Will SLM’s ever be as fast as 410 Sprints?

[Rajflyboy]

Is this possible some day? Big weight difference obviously. Motors are similar. I’d love to see this someday.

[Jed]

I hope not. Billy Moyer made a good point comparing NASCAR to DLM at Bristol. It’s pretty hard to have good racing when you’re wide open all the way around the track.

[Morgs153]

410 winged sprints vs. open supers? No. Physics just won't allow it.

The weight difference along with the amount of downforce they get from that wing is too much of an advantage to overcome since the engines are pretty close in horsepower outputs. You'd need a certain variable that would provide a real offset in the equation.

Racing is never really good when the track is faster than the car.

[play4kps]

Jed, 100% right

[MasterSbilt_Racer]

Not a chance. You can't really trump power to weight ratio, especially when the light car has that wing too.

[MasterSbilt_Racer]

Now comparison of non wing to late model, they are in the ballpark of each other now.

[over4T]

In 1989 or '90 the CA wedge cars known as POSSEE ran our little 1/4 red clay track in Grass Valley once and our very good winged 360 Sprints were the backup class. Jim Tryon with his small block Ford wedge was nearly a half second faster than the 360s and broke their track record speed by something like .3 seconds.

Some of our local LM guys ran against the POSSEE cars and it was almost embarrassing. I had only been in the Late Models a couple of years and really hadn't figured out what was what yet and wisely sat that one out. Couple of years later I ran several shows with POSSEE and if I finished top 5 I was thrilled. Those were the most fun things I ever drove even if my results weren't exactly impressive.

[Josh Bayko]

No. It’s simple physics.

[muddy mike]

They were pretty close back in the all star circuit of champions days.

[3 wide]

No way mainly do to weight but I have always thought if the weight on crates was lower that they would be a lot closer to supers and the sprints put on twice the show as late models.

[manwplan]

give a late model a side board and they'll go just as fast.

[Tireguy17]

Just food for thought. These are the 2 track records at Cedar Lake Speedway, which have held up over the years. Obviously this was when tires were as soft as bubble gum.

Sprint Car - 10.775 - Terry McCarl - Sept. 11, 2004
Late Model - 12.972 - Jason Rauen - June 17, 2011

[Paradox28]

its not a physics issue, its a rules issue. If a super late model could run sideboards and wings and splitters and all that, they could just as easily go as fast as a 410.

[MasterSbilt_Racer]

its not a physics issue, its a rules issue. If a super late model could run sideboards and wings and splitters and all that, they could just as easily go as fast as a 410.

If they still weigh twice as much, no they can't.

[manwplan]

If they still weigh twice as much, no they can't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jjp4tI0zASw

This night here the board cars had lap times capable of running top 5 with the sprint cars. No they weren't fast enough to win but they are close.

[slideiton]

DLM record is almost 2 seconds quicker than a nonwing 410 at Knoxville, but then that DLM record is another 2 seconds slower than the 410 wing record. The one lap 305 record is on pace with the DLM record at Knoxville.

[MasterSbilt_Racer]

DLM record is almost 2 seconds quicker than a nonwing 410 at Knoxville, but then that DLM record is another 2 seconds slower than the 410 wing record. The one lap 305 record is on pace with the DLM record at Knoxville.

At eldora, non wing 410 and late model records are nearly identical. Winged sprint is about 2 secs better.

[Paradox28]

If they still weigh twice as much, no they can't.

a super LM and a top fuel dragster weigh nearly the same. Weight isn't the issue..its the power to weight ratio and having enough downforce to use the power it would require to go that fast.

[zach51]

a super LM and a top fuel dragster weigh nearly the same. Weight isn't the issue..its the power to weight ratio and having enough downforce to use the power it would require to go that fast.

Well, there is a centrifugal force issue there too....and traction. Nascars at Talladega go alot faster than they do at Bristol, same car, in fact LESS power.....so?

[MasterSbilt_Racer]

a super LM and a top fuel dragster weigh nearly the same. Weight isn't the issue..its the power to weight ratio and having enough downforce to use the power it would require to go that fast.

They have the same power, so weight IS the factor in the power to weight ratio.

The top fuel dragster also has a bigger tire, operating at a higher friction coefficient. Again, that advantage goes to the sprint car.