Jackie Boggs nailed for tires not meeting benchmark

[Car Biz]

Bloomer said * de-facing * .....Which mean the number on the tire doesn't match the contents .... I heard this theory that someone is making tires that looks like a legal tire with the correct makings .... So its not that racers are juicing a tire after they get it ....Its a better tire already ....

Purvis did that YEARS ago that is nothing new. Then was grinding the numbers off. When that could not be done anymore then put silicone over the numbers so you could not see the compound or feel the number of the compound after the race was over in the pits or at the scales.

[Barbecueboy]

Im with BBCB on this. Ive been prepping tires for the last 15 years. I have a pretty good understanding of chemistry too based on my job. So I don't understand how a test comes back and there are chemical/s missing. There would have to be other chemicals present that made the one deficient.

And lets not forget, we're talking- parts per million. That's a very very small particle size. What range is allowed before its declared illegal? That's what needs to be made public by the Series- how much gray area are they allowing?

Mine was more a question than anything.........

If baking it would remove something , wouldn't a long run heat cycle do exactly the same thing?

[a25rjr]

Mine was more a question than anything.........

If baking it would remove something , wouldn't a long run heat cycle do exactly the same thing?

You would think......We generally only heat our tires to 90-110 degrees in our hotbox/rotisserie.

[dirtdobber45]

Mine was more a question than anything.........If baking it would remove something , wouldn't a long run heat cycle do exactly the same thing?

You would think......We generally only heat our tires to 90-110 degrees in our hotbox/rotisserie.

Wouldnt it just harden it like a scuff tire?

[MasterSbilt_Racer]

Mine was more a question than anything.........

If baking it would remove something , wouldn't a long run heat cycle do exactly the same thing?

Not necessarily. On the track, maybe it gets to 220 degrees. What if you bake at 400? Different compounds have different vaporization temps.

[billetbirdcage]

Mine was more a question than anything.........

If baking it would remove something , wouldn't a long run heat cycle do exactly the same thing?

Not necessarily, just for discussion say it takes 230 degree's for a certain time period to remove a chemical from the tire. Is racing the tire going to get to that temp for that length of time?

Lets say that the chemical "polyjunktire" is the chemical that has been missing. Also say that the range on that chem is between 100 and 300 PPM (parts per million) for the test. So under normal racing conditions the tire might lose say 50 PPM so typically it stays within the range and passes the test. Now Lets say because the soft tire required is borderline on making the distance, guys are baking the tires to harden them up slightly (or whatever the reason you think they may be doing it for) so they can go the distance or not have to save the tires as much over going to the harder tire if that was even a choice or option.

Most all of us that get checked know it Billet, but the majority on here don't understand or just don't care. They just want to beat up the tracks, the promoters, the tire dealer, UPS on shipping, the labs, and the other racers for "soiling" the track. They are blaming everyone EXCEPT the teams that get caught with an illegal tire. The teams that have them come back "missing" something from the benchmark, need to quit putting their tires in an oven before the mount them and go race. Everyone is looking for an edge. Preheating tires may give you 1 but it's messing with the tire just like adding tire softener. Adding something or taking away something. It still won't meet the benchmark either way. Therefore the tire is illegal.....

I was beating around the bush and didn't want to actually say it, LOL. The computer jockey's are so unaware of what is actually going on it's not funny.

[a25rjr]

Not necessarily, just for discussion say it takes 230 degree's for a certain time period to remove a chemical from the tire. Is racing the tire going to get to that temp for that length of time?

Lets say that the chemical "polyjunktire" is the chemical that has been missing. Also say that the range on that chem is between 100 and 300 PPM (parts per million) for the test. So under normal racing conditions the tire might lose say 50 PPM so typically it stays within the range and passes the test. Now Lets say because the soft tire required is borderline on making the distance, guys are baking the tires to harden them up slightly (or whatever the reason you think they may be doing it for) so they can go the distance or not have to save the tires as much over going to the harder tire if that was even a choice or option.



I was beating around the bush and didn't want to actually say it, LOL. The computer jockey's are so unaware of what is actually going on it's not funny.

So you're saying billet, you believe they were just heating them extensively to replicate heat cycles without adding any kind of prep?

[dirtdobber45]

Not necessarily. On the track, maybe it gets to 220 degrees. What if you bake at 400? Different compounds have different vaporization temps.

Good point^^^^^

[zeroracing]

I would assume taking temp way up would further vulcanize the rubber and cause it to become harder. I guess it could remove something that causes more glazing over. If that is all it takes shame on hoosier for not taking the one chemical out so our tires will last longer than 20 laps and a caution.

[Cardirt0]

Not necessarily, just for discussion say it takes 230 degree's for a certain time period to remove a chemical from the tire. Is racing the tire going to get to that temp for that length of time?

