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I'll say this about scientific, i was talking to a fast local / regional racer and he was going on and on about .010 of bump steer. How that basically derailed his chance of winning, being fast. Then went on to tell me about how everything had to be so so, down to the rivets. Measures stagger to the 1/16th etc etc
At that point i figured one of 2 things is going on. A lot of delusion, or these guys that are really fast can tell that .010 mills can make a difference in a car, and can feel it.
Have been trying to figure out which one ever since LOL.
One thing i will say thou, guys like Rumley that are Engineers, i work with them all day, they love data. The more numbers the better they feel. So i would guess he would have calculations on various things like stagger etc.
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Yes my 2016 pierce car that I cut all of the mounts off and changed everything in my garage with a jig saw , tubing bender a welder and drill press with a standard bore 430 and 3 differnt brands of shocks, never been on a pulldown rig or anything just done wig plumb bombs angle finders and string lines that I have raced a total of 6 times now including eldora..... completely on my own to decide every adjustment and completely on my own to pay every bill while running a company that takes 70-80 hours a week of my time. What’s described above is definitely double the equipment most people take to eldora ..... yes considering all of that I was clearly the odds on favorite to take home the globe ..... it’s amazing I didn’t win that race ....
And yet for weeks and weeks, you talked trash to Brian Gray! You claimed his info on here was bs, and you could outrun him with a wheelbarrow! And yet YOU didn't! You had superior equipment to him and he still beat you fair and square!
As the old timers say, don't let you alligator mouth write a check your canary rearend cant cash!
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Except he didn’t beat me ....
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And yes everything he says on here is BS
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come on you two , this is the last section on this forum that we can talk and exchange ideas with out the BS , Ive been listening to you two for years on here and i like both of you , BUT , let this sh!t go........
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Fastford he’s just another faceless nameless clown. Anyone who doesn’t say who they are shouldn’t be allowed to post.
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Stick to deck building jonny boy.....that might be the one and only thing you're an expert on!
I bet Brian Gray would love a chance at driving your top of the line Pierce/Cornett around the Big E.....at least the car would know what its like to go fast one time!
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 Originally Posted by Kromulous
I'll say this about scientific, i was talking to a fast local / regional racer and he was going on and on about .010 of bump steer. How that basically derailed his chance of winning, being fast. Then went on to tell me about how everything had to be so so, down to the rivets. Measures stagger to the 1/16th etc etc
At that point i figured one of 2 things is going on. A lot of delusion, or these guys that are really fast can tell that .010 mills can make a difference in a car, and can feel it.
Have been trying to figure out which one ever since LOL.
One thing i will say thou, guys like Rumley that are Engineers, i work with them all day, they love data. The more numbers the better they feel. So i would guess he would have calculations on various things like stagger etc.
That guy is full of crap...
Modern Day Wedge Racing
Florence -2
Atomic - 1
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Originally Posted by MasterSbilt_Racer
That guy is full of crap...
I myself can't feel anything under. .012 bump .................
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The idea of feeling 0.010 of bump steer when the RF stays compressed and the tires start toed out .375 and feeling 1/16” of stagger when stagger changes almost every time you measure the tire is laughable.
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This reminds me of the time gray did a video of holding a fence post against the tire while
Someone jumps up and down on the front end as a way of measuring bump steer
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20K to win 100 lap race...
2 drivers lead most of the laps and ran next to each other for most of the race, until late when another got both of them and won (passed them about lap 87 or so).
Those 2 cars where the same brand and very close on set up and car A has X stagger while car B has Y stagger. X - Y equaled 2" difference. I don't know what stagger the winning car ran so can't comment.
So how do you make a calculation on which car had the right and which had the wrong stagger out of car A and B?
Hmmm.
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Originally Posted by billetbirdcage
20K to win 100 lap race...
2 drivers lead most of the laps and ran next to each other for most of the race, until late when another got both of them and won (passed them about lap 87 or so).
Those 2 cars where the same brand and very close on set up and car A has X stagger while car B has Y stagger. X - Y equaled 2" difference. I don't know what stagger the winning car ran so can't comment.
So how do you make a calculation on which car had the right and which had the wrong stagger out of car A and B?
Hmmm.
Maybe they were both wrong......and that's why Z won! 
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Here is a puzzle for someone to try:
Say I have 4" stagger measuring off the car and 6PSI on LR tire and 10 in RR:
What is the true stagger the car see's?
How much does the stagger change from the RR and/or LR tires being loaded differently at certain points of the corner?
How much does my LR tire diameter change on the straight (higher wheel RPM), if I was using a "Wide" tire on LR vs a STD LR tire?
My RR tire is 92" in circumference, what is the actual rolling circumference with the static weight on the tire and what is it at max load at some point on the track?
something to think about....
Last edited by billetbirdcage; 10-19-2018 at 05:04 PM.
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Originally Posted by Kromulous
At that point i figured one of 2 things is going on. A lot of delusion, or these guys that are really fast can tell that .010 mills can make a difference in a car, and can feel it.
Have been trying to figure out which one ever since LOL.
If you believe the myth (true or not, I have no idea - IMO it's myth) that been told to me so many times over the years by numerous people:
Bloomer is testing with a shock company, makes some laps comes in and tells the shock guy it needs 1 more click of rebound and tells him to add it on this corner. Well shock guys say even the best of drivers can't feel one click so he does 2 clicks. Scott makes some more laps comes in and rages on shock guy:
"I told you one click not two"
LOL......Shrugs
Note# this was supposedly on the almost full open range on the shock like the LR rebound where 1 click makes very very little change
Last edited by billetbirdcage; 10-19-2018 at 05:20 PM.
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Originally Posted by billetbirdcage
Here is a puzzle for someone to try:
Say I have 4" stagger measuring off the car and 6PSI on LR tire and 10 in RR:
What is the true stagger the car see's?
How much does the stagger change from the RR and/or LR tires being loaded differently at certain points of the corner?
How much does my LR tire diameter change on the straight (higher wheel RPM), if I was using a "Wide" tire on LR vs a STD LR tire?
My RR tire is 92" in circumference, what is the actual rolling circumference with the static weight on the tire and what is it at max load at some point on the track?
something to think about....
That was Mr Furneys contention some 10-15 years ago. He always contended that you added an x amount of % to the static stagger based on different track conditions.
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Cant use quotes, but Billet i have heard some strange things about Bloomquist. My brother watches him like a Hawk and he says he has brake bias / shut offs on all 4 corners. I dont know thou, obvously he is a special breed so who knows.
Im not much of an arguing type of guy, most of the guys i talk to tell me these type of things and i just nod and agree but in my mind i always wonder where reality fits in.
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Originally Posted by Kromulous
Cant use quotes, but Billet i have heard some strange things about Bloomquist. My brother watches him like a Hawk and he says he has brake bias / shut offs on all 4 corners. I dont know thou, obvously he is a special breed so who knows.
Im not much of an arguing type of guy, most of the guys i talk to tell me these type of things and i just nod and agree but in my mind i always wonder where reality fits in.
I've noticed it looks like his RR rarely sparks where his LR is like a flame thrower, wasn't sure if it was different pads on each side or just my eyes playing tricks or??? I think it helps keep heat out of the RR as well. I just didn't think that would be enough brake for most of these cars especially the brake dragging guys
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That would only matter if his rear end is unlocked which is may be.
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Perhaps he has an air locker?
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