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hmm golden retriever making burgers?? In my profession I see people that live WAY outside the means they should be and would rather complain about what stuff costs rather than stop doing it or get another job to make it...
Sad part is that if all the wealth in the world was cut equally and given to us within 5 years the people that are broke now would be again..
Hope everyone has a nice Easter
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 Originally Posted by TackyTracker
hmm golden retriever making burgers?? In my profession I see people that live WAY outside the means they should be and would rather complain about what stuff costs rather than stop doing it or get another job to make it...
Sad part is that if all the wealth in the world was cut equally and given to us within 5 years the people that are broke now would be again..
Hope everyone has a nice Easter
True in 5 years, any money given to the poorer, would gravitate to the rich again. That is due to the system the rich lobbied for. You and me kind of guys didn't have the money or intelligence to lobby for our system. The unions used to do it for us, but there has been a strong media attack against them, for quite some time. We all hear about the one lazy guy that uses the union to keep his job, while we hire crooked politicians and let them keep their job. The politicians decide the tax laws, what to tax, if we operate in the red or black. There wasn't even a mention of the FED in2013, when the contract ran out, that will never let us operate in the black again. You must know, every taxpayer or potential taxpayer owes the FED, something like 50,000k. Now you want to talk about a guy living above their means. That would be our elected officials I always see this argument about money going back to the rich. make the laws favor the working man and he will earn it. The economy will be robust and many more opportunities.The rich will still make out ok. It's just that their greed won't be satisfied.
Racing has never been cheap. In the 50s, I could build a competitive car for well under 1k, but min wage was 50 cents. A good job paid 80 dollars a week. Granted the aftermarket sales was minimal from Honest Charly or Speedway motors. Even in the good old days, when Smart went fast, it took months of paychecks to build a car, but not like today. If your going to race, your going to have hardships. I have seen guys give up family, homes and everything they own to race, even in the good old days.
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Bubstr speaks the working man's language. I like it, preach on!
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Well unfortunately good talent like Jason and a few others, will never climb back into contention on a national level, with todays cars and engine packages. They will either have to be lucky enough to find a big dollar ride, find a mega sponsor, or win the lottery. As much as the publicity and money has come into the sport with the Nascar owners, so did the tie down rigs, 4 post shakers, and wind tunnels. They have the current late models stuck to the track so well, that being 50-75hp down now, at most tracks, puts you 4-6 tenths off the pace and nowhere in the mix. The engine builders get checks from these big money teams, no questions asked, at outrageous prices, and it drives the price up for everyone else. He isn't going to sell Clint Bowyer Racing 6 engines at $58,000 a piece, and Jason Feger the same motor for $46,000. The gap will continue to widen until they do some things to unhook the cars a bit, bring some throttle control back into the mix, and a used $25k engine with 75 less horsepower can be right back in the ballpark. I don't blame local or regional guys for not showing up to run these Lucas/WOO shows when they come to town anymore, its basically just throwing money out the window to say you did it. Within 5 years, I bet these series struggle to even fill a whole field of cars, outside the crown jewels.
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Originally Posted by Bubstr
True in 5 years, any money given to the poorer, would gravitate to the rich again. That is due to the system the rich lobbied for. You and me kind of guys didn't have the money or intelligence to lobby for our system. The unions used to do it for us, but there has been a strong media attack against them, for quite some time. We all hear about the one lazy guy that uses the union to keep his job, while we hire crooked politicians and let them keep their job. The politicians decide the tax laws, what to tax, if we operate in the red or black. There wasn't even a mention of the FED in2013, when the contract ran out, that will never let us operate in the black again. You must know, every taxpayer or potential taxpayer owes the FED, something like 50,000k. Now you want to talk about a guy living above their means. That would be our elected officials I always see this argument about money going back to the rich. make the laws favor the working man and he will earn it. The economy will be robust and many more opportunities.The rich will still make out ok. It's just that their greed won't be satisfied.
Racing has never been cheap. In the 50s, I could build a competitive car for well under 1k, but min wage was 50 cents. A good job paid 80 dollars a week. Granted the aftermarket sales was minimal from Honest Charly or Speedway motors. Even in the good old days, when Smart went fast, it took months of paychecks to build a car, but not like today. If your going to race, your going to have hardships. I have seen guys give up family, homes and everything they own to race, even in the good old days.
When you talk about unions are you talking about the ones that represent manufacturing workers at places like Caterpillar and Ford or the government unions that own politictians like Mike Madigan that gives them pensions that nobody else has and has bankrupt the state of Illinois?