Lets say that the chemical "polyjunktire" is the chemical that has been missing. Also say that the range on that chem is between 100 and 300 PPM (parts per million) for the test. So under normal racing conditions the tire might lose say 50 PPM so typically it stays within the range and passes the test. Now Lets say because the soft tire required is borderline on making the distance, guys are baking the tires to harden them up slightly (or whatever the reason you think they may be doing it for) so they can go the distance or not have to save the tires as much over going to the harder tire if that was even a choice or option.



I was beating around the bush and didn't want to actually say it, LOL. The computer jockey's are so unaware of what is actually going on it's not funny.

If we dont ask we dont learn..That how you learn, If i say something and you come back and say No No and why. thats Then I learn...

[dirtdobber45]

I would assume taking temp way up would further vulcanize the rubber and cause it to become harder. I guess it could remove something that causes more glazing over. If that is all it takes shame on hoosier for not taking the one chemical out so our tires will last longer than 20 laps and a caution.

That so you can buy more tires from them...lol

[rakracing]

believe you guys are on to something, got used American racers from a guy that worked better then new tires and held up better, no they have a oven , also bought wheels with hoosiers on then at a flee market that had the 1100 stamp sanded off and a 1300 section glued in the circle, was a bitch to get off

[blncfn57]

Go stick you hand on the RR right after a 100 lap race..(not a good Thing) let them pull off track and scale then stick your hand just do it.. Why not you will burn your hand.. I mean Blisters on your Hand...Now If heat changes the benchmark..(now MADE up numbers) say you got a tire at 18 be for the race and 18 to 22 is ok..20 laps Yellow, 30 laps yellow,20 laps yellow, 30 laps race over 4 time that tire is hot that it will burn your hand..now if heat lowers the Benchmark that tire is NO good.. How did he cheat...
......
Now If you in a race going hard for 40 laps.. and a yellow come out and its a long one.. The tire glazes over thats what a driver said he calls it..Thats why you see the driver gunning it swaying back and fort trying to burn off the glaze..He says if you treat the tire, It will not glaze over..thats why you see some cars fall back on the restart tire dont hook up...He told me if you see a driver not burning off the tire and then takes off good after each restart there is a 50% his tires are DOPED..The tire will not glaze up if its doped...This is just what i was told By a big name driver ..I will not say his name...

That is my understanding also, the more heat you can keep in the tire under caution, the better the chance of it not glazing over. I was always told to never "cool" the tires off by driving in the wet part of the track under caution, but I've seen it done and the guy fires right back off. That makes me go hmmmm lol

[Cardirt0]

That is my understanding also, the more heat you can keep in the tire under caution, the better the chance of it not glazing over. I was always told to never "cool" the tires off by driving in the wet part of the track under caution, but I've seen it done and the guy fires right back off. That makes me go hmmmm lol

How menny times have we seen a car running a way and the yellow comes out and he gets passed by 3 or 4 cars on restart.. bet its Tire Glaze....

[Krooser]

The test results will be in Hillary's next email dump...

[Cardirt0]

The test results will be in Hillary's next email dump...

LOL thanks Pepsi all over Key board......

[plunks7]

LOL thanks Pepsi all over Key board......

ROFLMAO: I also spilled or spit my drink (water) out. Caught me off guard Krooser!!!!!!

[a25rjr]

The test results will be in Hillary's next email dump...

So, now there will be 2 crooks/liars, whose name starts with an H!

[jeffreymo]

We were assured on this very board, just last week, that it was WD-40 that was found in the tires. Old fan even has proof.

[billetbirdcage]

For starters lets be clear on a few things:

1. Anything I post on this is conjecture, rumors, innuendo, personal feelings or possible BS on my part.

2. No one knows if Jackie's tires where missing the chemical, could been regular doping or whatever and may not apply to what is being talked about

3. Is taking the chemical out of the tire the benefit or a side effect of possibly heating the tires for whatever purpose.

4. If any of this is in fact true, how much of this is due to the tire rules leaning towards too soft a tire that will last for how hard the cars can be driven now. Then how much is leaning towards softer tires so guys go thru more of them $$.

5. If the cars need slowed down, why are we still using softer tires? Seems more of the tire doping issue isn't about making the tires softer (IE a hard tire rule) but a conditioner/treatment that makes the tire fire differently or makes it last/hold up better.

6. If the rule like the world is 40 RR and 20's other 3 corners and your worried about the RF or LR tire making the distance and you could make those 2 20's act more like a 1425 or 30, why wouldn't you? Sure you could use an older heat cycled tire, but likely it's edges are gone and not like a new tire. Are you even able to harden the tire (again if in fact that is what they are trying to do) by getting it hot enough racing and not destroying the tire doing so.

Again all opinion and no facts

****Names, dates, places and info left out to protect the quilty, LMAO

I'm done you can figure the rest out for yourselves