Tracks step up safety

[Rubbinsracin1]

Here is a list of things that should be mandatory to race at ANY track NO WARNINGS if you DONT have them you DONT roll your car onto the track. No local track officals or WOO/LUCAS officals letting it slide anymore like they do now....1- Yearly inspected fire extinguisher with pull pin in (not a nice word)(not a nice word)(not a nice word)(not a nice word)pit 2- HANS DEVICES on EVERY driver NO excuses you DONT have it you DONT hot lap3- Up to date inspected seat belts4- Gloves some drivers drive without them because they can feel the car more... NO MORE 5- An updated fire suit (not old ones with holes or rips)6-Head sock for fire protection of the head/neck7- Helmet visor tear-off shields (some drivers use a rag to reduce costs)I get so mad when we go through inspections to check shocks and tires but officials ignore safety components that will potentially keep our drivers alive. When will tracks and series stand up? Will it take a big name driver getting killed to make a true change? I say all drivers lives matter... What do you guys think? Agree? Disagree? Am I missing something? or do I just care too much?

[Rubbinsracin1]

where is says not a nice word it said "in drivers c0ckp1t" not sure why it didnt like what i said

[pig tracker]

I think some more studies and testing need to be done on the HANS device before it becomes mandatory. My concerns are with all the concussions that are showing up with drivers using the HANS. Could it be possible that we have eliminated neck injures and replaced it with brain injures? Could it be that now the head is being held too rigid and the brain is still moving in the head and contacting the skull with a greater force than before? I'm just a dumb old driver but I have been thinking about this for about 6 months or more with all the concussions that are now coming to light. Any thoughts.

[ajr31]

I think maybe there is more awareness and diagnosis of concussions now, not necessarily more concussions.

[heinen81]

Sounds like he had a Hans type system, but that is really only beneficial in longitudinal head movement. If what i hear is true, and he hit drivers door first... A full containment seat to prevent his head from moving side to side probably would have been an improvement. My opinion is a head and neck restraint system and containment seat should be mandatory. Why a person would buy a standard seat now days when the industry has improved safety so far in that area, just baffles me. And dont say cost, if you really cannot afford a containment seat, you cant afford to be racing. Not saying that was his case, but there's no place for cheap seats in this sport anymore, no matter how fast or slow the class.

[c1ty5tar]

I think some more studies and testing need to be done on the HANS device before it becomes mandatory. My concerns are with all the concussions that are showing up with drivers using the HANS. Could it be possible that we have eliminated neck injures and replaced it with brain injures? Could it be that now the head is being held too rigid and the brain is still moving in the head and contacting the skull with a greater force than before? I'm just a dumb old driver but I have been thinking about this for about 6 months or more with all the concussions that are now coming to light. Any thoughts.

This is pretty accurate. It's why the padding in football helmets is starting to evolve as well. Think of helmet padding needing to be like a "safer barrier" absorbing impact while gradually stopping the object moving instead of a sudden stop. That, in combination with the Hans and full containment seat, would probably be the optimal combination.

[rakracing]

like pig said, been racing latemodels close to 30 years hit about everything but the grader over the years, even destroyed one that what was left fit in a tot and bent the deck with my head, last ten years with full containment seat [ a good one] had by bell rung more than once by that seat on a rough track, I use a simpson hybrid head support but run the tethers loose. also there a young kid at the track that parents bought him best of every thing , suit gloves helmet, best cont, seat and a hans, he is on his 4th concussion and was told he should stop before serious damage happens, I believe if the helmet stops to fast the head and brain wont, containment seat that the helmet is not tight on both sides that you cant move your head is asking for trouble. my opinion but what do I know.

[Crossbones]

I think its odd how so many drivers have been injured over the last 7/8 years, really since "safety" came into discussion around 2007 when Randy LaJoie started trying to sell his products to the dirt market. This sport was safe 10/20/30 years ago. Now it seems every month someone is getting their necks broken or now killed. Hell is paved with good intentions.

[Krooser]

Years ago auto racing lost at least one driver per month... open wheel or stock cars.

[Crossbones]

Years ago auto racing lost at least one driver per month... open wheel or stock cars.

In asphalt racing and maybe sprints but I was talking about dirt late models. What works for safety in asphalt racing may be harmful for dirt late model drivers. The safety that came into DLMR over the last 8 years has come from NASCAR. None of this stuff was researched for DLMR.