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Originally Posted by heinen81
Well unfortunately good talent like Jason and a few others, will never climb back into contention on a national level, with todays cars and engine packages. They will either have to be lucky enough to find a big dollar ride, find a mega sponsor, or win the lottery. As much as the publicity and money has come into the sport with the Nascar owners, so did the tie down rigs, 4 post shakers, and wind tunnels. They have the current late models stuck to the track so well, that being 50-75hp down now, at most tracks, puts you 4-6 tenths off the pace and nowhere in the mix. The engine builders get checks from these big money teams, no questions asked, at outrageous prices, and it drives the price up for everyone else. He isn't going to sell Clint Bowyer Racing 6 engines at $58,000 a piece, and Jason Feger the same motor for $46,000. The gap will continue to widen until they do some things to unhook the cars a bit, bring some throttle control back into the mix, and a used $25k engine with 75 less horsepower can be right back in the ballpark. I don't blame local or regional guys for not showing up to run these Lucas/WOO shows when they come to town anymore, its basically just throwing money out the window to say you did it. Within 5 years, I bet these series struggle to even fill a whole field of cars, outside the crown jewels.
When they do things to "unhook" the cars, the more important the expensive tools you mention become. I will never try to say I know the answer to fix the sport, but the smaller the box these guys have to work in, the higher the cost goes.
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Originally Posted by blncfn57
When they do things to "unhook" the cars, the more important the expensive tools you mention become. I will never try to say I know the answer to fix the sport, but the smaller the box these guys have to work in, the higher the cost goes.
Unhooking the cars, I believe, can be effective if done in the correct ways. If nothing else, it decreases engine costs. You need so much more power than you did 6 years ago.
Modern Day Wedge Racing
Florence -2
Atomic - 2
Moler - 1
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I agree completely with this post.
Originally Posted by heinen81
Well unfortunately good talent like Jason and a few others, will never climb back into contention on a national level, with todays cars and engine packages. They will either have to be lucky enough to find a big dollar ride, find a mega sponsor, or win the lottery. As much as the publicity and money has come into the sport with the Nascar owners, so did the tie down rigs, 4 post shakers, and wind tunnels. They have the current late models stuck to the track so well, that being 50-75hp down now, at most tracks, puts you 4-6 tenths off the pace and nowhere in the mix. The engine builders get checks from these big money teams, no questions asked, at outrageous prices, and it drives the price up for everyone else. He isn't going to sell Clint Bowyer Racing 6 engines at $58,000 a piece, and Jason Feger the same motor for $46,000. The gap will continue to widen until they do some things to unhook the cars a bit, bring some throttle control back into the mix, and a used $25k engine with 75 less horsepower can be right back in the ballpark. I don't blame local or regional guys for not showing up to run these Lucas/WOO shows when they come to town anymore, its basically just throwing money out the window to say you did it. Within 5 years, I bet these series struggle to even fill a whole field of cars, outside the crown jewels.
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Originally Posted by dmr37
When you talk about unions are you talking about the ones that represent manufacturing workers at places like Caterpillar and Ford or the government unions that own politictians like Mike Madigan that gives them pensions that nobody else has and has bankrupt the state of Illinois?
I mean all Unions. The unions for public workers, police, firemen, school teachers and garbage men, did not bankrupt the state of Illinois. The people you elected or let get elected did that by not putting the union dues in a interest receiving account. Really they didn't even put it in any account. It's part of politicians living above their means. Of course some people think, a collage graduate shouldn't earn the same benefits as Willie the Welder at Cat, even if they teach your children. Now I suppose your going to say Chicago runs the state, but actually most of the State don't care enough to vote, just complain. I live here too and am just as guilty, but I know enough not to blame the unions. That is a anti union media spin. Remember this. All you have between you and your family starving is your labor. There is always someone that wants that labor for as little as possible. It is a adversarial relationship since the days of the Lords and surfs. The days of the 40 hour week is going down soon. when will child labor come back, the moms are already working.
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Easy Bubs ur speaking too much truth some people cant handle that...OPCMIA Local 90!
Last edited by Illtsate32; 04-03-2018 at 08:39 PM.
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Originally Posted by Bubstr
I mean all Unions. The unions for public workers, police, firemen, school teachers and garbage men, did not bankrupt the state of Illinois. The people you elected or let get elected did that by not putting the union dues in a interest receiving account. Really they didn't even put it in any account. It's part of politicians living above their means. Of course some people think, a collage graduate shouldn't earn the same benefits as Willie the Welder at Cat, even if they teach your children. Now I suppose your going to say Chicago runs the state, but actually most of the State don't care enough to vote, just complain. I live here too and am just as guilty, but I know enough not to blame the unions. That is a anti union media spin. Remember this. All you have between you and your family starving is your labor. There is always someone that wants that labor for as little as possible. It is a adversarial relationship since the days of the Lords and surfs. The days of the 40 hour week is going down soon. when will child labor come back, the moms are already working.
