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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Posts
    433

    Default Attn. Rick schwallie

    First of all, I am a fan of Hudson O,Neal. I do not have a problem with the lucky dog rule.

    But your rule that lets any driver stop on the track to bring out a caution just so they can go the hot pit and make an adjustment to their car without a penalty is wrong, It is a LAME rule and you have the authority and the power to change it.

    And I do not think you should wait until the end of the season. DO IT NOW....

    Thanks in advance, do the right thing George Camp

  2. #2
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    1,480

    Default

    What should the "penalty" be?

  3. #3
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    116

    Default

    At the very least it should be that you lose a lap. I wouldn't argue if the penalty was a dq for the night. You see it way too often that guys will stop to bring out a caution and then drive away and head for the hot pit only to rejoin the field in time for the restart with zero consequences.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Posts
    709

    Default

    Simple fix is that no adjustments are allowed. Only thing you can do is change a flat tire.

    I agree that sometimes the 100 lappers end up screwing the drivers who start and stay up front because they cannot give up the front to pit like those further back can.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Posts
    363

    Default

    There is a penalty for bringing out a caution. You go to the tail. That seems penalty enough. Now, why a Short Track Late Model Series, who traditionally run 40 and 50 lappers, with the occasional 100 lapper needs a lucky dog rule for a car to get its lap back makes NO sense to me.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jan 2018
    Posts
    525

    Default

    The real penalty goes to the guy who is leading and has to regroup under caution. A guy getting ready to be lapped stops the race, adjusts his car and moves on... Should not happen, put them a lap down for causing the caution. I do not blame the teams for taking advantage, the series needs to step up and fix it.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    14,052

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Tireguy17 View Post
    Simple fix is that no adjustments are allowed. Only thing you can do is change a flat tire.

    I agree that sometimes the 100 lappers end up screwing the drivers who start and stay up front because they cannot give up the front to pit like those further back can.
    Seems simple enough to me. If you do you lose a lap

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Feb 2015
    Posts
    671

    Default

    It's the rules makers fault that racers just take advantage of the option to stop and draw a yellow. I've always despised it, both as a racer and as a fan and it for certain cost me a few wins when I prided myself on getting off the track when I could. Taught my son that way too and he does the same. He still remembers attending the first Ohio Speedweek for the Sprints in 1983 and at Sharon it was a rough night and the main was struggling to get finished at 1:30 A.M.
    Bobby Davis, a star out of the Memphis area, stopped in front of the flagstand because he was out of tearoffs with a couple to go. Crowd was ready to lynch him and my then 7 year old asked me why he did that. I told him it was hard to explain and he said he'd never do that.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    1,480

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by raburke23 View Post
    There is a penalty for bringing out a caution. You go to the tail. That seems penalty enough. Now, why a Short Track Late Model Series, who traditionally run 40 and 50 lappers, with the occasional 100 lapper needs a lucky dog rule for a car to get its lap back makes NO sense to me.
    But you don't go the tail, you go behind the last car on the lead lap. The "penalty" doesn't always fit the "crime".

  10. #10
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    3,266

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by NY DIRT View Post
    First of all, I am a fan of Hudson O,Neal. I do not have a problem with the lucky dog rule.

    But your rule that lets any driver stop on the track to bring out a caution just so they can go the hot pit and make an adjustment to their car without a penalty is wrong, It is a LAME rule and you have the authority and the power to change it.

    And I do not think you should wait until the end of the season. DO IT NOW....

    Thanks in advance, do the right thing George Camp
    Totally agree. If you stop and do not have a flat tire, then you should be done for the event (or put a lap down).

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Posts
    645

    Default

    It has been this way for at least the last 40 years that I've been involved in racing, now it's an issue because the driver came back and won. Here's the deal, you stop on the track with a flat and they GIVE you 2 laps to change it. Any other issue, you best get done before the race restarts (no courtesy laps). Why do you all feel that a flat tire is fine to cause a caution for, but not a shock that needs work? Isn't it the same dang thing? Debris on the track can jack up a shock just as well as a tire. Personally, I'm more irritated by the same guys getting provisionals all the time, only to be the first caution.

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Posts
    636

    Default

    bringing out an intentional caution on pavement is worse than the plague, on dirt its just part of how they do things. theres gotta be some middle ground because stopping a race because you dont like how your cars handling should have more punishment than going to the end of lead lap cars

  13. #13
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Batavia, OH
    Posts
    12,078

    Default

    There is already a rule that forbids bringing out a caution for your benefit and NOT because of a mechanical problem. It's section 5.12.3 N.

