Who is telling the truth about SLMs?

[mcarter815]

I was just out to the campground last week. The $50K plus campers and boats were everywhere I tell ya. They were paying all kinds of money for those camping spots and boat certifications and licenses and such. I didn't hear 1 person bitching about not getting paid enough.

Hobby racing isn't a professional racing endeavor. You have professional racers and then you have hobby racers. People confuse the two all the time. Hobby racers are lucky that they can get back a few bucks here and there for putting on something for a fan.

SLM has become more of a professional racers class. The hobby racing a SLM is what has left the building most likely completely naked.

Those campers don't depreciate as fast as an SLM does. They're also likely mostly financed. You could get a brand new SLM and total it the first night out and it's not going to be insured.

[Waldo]

And I guess somebody didn't see when I said a CRATE LATEMODEL qualified 10th out of 25 supers on a wet TACKY track.

[nc mudcat]

Not knocking your series out there. Probably does produce great racing. But that 3rd sentence says it all.

It does say it all, but the question is what does that mean to most people. For those of us that just want good racing, we don't need to see the big dogs every week. I don't care if the guy I am watching has never been heard of. And it means more to me when I do get to see the big dogs.

I am also not hung up on supers like so many are. For me, I want to see the best racing. At my local track, that is not supers. The track can't handle the supers and it gets so dusty you can't see them. I'll take 604s over that any day. On the right track, give me supers, but not on my local track.

[Jim11h]

Sounds like your local track needs fixed not dumbed down

[Waldo]

What is your local track?
Do they run supers weekly?
What is the pay?
Who has retired racing supers there?

[nc mudcat]

Sounds like your local track needs fixed not dumbed down

Okay, call the promoter and tell him. Everyone around here has already tried that, to no avail. So I stand by the fact that I want to see the best races. If it is not supers, then I am good with it. Why would anyone avoid a good crate race (yes, I realize some think there is no such thing, and you have the right to be wrong) because there is no super race? Just makes no sense to me.

Again, I love the supers, and will travel to see them at the right track. I make several trips every year to Wythe to see supers race, and they put on a great show there. But I won't swear off racing just because there are no supers on a particular night on my home track.

[Rocky]

Mastersbilt..

I know engines are expensive.. my counter to that is not all tracks take a big motor. Guy with a good limited can be competitive at some tracks but get beat on $5000 shock packages. Not saying my shock idea is awesome just a thought.

I have about $5000 in my shocks and I'm the worst driver in North Carolina. Now would making them illegal save me any money?

There isn't really anything wrong with your idea. The problem is just that the guys with the money are gonna spend it to stomp our azz. Always have, always will. Heck if I was smart enough I could out fox those guys, I'd just hire a good driver and beat them. I wouldn't tell the world how to stop them.

I think that the illusion that there's some sort of parity has evaporated and the top 10 teams in the country are so far above all on a mountaintop that it clouds everything else.

Would it make all these guys here on 4m feel better if the "Super" feature was still called the "A" main and the Limited or 604 race was called the "B main" and the 602 race was called the "C" main? Because it's the same, it's always been the same.

What skin off of anybody's hind end is it that these guys have their own feature?

Some of these guys don't go to weekly races anyway, so who really cares just watch a PPV Lucas race with a cold one and enjoy then when the traveling circus comes to town, go watch. There's a few millionaires that are down with running the big show for all. We can be thankful for those guys but a lot of fans need to understand why the local guy isn't showing up to be the Washington Generals anymore or is choosing a different division. It's all good there's a place for all of it.

[Rocky]

Super latemodel is a class in which aluminum or steel fits and rules are limited to allow almost any combination of car motor suspension chassis design etc.

Crate, limited, etc have more specific rules!

Lots of areas the tracks have 3-4 classes that all look identical and that kills the headliner in this situation. Super, limited, 604, & 602 all at same track in own divisions, you really think the casual fan knows difference? All they know is its a latemodel

Yes, I am aware of the rules differences. What I'm not really aware of is how many actual Super Late models there really are. 400, 500 maybe? (I think that number is too big)

I can tell you for sure that when you get out into some places in the country that there's cars running as Supers that absolutely positively would be limiteds in the South.

