Weekly Racing / Josh King / Changes need to be made

[thexfactor0210]

Just listened to Josh King's interview on DoD. He basically eas asked if weekly racing can survive and did not sound very optimistic about it. He said the ones in charge do not eant to make the necessary changes. Why can we not do something to save this sport???

I personally do not want to see 20 cars for every normal Lucas show with no weekly or regional guys to cheer for. It seems as if they are afraid to make changes and adapt. I know it will not be a true open late model but it is time to outlaw wide bore motors and these crazy shocks. Get the motors back down to 20,000 and shocks for 100 each or in that neighborhood. I recently saw a Chris Simpson post where he said the motor he was selling would be 60,000 new!!!

What is everyone's thoughts and why haven't we seen any changes? I know this topic has been discussed over and over but I feel it needs to be. If Florence struggles to fill a weekly program like they are it is nearing the end for weekly late models.

[Barbecueboy]

I've seen some weekly late model guys switch to other classes .....a couple of brothers that used to race them in the Carolina's weekly now race the legends class mostly.

And race it well and put on a show almost every time.......the economics of big dlm racing just don't work anymore for the guys running local.

[JabberJaws83]

The number of series and tracks running $3000 to $5000 to win in the surrounding area hurts as well.

[mcarter815]

I think weekly racing in all classes will be gone in 15 years and we'll be doing club racing like sports car guys do now.

[dirty-white-boy]

Just listened to Josh King's interview on DoD. He basically eas asked if weekly racing can survive and did not sound very optimistic about it. He said the ones in charge do not eant to make the necessary changes. Why can we not do something to save this sport???

I personally do not want to see 20 cars for every normal Lucas show with no weekly or regional guys to cheer for. It seems as if they are afraid to make changes and adapt. I know it will not be a true open late model but it is time to outlaw wide bore motors and these crazy shocks. Get the motors back down to 20,000 and shocks for 100 each or in that neighborhood. I recently saw a Chris Simpson post where he said the motor he was selling would be 60,000 new!!!

What is everyone's thoughts and why haven't we seen any changes? I know this topic has been discussed over and over but I feel it needs to be. If Florence struggles to fill a weekly program like they are it is nearing the end for weekly late models.

I was thinking the same thing as I sat at his Lucas Oil race waiting over an hour and a half watching his water and push trucks make laps 'preparing the track'....

All talk and no actions.

[MasterSbilt_Racer]

The reason nothing is done is simple. Lucas oil calls the shots. If Lucas changes a rule, all the lower series and tracks follow. Lucas allowed the bodies to morph to wedge cars.

The crying about wide bore engines and shocks is just noise. It doesn't even matter. Fix the bodies. That might even include a reduced spoiler. Then the rest takes care of itself.

[Josh Bayko]

The reason nothing is done is simple. Lucas oil calls the shots. If Lucas changes a rule, all the lower series and tracks follow. Lucas allowed the bodies to morph to wedge cars.

The crying about wide bore engines and shocks is just noise. It doesn't even matter. Fix the bodies. That might even include a reduced spoiler. Then the rest takes care of itself.

Bodies don't even have to change all that much. Make the deck and roof flat and the nose straight and symmetrical and it would help a bunch. Take a couple inches off the spoiler and that would help too.

[MasterSbilt_Racer]

Bodies don't even have to change all that much. Make the deck and roof flat and the nose straight and symmetrical and it would help a bunch. Take a couple inches off the spoiler and that would help too.

You are correct. Its a lot from a work standpoint, but it isn't a huge change. Decks should return to level from front to back and side to side. Roofs should have zero rake in any direction. Deck height should return to 36". That would slow the cars down mechanically too. Forces the fuel cell down.

AND NO NOSE SPLITTERS

[thexfactor0210]

I agree bodies need to be altered. But changing the bodies does not lower the cost of motors,shocks,tires,etc.

On the other hand I feel that teams have gotten spoiled eith their fancy haulers that are nicer than most homes. If a guy wants to rough it and save a few bucks on a hauler he can to run regionally. Look at some of the haulers guys hhave and they dont ever leave their own state. It is crazy. I recall even the nascar xfinity teams in the 80's used to all be vans and open trailers. At the King Royal, a guy named Brandon Winmer ran really well. His hauler was an astro van and an open trailer.

[MasterSbilt_Racer]

I agree bodies need to be altered. But changing the bodies does not lower the cost of motors,shocks,tires,etc.

On the other hand I feel that teams have gotten spoiled eith their fancy haulers that are nicer than most homes. If a guy wants to rough it and save a few bucks on a hauler he can to run regionally. Look at some of the haulers guys hhave and they dont ever leave their own state. It is crazy. I recall even the nascar xfinity teams in the 80's used to all be vans and open trailers. At the King Royal, a guy named Brandon Winmer ran really well. His hauler was an astro van and an open trailer.

The bodies MAKE YOU NEED ALL THE POWER YOU CAN GET. Shocks? A used set of Ohlins can win races. You don't have to have a $1200 "air shock". Tires really are a decent value, if you compare to most forms of racing. There will always be ways to waste money. You can't keep people from doing that. You can set rules that allow the budget constrained to compete.

[Josh Bayko]

You are correct. Its a lot from a work standpoint, but it isn't a huge change. Decks should return to level from front to back and side to side. Roofs should have zero rake in any direction. Deck height should return to 36". That would slow the cars down mechanically too. Forces the fuel cell down.

AND NO NOSE SPLITTERS

I fear the splitters are probably here to stay, unfortunately, but if we could get em back to '08 dimensions it would be a big help. If we got the whole bodies back to '08 dimensions everything would be better off.

