Whats next?

[a25rjr]

We have seen several innovations the last few years on dlm's. Some that even defy the laws of physics. Whats next on the horizon or where do you see room for improvement? Here's mine: I believe fuel cell design to enhance weight transfer. Whats yours?

[MasterSbilt_Racer]

We have seen several innovations the last few years on dlm's. Some that even defy the laws of physics. Whats next on the horizon or where do you see room for improvement? Here's mine: I believe fuel cell design to enhance weight transfer. Whats yours?

defy physics? Not sure about that one. LOL. Some fuel cell work has already been done.

[billetbirdcage]

Harmonic frequencies

[a25rjr]

defy physics? Not sure about that one. LOL. Some fuel cell work has already been done.

Probly not the correct words.....How bout chassis theories that turned out to be wrong or could be overcome? The fuel cell design has changed very little and could be radically re-designed easily, to fit modern set-ups!

[Kromulous]

Billet is on it IMHO.

Designing a Chassis in a good CAD system and getting some stress analysis done on the various tubing and materials etc would pay big dividends.

Aero is still big, and i think there is room to make some improvements.

How about air springs !!!

[Mopar DLM]

Tires, variable durometer tires. They start the race soft then get hard for the middle of the race then go soft for the last 10 laps or so. Or even a tire that never goes away and never wears down. Would sure help my yearly tire bill.

[a25rjr]

Harmonic frequencies

In relation to _________?

[billetbirdcage]

In relation to _________?

All I'm gonna say is ¯\_( ' ' )_/¯

[mickley.28]

For the price of a new xr1 fuel cell there better be some pretty trick stuff inside.

[a25rjr]

What about tires? Anyone cutting them up and having an engineer examine its construction and evaluating its ingredients? Seems to be far more money spent on the chassis side than the actual part that contacts the track!

[fastford]

i have wandered about going to a down tube chassis , with a bar running from the top , right corner of cage , to where top of right front shock is , kind of like a sprint cage , with the load being applied to the right front these days , less flex might help......TNT built one like this several years back....

[Mr.Kennedy777]

In relation to _________?

Everything on the car is in pulses. Engine power production all the way down the drive train to the tires. Tires are a spring and also have a frequency. Springs have a frequency, everything in nature, even, happens in waves and has frequencies. Some of these frequencies create overtones by being multiplied over a certain area. The harmonic frequency would be any type of vibration that would be the result of the smaller fundamental vibrations. I think with race cars you would find these harmonic frequencies in the chassis structure itself as a result of the numerous fundamental vibrations, tires, springs, links and power input, brake forces and cornering forces and even the way the frame is put together and the material it’s made from. Changing the shape of the car, by testing the way it behaves under frequency input could help get rid of the resonance frequency making the car more stable.

[Mr.Kennedy777]

They’re doing quite a bit of this testing in F1 cars if I am not mistaken.

[Mr.Kennedy777]

We have seen several innovations the last few years on dlm's. Some that even defy the laws of physics. Whats next on the horizon or where do you see room for improvement? Here's mine: I believe fuel cell design to enhance weight transfer. Whats yours?

Honestly, this is a bit of a long shot, but improvements in the materials themselves that make up different parts of the car. For example, graphene. While it’s still expensive at over 200 a gram, it’s use in the development of low oxide polymers has allowed for better products to emerge. Increased thermal conductivity and dimensional stability, increased fire resistance, electromagnetic shielding, stain repellant, reduction of plastic mass, increased impact resistance, increased electrical conductivity if desired, and one better yet, is that it can be incorporated as nanoplatelets in (not a nice word)(not a nice word)(not a nice word)(not a nice word) near any type of rubber, urethane or polymer compound. The potential for use of this product are limitless, graphene is the strongest material ever tested, with an intrinsic tensile strength of 130.5 GPa and a Young's modulus of 1Tpa. Some scientists have been experimenting with it, trying to create an alloy and they’ve made a nickel and copper graphene alloy that makes the copper 500 times as strong as it would be on its own and the nickel 180 times as strong. 0.00004% in weight of graphene increased the strength of the materials by hundreds of times. Those are some direct quotes regarding the implementation of graphene as a structural material. What does this mean for racing though? I think we’re on the brink of super materials becoming common place not just in society but soon levels of competition around the world. I think if they find a way to incorporate it into tires in a legal fashion, the durability of soft compounds could be increased exponentially, which means tire prep could be taken to levels not even seen before. Even without tire prep graphene will increase the tires ability to create traction and increase tread life. Also, it will allow for even lighter tires which is currently not something we can do with current construction and compounds. Something to think about.

