Droop Rule and State of DLM Racing

[hardracer32]

SO, y'all hear me out for a minute here. I know there is a lot of discussion going on about the droop rule and and whether it was intended for safety or to level the playing field. Now if it was intended to level the playing field then they should definitely come out and say that's what it is. Personally, I don't care what the reason is because you could pick either and be perfectly justified. These cars and the costs of building one and the technology involved in just being able to show up and race has gotten astronomically stupid!!

So as soon as anyone brings up the money point, you get all these people saying that DLM racing is supposed to be the top tier, it's supposed to be the best cars, the best equipment, the most sophisticated this, and fancy that. Well guess what people, so is NASCAR, so is F1, so is INDY, but they all have rules that put limits on cost, on body designs, on what parts are legal and what are not. You think the droop rules is bad? Go read a rule book and asphalt late models and see how you like that!

But I digress. THe thing is, that DLM's are the absolute best thing on dirt. THey have grown into a huge business, they have developed a fan base that is second to none, they have some of the best drivers in the entire country and we have some of the best racing that you will ever see. But the reason that all of this is possible is because even though this class has ALWAYS been the top class, it has always been ACCESSIBLE! The reason that it has grown into the premier sport that it is, is because the average joe who has some talent, and a good work ethic, could go to his local racetrack, on an open trailer, with a few tires, and compete in a car just like Scott BLoomquist, or Dale McDowell, or Freddy Smith, or insert driver here. THAT is what made late models so successful. The speeds vary so much from track to track and depending on condition of the surface but when people showed up to watch a race they new they were watching the best drivers compete. And when local heros showed up they knew that they had a chance to go door to door with the guys that they had been reading bout in the racing papers and seeing in the magazines.

Not too long ago, a guy could go find a decent used chassis, put a SPEC engine, or small cubic inch, affordable power plant, bolt on a "cookie cutter setup", to to the race track, and if he had some talent he could go out and have a chance to be competitive. But just in the last 5 years or so, the cost of cars, shocks and motors have grown very much disproportionate to the rest of the economy. Now, if you hit the wall and just bend up a few suspension components you're talking about almost as much to repair a shock as it would cost to get a whole front clip! That's insane!

But now all this stuff is out there and the series have let all this get so out of hand that they don't know how to reel it all back in. Well I'm here to tell you that Ray's answer may not be perfect but it is certainly a step in the right direction. DLM's have gotten so ridiculous looking with the bodies that they look wrecked before they ever get on the track. Noses twisted up, doors curved in and runnin up hill at the front so they dont plow going through the corner. Putting in place some rules to get this stuff under control is the only way to get our sport back on track. When I first started racing DLM's in 2001, there were about 6 tracks within a couple hours or less of me that ran Supers every week. Most of those tracks had pretty solid fields. Now, several of tracks have closed down completely, and the ones that are left dont have supers at all. THis has snowball has got to be stopped or the sport that we all love is going to fizzle out and die.

Look, NASCAR, F1, INDY, they are all top tier racing organisations. But you dont see INDY cars running around with giant sideboards, F1 outlaws parts and technology and changes the rules all the time in order to adjust cost and level the playing field. Every series puts out a box and says you have to stay in this box. it's time that the definition of that box for late models is set to a much more reasonable standard. What difference does it make if it slows the cars down a couple of tenths, or even several tenths? The cars at the Gateway Nationals werent going nearly as fast as they do at ELdora but I can tell you that it was one hell of a race.

I just know that something has to be done for our sport to live on for future generations to enjoy, and not just at the top levels, but from top to bottom. Tracks with local, entry level divisions, traveling sereis, all of it. IT's time to put some common sense back in all this.

I know this is a long post but I hope some of you made it all the way through and we can all start encouraging these promoters and series directors to make some changes that will help level the field and make DLM racing great again!

[3 wide]

Well you are correct but I talked to one of the top race car builders last year about this same thing and he tod me that the big money is here and in the sport and things are not going to change till the big money leaves he said it's just that simple.

[onlyfacts]

These rules will drive costs higher. The teams and chassis builders that are willing to spend money on more engineering and technology will have the advantage. The more rules the more important the engineers are. Look at what NASCAR has done they tried to fix it with rules and the big teams hired an engineer for every rule nascar made. Now Nascar is all but dead because the only teams left are the big ones. And it has gotten to the point the big teams can’t justify the costs. If promoters and series keeps making rules we will be talking about how great it was when we use to be able to go to a Late Model Race.The reason Nascar, F1 and top tier Motorsports has very limited number of teams is because they tried to fix the cost problems with rules. 5 years ago we didn’t have all these problems but when the series and promoters started making rules the big teams and Chassis builders stepped up and hired engineers to find speed within the rules. The other issue is the series or the tracks don’t have enough tech people to correctly enforce the rules they make so there is a lot of Grey area for teams to work for in.

[fastford]

hardracer32 ,I,m a little confused about your comparison of DLM to these other forms of racing , are you saying they should use these forms of racing as an example ? because i cant see how all the rules these other forms of racing have implemented have helped them......

[Krooser]

Maybe I'm just lucky but I found a brand new chunk of chain laying on my shop floor last night... guess I'm set if I ever go down south and run that series. That's good because I doubt I could afford the $8.00 it cost at the local farm store. I guess I can affford the droop rule.