[Barbecueboy]

I fear the splitters are probably here to stay, unfortunately, but if we could get em back to '08 dimensions it would be a big help. If we got the whole bodies back to '08 dimensions everything would be better off.

Can I get an amen ????

[manwplan]

You don't need a 60k wide bore. A Clements standard bore is 38k and more than adequate to run supers weekly. And the shock deal I agree with MB is just noise and ridiculous. You'll never get a shock that's $100. A good mono tube or twin tube non adjustable shock is $250. If you make me run those I'll have 4 for each corner. Now you have saved me nothing. I can't agree with MB enough, fix the (not a nice word)(not a nice word)(not a nice word)(not a nice word) bodies and everything else will fix itself!!! Who thought the 5" drop deck with a 70 degree left side angle was ok? The first car that showed up like that should have been shown the door instead of changing the rules to accommodate.

[MasterSbilt_Racer]

I fear the splitters are probably here to stay, unfortunately, but if we could get em back to '08 dimensions it would be a big help. If we got the whole bodies back to '08 dimensions everything would be better off.

The body piece manufacturers have too much inventory and sponsor too much?

[MasterSbilt_Racer]

You don't need a 60k wide bore. A Clements standard bore is 38k and more than adequate to run supers weekly. And the shock deal I agree with MB is just noise and ridiculous. You'll never get a shock that's $100. A good mono tube or twin tube non adjustable shock is $250. If you make me run those I'll have 4 for each corner. Now you have saved me nothing. I can't agree with MB enough, fix the (not a nice word)(not a nice word)(not a nice word)(not a nice word) bodies and everything else will fix itself!!! Who thought the 5" drop deck with a 70 degree left side angle was ok? The first car that showed up like that should have been shown the door instead of changing the rules to accommodate.

You bring up more great points. Claw the body back enough, that Clements engine is way overkill. I've never worked on a car with an engine half that good.

[lokwaidid]

i'm just a spectator, but me and a few other guys have said this for years. the "how fast do you want to go?" and "how much money do you have?" philosophy is killing racing. I can't begin to understand why engine and chassis builders don't get together and to build more affordable products. they can't be selling as much product as the were 10 years ago. ump was formed back in the 80's to make the track rules and cars more fair and uniform for everyone. why woo and lucas can't see that there is a problem with car counts and track closings is beyond me. there are a lot fewer tracks now than 10 years ago and more and more will continue to close. they sell there dates to tracks and after that they don't care. they have their money. I went to my first race 60 years ago and the best racing had to offer was , I think, in the 80's. car counts and the number of tracks to choose from was a lot better. i'm sure , as always, someone will come on here and say racing is just fine. personally, I think that you are clueless or blind. these other guys that posted before about what can be done to the cars are right. change the body rules and eliminate the need for 800 horsepower and maybe late model racing might survive.

[Josh Bayko]

The body piece manufacturers have too much inventory and sponsor too much?

That has a lot to do with it. Thing is, if you change noses, everybody is gonna have to buy new ones anyways. I don't think they've realized that yet. There's good money to be made in saving racers money on bodies.

[thexfactor0210]

You don't need a 60k wide bore. A Clements standard bore is 38k and more than adequate to run supers weekly. And the shock deal I agree with MB is just noise and ridiculous. You'll never get a shock that's $100. A good mono tube or twin tube non adjustable shock is $250. If you make me run those I'll have 4 for each corner. Now you have saved me nothing. I can't agree with MB enough, fix the (not a nice word)(not a nice word)(not a nice word)(not a nice word) bodies and everything else will fix itself!!! Who thought the 5" drop deck with a 70 degree left side angle was ok? The first car that showed up like that should have been shown the door instead of changing the rules to accommodate.

38k for a motor is still ridiculous. Guys making anything less than 80-100k a year will struggle to keep a late model with that. Then god forbid if you blow it or have to rebuild it.

Check out the cash money series in Missouri. Super cheap shocks. They actually have guys who would never have raced and have dug out their cars because it is affordable.

I like the article recently with Mark Richards where he talked about the 525 aluminum motor being brought in to complete along with the open motors. Whether they go off weight break or bigger spoiler or whatever.

[dirtcrazy4u]

You can change all the rules you want. Guys are then going to find more costly ways to run up front. Are costs to hi ? no doubt. You had shock manufactures that used teams to test there product. After getting that team to the front beating the competition the phones rang off the hook. The shock manufactures said sure 5k and there yours. The best thing right now for wrg and Lucas to do is have rules consistent over the next 5, 10 years. Then if that manufacturer comes up with something new and the cost are double, O well to bad.

The chassis builders are probably the last ones that got on this bandwagon. Look at what a new xr-1 costs today. Longhorns, bwrc new icon.

If you compare many of the 'bolt on parts' many are still affordable. Seats are another one, ever price a full containment seat today.

[MasterSbilt_Racer]

You can change all the rules you want. Guys are then going to find more costly ways to run up front. Are costs to hi ? no doubt. You had shock manufactures that used teams to test there product. After getting that team to the front beating the competition the phones rang off the hook. The shock manufactures said sure 5k and there yours. The best thing right now for wrg and Lucas to do is have rules consistent over the next 5, 10 years. Then if that manufacturer comes up with something new and the cost are double, O well to bad.

The chassis builders are probably the last ones that got on this bandwagon. Look at what a new xr-1 costs today. Longhorns, bwrc new icon.

If you compare many of the 'bolt on parts' many are still affordable. Seats are another one, ever price a full containment seat today.

More traction is more cost. Its simple. Of course people will look for speed within the rules. Killing the wedge saved LM racing. We have them again. Those are the facts.