Would you like to see the 602 class bodied in vintage Camaro bodies? That could be cool.

Maybe we rename the divisions A-B-C and allow advancement for more money into the next feature race but maintain points funds separately. Present the illusion.

[MasterSbilt_Racer]

Hell, I don't know anybody local to me who has ever retired racing a Latemodel. You know why? Because it dosen't exist. And when N.C. Mudcat said that the Blue ridge series dosen't pay much, that was totaly directed for the South. That Series pays as good as Supers running in the Midwest on a weekly bases.

We can race for $2k+ every Saturday night, on a local show, around here.

[EvelB7]

The Blue Ridge Outlaws does a good job and has its place around here (NC area). Biggest issue is they have is their shows are spread out a little to far for the car base (from North Georgia to Beckley and down to Sumter), hard for them to get many to follow the complete series because of this.

[Waldo]

Masterbilt racer, The mmsa stock 4's down here race for $1,000 to $1,500 to win ever week.

[Waldo]

Fwd, U cars have 10 to 12 races a year within a 100 mile radius of my house every year paying over $1,000 to win.

[Waldo]

Let's see.........................
$50,000 late model
$2,000 4 cylinder

I guess it makes sense............................................. .................not

[MasterSbilt_Racer]

Masterbilt racer, The mmsa stock 4's down here race for $1,000 to $1,500 to win ever week.

Looks like blue ridge doesn't.

[Waldo]

They do, and again good job spending $50,000 to win $2,000. ...........BRAVO

[Jking24]

People make shocks expensive. I just had 2 complete sets of Ohlins redone for $1600. One set was a pile of trash I took a chance on and they ended up needing a lot of parts. Despite their age, the shocks are still the same internals as what Jimmy Owens is killing people with. It would cost 50 stacks to buy Jimmy's engine and $12k to freshen it.

Totally off the current subject but I'm really glad to see ohlins get back in the game. They were by far the most reliable and durable shocks we have ever run.

[MasterSbilt_Racer]

They do, and again good job spending $50,000 to win $2,000. ...........BRAVO

Spend $50k? Never spent $20k.

[Waldo]

Alright man. I respect you. Guess i was just saying the spending in forms of racing dosen"t add up to me. If you can run a Late model program under 20 thousand, I respect that. You got to understand from my point of view, their are guys running what you would call hobby stock spending that.

[NorthAlabama]

It still begs the question, Supers were common in this area. Is it un-organized management who has managed themselves into more problems and higher cost? Fans want power, speed and thrills, not speaking for local family club racing. The Duck (Duck River) and The Mag (Magnolia) gave it up weekly but has specials. Fort Payne and TST (Talladega Short Track) here in Bama last year were running open motor Supers weekly. They did, why can't anybody else do it? Yes, most tacks are running Super Specials in the their season which is keeping Supers alive and the making for more touring series, than goodness. Maybe LLM at TST can tune in and give his thinking on why TST is the leading track in the South!...

[NorthAlabama]

This is a perfect example. Moulton started running in their early season I think it was last year pulling some fans with this new management needing to build the business. More than a dozen Supers, than a pay dispute about not paying the promised purse a couple of weeks later with fewer cars. Which led to only a couple of cars showing up the next time. That ended Supers, management cut that class. Then the fans left. Then management did not pay the 604s, they then cut the 604s which started a downward trend. Then a issues with paying the 602s. Do you get the picture. This is the typical fly by night management of our time, cut at the top no matter that Supers is what made racing in this area which drew the fans which kept the tracks going for years. Management don't invest in their track, but think they do. Cutting at the top is the easy way out, a sign of poor management. Also, tracks and Supers got lazy, just look at their ads? Don't see any! So everybody went to 602s and 604s to cut cost to be able to at least race nearby. We know all late models still cost an arm and a leg even without an open motor. Now it is a shock cost issue, what will be the next issue? I went to a late season race at TST with a full field of Supers, limited, 604s and 602s. But how does TST do it? Why other tracks fail?