[fastford]

Mr. K , I think what you are talking about above would be another nail in the coffin for SLM,s , no average , do a lot of it your self racer like me , would ever be able to afford this , we need ideas within the means as a whole . I do think the tire manufacturers could improve there product though , especially with what there charging for about 10 bucks of raw materials these days , or at least thats what i was told by a distributor a tire cost as far as raw materials go......

[dirtrace09]

i have wandered about going to a down tube chassis , with a bar running from the top , right corner of cage , to where top of right front shock is , kind of like a sprint cage , with the load being applied to the right front these days , less flex might help......TNT built one like this several years back....

I have had two modifieds that I have added an adjustable bar to from a down tube to the rf stub by the shock. It made a very noticeable difference playing on the right track situations by stiffening or letting it flex more. I am not sure though on the late models now how much you need that with all the other adjustments with shocks, tires, springs setups, etc... and no big heavy stub. But, another trick in your tool box I am sure is always helpful.

[petesbuyin]

i have wandered about going to a down tube chassis , with a bar running from the top , right corner of cage , to where top of right front shock is , kind of like a sprint cage , with the load being applied to the right front these days , less flex might help......TNT built one like this several years back....

Charlie Swartz did that 30 years ago. Had them on both left and right, from the top of the cage forward to the upper shock mount. Ran it half a season before he cut them back off.

[Kromulous]

The hand writing is on the wall, it wont be but about 5 years or so and these Chassis will have to SFI Inspected and Certified. Just like Drag racing, Certified to there level of competition. Their doing it on seats now, wont be long. SO that's gonna leave the door open for new designs and materials, plus more $$$

You could go all Tig welded, stress relieve them etc. I see the Chassis cost reaching 10k bare easy.

LOL on the XR1 Fuel Cell too ! I about fell out of my chair, I think that would be a good business to be in !

[fastford]

Charlie Swartz did that 30 years ago. Had them on both left and right, from the top of the cage forward to the upper shock mount. Ran it half a season before he cut them back off.

things have changed a whole bunch in 30 years , the load that is placed on the rt upper shock mount is tremendous when you consider when momentum begins on a soft spring and basically comes to an abrupt stop when it hits the bump stop or second stage.

[Mr.Kennedy777]

Mr. K , I think what you are talking about above would be another nail in the coffin for SLM,s , no average , do a lot of it your self racer like me , would ever be able to afford this , we need ideas within the means as a whole . I do think the tire manufacturers could improve there product though , especially with what there charging for about 10 bucks of raw materials these days , or at least thats what i was told by a distributor a tire cost as far as raw materials go......

Well with the graphene stuff, it’s becoming so much more common everywhere, not that long ago it was over 10,000 a gram, now it’s 98 bucks and it still hasn’t taken a set in the market like it’s going to. Give it a couple years and graphene will be quite cheap. It’s easy to make. Large flake graphite you can get for about 3,000 a tonne (2200 pounds), and you can make graphene powder at home from graphite. A couple of buddies and I are going in on a tonne here and trying our luck making it. If you can make the powder, and not even the sheet graphite, you’re still able to produce a pretty large quantity of it.You just need sulfuric acid to oxidize the graphite and separate the water produced using a filter, and then apply hydrazine to pull the oxygen up. Then you reduce it down to a powder, from there you could use that to apply it many different things. So it seems like it might be nail in the coffin, but realistically it’s not as expensive as it sounds.To put it in perspective, graphene was discovered and first made by two guys using scotch tape on graphite flakes.