equalizer in preventing the infraction from happening again so if you have a website post the rules infraction. That could be any infraction not just tires but safety, equipment. or whatever. A few years back there was a regional series that started out strong but fell into the hands of favoritism. You have to be fare with everyone. Don't let politics ruin your series!!!! Best of luck and thanks for asking.

[let-r-eat]

Normal durometer tests in the chute with a good machine! Pull one over on the long caution and stick it to it if there is probable cause! Sticks less than the chute send them to the pits.

Let everyone know it's at the series discretion and there is no recourse.

[RoundNrOUND]

By the comments it's VERY obvious most of you(including the promoter) don't have a clue about tire prep and or tires. First let's start with the famous "a spec tire rule will save racers money" bull. They don't save anyone money, they make the tire manufacturer more money and whomever the tire manufacturer is paying to make a said spec tire rule more money. Tires that are typically picked(and almost every tire for that matter) slow down dramatically after they are run. With this result you are going to have the same thing we have anywhere else and that's the teams with money with new tires every time winning.

Now onto the prep issue. NOT ALL PREPS MAKE THE TIRE SOFTER NOR WEAR OUT QUICKER. There are preps out there that will help the lower budget racer stay more competitive on a lower budget because they won't see the speed drop off as the amount of times the tire is run goes up. So instead of getting 1-2 nights out of a right rear(meanwhile the second time on the tire it dropped off a half second) these same guys can get 2-3-4 nights out of a right rear and the tire only drops off a tenth. The people that should be saying that tire prep costs them money is Hoosier because it causes less tire sales.

But hey, what do I know? I'm just some guy who's been able to make a living in racing being a driver, team owner and now just a crew guy on a nationally touring team. My advice to the promoter is to actually do your homework here and quit watching what all the other series are doing who are getting their pockets lined by the tire manufacturers.

[MasterSbilt_Racer]

By the comments it's VERY obvious most of you(including the promoter) don't have a clue about tire prep and or tires. First let's start with the famous "a spec tire rule will save racers money" bull. They don't save anyone money, they make the tire manufacturer more money and whomever the tire manufacturer is paying to make a said spec tire rule more money. Tires that are typically picked(and almost every tire for that matter) slow down dramatically after they are run. With this result you are going to have the same thing we have anywhere else and that's the teams with money with new tires every time winning.

Now onto the prep issue. NOT ALL PREPS MAKE THE TIRE SOFTER NOR WEAR OUT QUICKER. There are preps out there that will help the lower budget racer stay more competitive on a lower budget because they won't see the speed drop off as the amount of times the tire is run goes up. So instead of getting 1-2 nights out of a right rear(meanwhile the second time on the tire it dropped off a half second) these same guys can get 2-3-4 nights out of a right rear and the tire only drops off a tenth. The people that should be saying that tire prep costs them money is Hoosier because it causes less tire sales.

But hey, what do I know? I'm just some guy who's been able to make a living in racing being a driver, team owner and now just a crew guy on a nationally touring team. My advice to the promoter is to actually do your homework here and quit watching what all the other series are doing who are getting their pockets lined by the tire manufacturers.

Boom! On the money! While I agree with pretty much all of this, I would prefer to see prep out of the picture and tire choice available. But, it is pretty tough to bust the good tire cheats.

[Jimmy Henry]

While I am fairly familiar with heat cycles, oil loss, etc., these are tire rules created by the racers. I have very little to do with it.

Thanks for your input, though...

[kidrock]

Lose all money from the event, all points money, and pay a fine (to be added to the points fund) equal to the first place winnings of the event you cheated in once the 1 year suspension is up if they want to race the series again.
1st offense = 1 year suspension
2nd offense = lifetime ban

If you can, get all your supporting tracks to honor the suspension at their regular shows and other special events too.

Any thing other then what ClampedUp proposed here is not really taking the problem serious.

[Bubstr]

This tire treating business has been going on for over 3 decades. No one has found a satisfactory answer for it. The spec tire usually ends with a tire that wears out or falls off after the first night and usually costs more. The main complaint about tire treatment is health issues, or you could just allow it. Seems the solution is to Tech for it and if caught using a toxic substance, the driver, owner and sponsors are put on a potential defendants list, in case anyone sues the track for damages.

It may not stop the practice but the Series, Promoters and the track will have someone to share the losses if there ever is a suit. Would you really risk, being on that list?

[GRT62]

I will add this if you are going use a lab, use one that specializes in rubber not just whoever is cheapest. By using the right lab you can pin point the chemicals being used therefor eliminating a guilty party from placing the blame on "simply green" or other tire cleaners. Send a benchmark sample in with the samples from the racers so there is not any gray area. Just my .02.

[let-r-eat]

Brand em' Make them run em until the promoter tells them they can change em. Make em bring their right rears to the drivers meeting and throw em in a pile and let the promoter hand them out.

[ONLY ON DIRT]

I have no dog in this fight, however when I worked for a touring asphalt series we required that any new tires for event be purchased at the track where a series official was present and the tires were mounted and kept in impound until the feature was ready to line up. The tires for qualifying and heats had to be from previous race. All tires were branded for the series and serial numbered. This was checked at every race, you had to turn in old tires when new purchased and #s were verified to be to that car/driver. It was a lot of work but seemed to help, we at least knew the money race was ran on unaltered tires. I know that it is probably unreasonable to expect to make everyone replace all 4 tires every race but might work if only allowed 1 new tire per night on vehicle. Just an idea.

[kidrock]

I have no dog in this fight, however when I worked for a touring asphalt series we required that any new tires for event be purchased at the track where a series official was present and the tires were mounted and kept in impound until the feature was ready to line up. The tires for qualifying and heats had to be from previous race. All tires were branded for the series and serial numbered. This was checked at every race, you had to turn in old tires when new purchased and #s were verified to be to that car/driver. It was a lot of work but seemed to help, we at least knew the money race was ran on unaltered tires. I know that it is probably unreasonable to expect to make everyone replace all 4 tires every race but might work if only allowed 1 new tire per night on vehicle. Just an idea.

And that would end it right there.

[MasterSbilt_Racer]

And that would end it right there.

That would send all the low buck guys to the porch, for sure

[RoundNrOUND]

Yes it would. A one tire rule a night does not and will not work, it will only expose the lower budget guys even more.

[formercrewguy]

As usual on 4m.....this thread turned semi-insane. Stay tuned for full blown insanity.....

[kidrock]

That would send all the low buck guys to the porch, for sure

If they wanted to end tire doping that would be a way to do it.

[MasterSbilt_Racer]

If they wanted to end tire doping that would be a way to do it.

It would eliminate all but quick application stuff. And keep a lot of guys at home.

[CGF]

Most use blue ridge lab,,,

[let-r-eat]

Just throwing out ideas that I've seen used on asphalt etc. This is a LATE MODEL series isn't it?

[Kromulous]

Reality is, nothing is as fast as a new set of cut and siped tires.

Only thing i could think of that may or probably wont work would be, to do like they do in Karting. When you go out for your heat race, your tires are marked, and that's what you run till the end. If you cut a tire, and need to put a new one on you go to the tail.

Roundnround nailed it thou, tire rules dont generally don't work because of my 1st statement. Your usually talking .3 to .5 tenths a lap with new tires over a tire with 5 to 10 runs on it.

Better tires that don't fall off as much?

Racing in general has a harsh reality, and if your looking for fair you probably need to look into another sport.

[Jimmy Henry]

You are exactly right, Kromulous.

Our tire rule will be,whatever you hot lap with is what you will run all night. Tires will be marked.