RR on ice exit?

[Dirt_Buster]

Are you losing any in the center? Like is it a little tight at all?

[billetbirdcage]

I'd bet money this is the issue: if the following is true

Is this a rocket? Is your left side % under 54.0 with you in the car?

If so, I've seen this a few times and it's the % and moving the battery from the center of the car around the x member to the LR will generally fix the problem.

Does the car get up on the LR if there is any brown or traction to put the LR tire in but in the dead slick the car is really lazy or don't get up on LR at all?

[Kromulous]

So it's a to low of a lefts side %?

I always figured lowering the leftside % to 52 or so would create more sidebite on the RR. That's all wrong?

[sidewinder69]

It is a barry Wright with around 54 percent left. It does decent if the left rear is in some sort of moisture but totally dead in black... But pictures show it is on bars to some extinct. I do have 5 1/4 drop

[fastford]

thats actually what i am doing . im trying to be careful in diagnosing it correctly , i guess timing would be the more importance of what im trying to deal with because it feels good in the traction and when it slicks its good getting in... its just that point once your leaving center and you need that scotch or forward whatever you want to call it. i wondered if i needed more caster to help load because i have 1.5 and 4.5 as of right now

if the reason it feels good getting in , in the slick , is that the rear is sliding, then you have lost all forward drive right there. with the set up you gave ,to me , it would have to be tight , i think matt gave you the best advice.

[sidewinder69]

i say it feels good because when i drive in and apply brake either trail brakin or not, i dont feel the need to countersteer and chase the rear end. nor do i need to stab the brake to rotate the car, it seems to be pretty neutral but there again i could be wrong but thats my first thought.

[MachineMasters]

I'd get your rear percentage up to at least 54.5 with driver. You might pick up a slight push on corner entry, so keep that in mind.

I've been anywhere from 50% rear to 57% and feel like 54 - 55.5 works the best for me. With 50 - 52, the car steers good but the rear tires feel like they are not loaded enough. If I get too much rear, the car gets lazy on initial turn-in and doesn't get on the RF hard enough, then the pendulum effect takes over mid-corner and then I'm free on exit. Similar to what you're fighting now, but for a different reason.

[sidewinder69]

very good analysis to help go off of masters. i appreciate that... one question just throwing it out there. can different spindles and caster combos affect any of this?

[Matt49]

very good analysis to help go off of masters. i appreciate that... one question just throwing it out there. can different spindles and caster combos affect any of this?

Absolutely! More caster creates a weight jacking effect. When you turn the front wheels to the right, it loads the LR and unloads the RR. What I've found is that if you've got a bit of a loose condition getting in the corner, excessive caster makes it way worse because as you counter steer it is unloading the RR. Just makes it hard to "catch" the car.
There are plenty that disagree with me but I think minimal caster (and minimal caster split) works best with the way the cars are now.

[sidewinder69]

I've heard that before but was thinking when I counter steered , by loading the lr that would be forward traction especially good in the slick right ? And then what if you went with no split.

[Kromulous]

I built a leaf spring Super stock years ago, and i sat the front end up with 6* RF caster, and positive 2* on the LF. That car drove the best i have ever had, steered on a dime. You basically didn't move the wheel, it just did its thing, and you gassed it up.

Always wondered if that would work on a real race car (SLM) LOL.

[Matt49]

I've heard that before but was thinking when I counter steered , by loading the lr that would be forward traction especially good in the slick right ? And then what if you went with no split.

In theory, yes. Counter steering loads the LR and give you more forward bite. But in practice, you have to get through the center of the corner (i.e. plant the RR). RF caster (negative) is unloading the RR as you counter steer which makes that harder to do.
Krom's example is an interesting one as the positive caster in the LF will put load back on the RR as you counter steer. With that much caster split, I'm not the least bit surprised it steered itself. It would probably spin if you let go of the wheel altogether :-)

[sidewinder69]

so ill throw this in the mix, if it is super slick already in hot laps and dont have to worry about plantin the rr to get through the center. can you go up on caster to get better advantage in slick?

[MachineMasters]

Keep in mind when you add caster to the RF, the car might not get on the RF as much/easy/hard. The caster can sometimes hold that corner of the car up. Just like the RF corner raises when you turn the wheels to the right in the shop.

[Stede Bonnet]

I built a leaf spring Super stock years ago, and i sat the front end up with 6* RF caster, and positive 2* on the LF. That car drove the best i have ever had, steered on a dime. You basically didn't move the wheel, it just did its thing, and you gassed it up.

Always wondered if that would work on a real race car (SLM) LOL.

Friend of mine in Australia won the Victorian Super Sedan series title about 2 years ago running a leaf car with front end similar to what you mentioned. Those cars are "Real" race cars(750hp+) and he beat out 4 links and swing arms to boot. Fear not the leaf car...

[calverton]

Bring back the leaf springs bring back the leaf springs

[Dirt_Buster]

I feel there is a maximum amount of caster I like. To much and it'll straighten up to hard and quick. Make it lazier till it's just enough.

[Stede Bonnet]

I built a leaf spring Super stock years ago, and i sat the front end up with 6* RF caster, and positive 2* on the LF. That car drove the best i have ever had, steered on a dime. You basically didn't move the wheel, it just did its thing, and you gassed it up.

Always wondered if that would work on a real race car (SLM) LOL.

Here is a link to that Super Sedan.
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?f...2529858&type=3