    Much like body rules, it's just words on paper.
    Last edited by MasterSbilt_Racer; 10-06-2021 at 08:05 AM.
    Droop isn't the problem.

    Arizona Speedway - 2 ........ Brushcreek -1
    Alltech -1 .................... Eldora - 8
    East Bay - 6 .................. Richmond -1
    Florence -1 ................. Lawrenceburg -1
    Atomic -6 .................. Circle City -1
    Tazewell -1 .................. Mudlick-1
    Moler -4
    Portsmouth -3 .....................Tyler Co. -1

  14. #14
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Batavia, OH
    Posts
    12,078

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Tireguy17 View Post
    Simple fix is that no adjustments are allowed. Only thing you can do is change a flat tire.

    I agree that sometimes the 100 lappers end up screwing the drivers who start and stay up front because they cannot give up the front to pit like those further back can.
    Adjustments, when made in the pit, during someone else's caution, should be allowed.
    Droop isn't the problem.

    Arizona Speedway - 2 ........ Brushcreek -1
    Alltech -1 .................... Eldora - 8
    East Bay - 6 .................. Richmond -1
    Florence -1 ................. Lawrenceburg -1
    Atomic -6 .................. Circle City -1
    Tazewell -1 .................. Mudlick-1
    Moler -4
    Portsmouth -3 .....................Tyler Co. -1

  15. #15

    Default

    it's ironic this was the Pittsburgher. I remember, I think 1993, Bloomquist got up out of the groove and stopped in turn 4. As soon as the caution came out, he dove in for a new RR tire. Came back and won the race.
    This has been going on forever. That was nearly 30 yrs ago.
    After the race he said, he knew what everybody was on, and that it wasn't the right tire, and he knew everybody would be changing tires, and he wanted to be the first.

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Posts
    709

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by MasterSbilt_Racer View Post
    Adjustments, when made in the pit, during someone else's caution, should be allowed.
    Agree to disagree. The setup you leave your trailer with is what you should run the entire race with. Flat tires and damage happen. If you missed the setup that's on you and shouldn't be able to adjust that mid-race IMO.

  17. #17
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Batavia, OH
    Posts
    12,078

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Tireguy17 View Post
    Agree to disagree. The setup you leave your trailer with is what you should run the entire race with. Flat tires and damage happen. If you missed the setup that's on you and shouldn't be able to adjust that mid-race IMO.
    What's the crew for? They should have some involvement in the race. No adjustment? That sounds silly to me. Even NASCAR isn't that rigid. The enforcement would be very difficult also. How you going to catch me twisting a shock nob when I'm beating a fender out?
    Last edited by MasterSbilt_Racer; 10-06-2021 at 11:20 AM.
    Droop isn't the problem.

    Arizona Speedway - 2 ........ Brushcreek -1
    Alltech -1 .................... Eldora - 8
    East Bay - 6 .................. Richmond -1
    Florence -1 ................. Lawrenceburg -1
    Atomic -6 .................. Circle City -1
    Tazewell -1 .................. Mudlick-1
    Moler -4
    Portsmouth -3 .....................Tyler Co. -1

  18. #18
    Join Date
    Feb 2020
    Location
    FL
    Posts
    10

    Default

    Here's the biggest problem I see with Lucas Oil if a car stops on the track like Essex's golden boy did without a flat is the amount of laps they run after the car pits. If the car pits then the race should be restarted the next lap however that is not the case. Sometimes they get more than the 2 laps which I believe was the case in this situation. If the car that stopped is in the pits then why are they running so many laps? Lucas should take some pointers from Eldora. Just my opinion.

  19. #19
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Sheridan Ar
    Posts
    666

    Default

    Stopping on the track. Spinning another driver out. Heck a driver can just as easily spin out himself and bring out a caution. Then he can go duck in the pits and make a change. It don't matter. A caution is a caution. There is no rule that has been broken and it's always been this way. Like I said in a previous post. Earl could have pitted just like Hudson did. He admitted he was too tight when they stopped for fuel. Maybe if he did he would have won. As it stands he didn't and got outran. End of story.

  20. #20
    Join Date
    Feb 2017
    Posts
    2,224

    Default

    Why is everybody so but hurt over Hudson winning ? Bloomer has done this for years. I give him credit for making the call on the front shock adjustment. He got locked down on the bottom and was the fastest car after that, that's all there is to it. Everybody wanted EPJ to win because of the garbage he was wheeling for the last 3 years. At times luck is your best friend and if you ask anyone I bet they have a story on how they won a big race with luck on there side.

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