Now I'm waiting to find the extra $60- 80,000 worth of shocks, motors and such that are laying around in the corners of my shop that I forgot I owned... that's the stuff I need to run up front on Saturday night.

As usual racers are their own worst enemy...

[CIRF]

I am a more than a decade detached from the science and geometry of dirt late model racing at the highest level so I don't know what I'm talking about in regards to mechanics of those machines.

However, what I'm pretty sure of is that the horse is out of the barn and it's going to be nearly impossible to put it back in. At this point if they go putting in place the restrictions needed to contain and/or roll back costs the cars will not be super dirt late models. They'll be late models but they won't be what we've come to know as unlimited SDLM's.

[MasterSbilt_Racer]

I am a more than a decade detached from the science and geometry of dirt late model racing at the highest level so I don't know what I'm talking about in regards to mechanics of those machines.

However, what I'm pretty sure of is that the horse is out of the barn and it's going to be nearly impossible to put it back in. At this point if they go putting in place the restrictions needed to contain and/or roll back costs the cars will not be super dirt late models. They'll be late models but they won't be what we've come to know as unlimited SDLM's.

They already made them limited late models. It already jacked the costs too. I disagree about this rule costing folks money. It doesn't tell you how to build the car. Those rules cost money.

[CageFaraday]

They already made them limited late models. It already jacked the costs too. I disagree about this rule costing folks money. It doesn't tell you how to build the car. Those rules cost money.

Wisest person on the thread, who is actually speaking "only the facts", not irrational BS.

[onlyfacts]

Wisest person on the thread, who is actually speaking "only the facts", not irrational BS.

Let’s wait and see... if you want to run up front the Chassis builders or teams that have spent more on engineering and technology will be in control of the costs and that is only facts. Not trying to be irrational but I don’t want see Super Late Model Racing completely die.

[CIRF]

They already made them limited late models. It already jacked the costs too. I disagree about this rule costing folks money. It doesn't tell you how to build the car. Those rules cost money.

Please explain in clear and concise detail for those of us uniformed and unwashed as to the unlimited super dirt late division's degradation down into the ranks of limited late models. A self proclaimed bleacher jockey who expects nothing more than to be entertained doesn't know, understand or cares of the nuances of car construction. However, this intrigues me to the point of wanting to know.

[onlyfacts]

They already made them limited late models. It already jacked the costs too. I disagree about this rule costing folks money. It doesn't tell you how to build the car. Those rules cost money.

I disagree they do tell you how to build your car... Nose max 13”.. rear deck jacked up 47”. Car must have under slung.. That’s pretty much telling you how to build your car. I just read Lucas and Dirt Car Rules there is plenty under suspension that tells you how to build your car. 4 link is the only suspension that’s legal. Swing Arm or leaf springs are not legal. Their rules also gives you perimeter for the 4 link suspension to fall with in. So these rules pretty much tells you how to build your car.

[MasterSbilt_Racer]

Yes, Lucas tells you how to build the car. Ray gives you a couple measurements to follow. Totally different.

[MasterSbilt_Racer]

Please explain in clear and concise detail for those of us uniformed and unwashed as to the unlimited super dirt late division's degradation down into the ranks of limited late models. A self proclaimed bleacher jockey who expects nothing more than to be entertained doesn't know, understand or cares of the nuances of car construction. However, this intrigues me to the point of wanting to know.

Prior to 2016, I could build any suspension in my garage that I saw fit and bolt it on my car as long as the rear was a beam axle. Now, you are really only allowed a 4 link with very specific measurements given for bar locations. Many parts I used in the 90s, such as brake floaters and spring rods are expressly forbidden despite very low cost. You are not even allowed to use steel wheels! It's madness.

[race14]

It's all about the$$$ same as everything else. If you want to keep the cost down 500lb spring on all corners steel non adjustable shocks and 358 cu.in. steel block. Obviously no one cares about the money involved, it's gotten too big to make real change. That's all right one day supers will be a one series national tour.

[MasterSbilt_Racer]

It's all about the$$$ same as everything else. If you want to keep the cost down 500lb spring on all corners steel non adjustable shocks and 358 cu.in. steel block. Obviously no one cares about the money involved, it's gotten too big to make real change. That's all right one day supers will be a one series national tour.

You gonna tell me where to mount those springs?

[hucktyson]

How is getting the spoiler down out of the air to slow cars down SUCH an offensive idea ?? It lets people keep everything they have except a 200 dollar cushioned limiter for the LR ...

[hucktyson]

As a follow up why can't we get decks back down to 36" and check them after the race like we used to ??

[GRT32]

Get the bodies back under control and enforce the rules

[MasterSbilt_Racer]

Just put monoleafs back under them. One fixed eye and one fixed length shackle.

[onlyfacts]

[Quote Originally Posted by MasterSbilt_Racer View PostYes, Lucas tells you how to build the car. Ray gives you a couple measurements to follow. Totally different.] Ray uses the same rules for suspension as Lucas and Dirtcar these new rules are in addition to what is already in place.. he doesn’t allow the “Rumley Device or Spring Rods” nor would he allow more than 2 radius rods per side which is all spelled out in the Unified Rules.