[mopar92]

Sounds like he had a Hans type system, but that is really only beneficial in lateral head movement. If what i hear is true, and he hit drivers door first... A full containment seat to prevent his head from moving side to side probably would have been an improvement. My opinion is a head and neck restraint system and containment seat should be mandatory. Why a person would by a standard seat now days when the industry has improved safety so far in that area, just baffles me. And dont say cost, if you really cannot afford a containment seat, you cant afford to be racing. Not saying that was his case, but theres no place for cheap seats in this sport anymore, no matter how fast or slow the class.

I think you meant longitudinal force. The Hans is designed to work in longitudinal (forward) force. Pretty sure Indy, F1, and NASCAR guy are hitting much harder than a DLM doing 100mph. I recently got pinched in the wall and launched over a car. It was a violent barrel roll. I have a quality containment seat and wear a Hans. I agree with what Weaver said. That containment seat beat be up. I felt every time my head hit the containment foam. I believe that the SFI does a great job setting a safety standard. But I strongly would like to see how that hard a$$ foam in these seat head restraints or roll bar foam is right. To me it's way way way too hard. I too got a concussion and was out for 4 months. I have a brand new Bell helmet. Nothing was damaged and everything dos its job.
I will say this as well. I'm not a big guy and that containment seat makes it very tight getting in and out. For those who want to mandate it.... The cars are going to have to change or some of these drivers lose 150lbs. I see some giant racers NOT run a containment seat because "I can't get in or out with it in there. I hate mandatory stuff as much as the next guy but there is obviously an issue here.
Here is what I propose :
•containment seats mandatory
• larger window opening
•mandatory way to get out of the passenger side
•fire suppression system mandatory
•mandatory rollover valve in fuel cell
Sadly, guys say they can't afford it. Well, I've had 3rd degree burns from a race car, that was expensive. They buy a $40,000 open motor but can't afford $2000 worth of safety gear. These low roofs and high doors look sleek and cool, but they are simply dangerous. No two ways around it.

[mopar92]

I think its odd how so many drivers have been injured over the last 7/8 years, really since "safety" came into discussion around 2007 when Randy LaJoie started trying to sell his products to the dirt market. This sport was safe 10/20/30 years ago. Now it seems every month someone is getting their necks broken or now killed. Hell is paved with good intentions.

That is the most naive thing I've heard in this thread. Do you really think better fire suits, fire suppression, Hans, better helmets, better shields, better car design, better fuel cells, better everything in a sense of safety has caused more injury or deaths? Sadly, the most recent injuries have come from lack of proper fuel cell equipment, lack of a better seat, or simply the cars are going faster than they are caged for..... Look at these big Indy and NASCAR hits and they walk away. That didn't happen in the 60-90's.

[billetbirdcage]

Not a LM, but this will probably open some peoples eyes or least surprise them some:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WOsoNGwDTcg

You may not want to watch all of it, but least look at the 2nd crash test at the 2 min mark.

[MasterSbilt_Racer]

That is the most naive thing I've heard in this thread. Do you really think better fire suits, fire suppression, Hans, better helmets, better shields, better car design, better fuel cells, better everything in a sense of safety has caused more injury or deaths? Sadly, the most recent injuries have come from lack of proper fuel cell equipment, lack of a better seat, or simply the cars are going faster than they are caged for..... Look at these big Indy and NASCAR hits and they walk away. That didn't happen in the 60-90's.

I don't think he was poking holes in all those items, but I also think he has some points. Things are not always better in all situations or better period just because you are told they are.

It is very possible that HANS causes more concussions. It is meant to prevent basal skull fracture, not concussion. It is very easy to trade one type of unlikely injury for a more common one with equipment change.

[toyracer]

Maybe time to start slowing these cars down. Very hard tires & less aero would help do this IMO.

I think would also improve racing & passing. Racing now is so much hammer down with soft tires that it leaves a lot to be desired.

[Brian Gray]

The hans isn't the problem. A big issue is people will buy and use it without a real containment seat. We have talked about this over and over. I thought it would end when lefler screwed up an cut his head support off. I guess not! If you cannot get in and out of Your car with the proper set up seat system, at least be smart enough to leave the hans at home.

[hipower17]

toyracer has a good point.

[tommydz71]

Would a window net have helped. I often wondered why most dirt cars don't use them.

[MasterSbilt_Racer]

toyracer has a good point.

The speeds at Eldora this Saturday were on par with the 1970s.

[lmfan71]

Working in the safety field, there are many unknowns that go into these accidents. Safety only helps, can not prevent freak accidents. But I no a famous drive would loosen his belts up during the race so he would be more comfortable, some don't like the full seats, some don't like bars in front of their face to block debris, etc... Many thing in a nascar, or upper level cars are watched by cameras and computers. So know forces and impacts.