Whiskey Tango Foxtrot does this have to do with Feger whining again?
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Originally Posted by dirty-white-boy
Whiskey Tango Foxtrot does this have to do with Feger whining again?
Basically....Feger doesn't have enough coin to compete on a national level with the big boys....
Illinois is going bankrupt....
If you give all the teams the same $$$, it will all funnel back to the high $ teams....
Oh, and ALL of it is the unions fault!?!? Any union, doesn't matter, it's their fault.
While the teacher's union in WI can straight up kiss my @$$, I can tell you with 100% certainty that they did NOT ruin DLM racing....not yet anyways 😁.
Fans aren't making race teams spend 10 times what they can earn for winning in order to win. But monkey see....monkey do.
Think you're all caught up now.
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Originally Posted by MasterSbilt_Racer
Cheap racing stuff comes from China. Lol.
Wehrs is raising the prices on their parts due to the tariffs. Aluminum for bodies is going up in price. I have a friend who races a Legends car and their stuff is going up in price as well.
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Wow, We all have to realize a lot of the reasons racing costs are skyrocketing, is a lot of the title sponsors of the major touring groups are contributing to the growing cost. The ignorance of a statement, just let them quit will eventually lead to 10-12 cars showing up for a Lucas or WOO race. And I dont know what you all are smoking but its dilusional to think there are sponsors that want to throw thousands or their dollars to a race track. Until the whole cost to be competitive is addressed, car counts will continue to dwindle and more guys will leave the sport. Right now you got guys that will spend anything to win, cheating is not being monitored good enough, and to be honest whether its Moyer, Boomquist or whomever, tracks and promoters are turning a blind eye to wrong doings!
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I blame promoters for letting UMP letting the costs go up so much. They sit back and let the costs go up and do little to nothing to help support the local late models out. They could all reorganize, and that means all involved in racing and come out with rules to greatly cut costs. And instead of continuing to pay the same purses as 35 years ago they need to increase the purses or quit having the late model class at their tracks also. Instead they schedule a big sanctioned race or two to the make their season and add every "SUPPORT" class they can think of to literally pay the purses with and also profit from tire deals and racing accessories. Safety rules are often even designed to make profits from. Maybe I'm a little off base on some of this stuff but many promoters seem to be quietly and by design getting rid of weekly late model racing. If you run lates once or twice a month and throw in Lucas, WOO, etc that the locals can't afford to run in, you are destroying the incentive to even build a late model, when they only race a handful of times and the rest of the season they have to go longer distances to other tracks that they are not used to running or are properly prepared to race at. If rules could come about that could end the crate class altogether by making the late models more affordable then the car counts could recover and grow once again. Increase the LM purses, (Increase admission prices do to so) run them weekly, and prepare a good racing surface, and see if the fans don't start increasing. Good advertising and getting back to racing like they used to would help keep the local weekly fans coming instead of having them think the race is going to be rained out just because there was a sprinkle come through. People are not going to take a chance of coming to the races if the promoters are not going to take a chance.
And of course it's a promoters choice of what classes they do run. But they may then have a hard time competing with other tracks.
Myself I liked the racing back in the 1970's with the home made cars and could accept a return to something like that as long everyone had to go by the same rules on chassis costs, engine costs, shock costs, etc.
Enforcing the rules might be a nightmare. But then again, they already are.
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Originally Posted by mcarter815
A lot of it comes from Mexico. Especially anything GM. Plus, with the new tariffs it's going to be more expensive to fix bodies.
The purpose of the tariffs right now is an effort to bring about fair trade, not a permanent tariff. Why would you want a country ripping you off on all trade? There should be NO tariffs on trade period. So the money keeps going out of the country as a result. And we pay more for imports because there are tariffs period.
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Originally Posted by Bubstr
True in 5 years, any money given to the poorer, would gravitate to the rich again. That is due to the system the rich lobbied for. You and me kind of guys didn't have the money or intelligence to lobby for our system. The unions used to do it for us, but there has been a strong media attack against them, for quite some time. We all hear about the one lazy guy that uses the union to keep his job, while we hire crooked politicians and let them keep their job. The politicians decide the tax laws, what to tax, if we operate in the red or black. There wasn't even a mention of the FED in2013, when the contract ran out, that will never let us operate in the black again. You must know, every taxpayer or potential taxpayer owes the FED, something like 50,000k. Now you want to talk about a guy living above their means. That would be our elected officials I always see this argument about money going back to the rich. make the laws favor the working man and he will earn it. The economy will be robust and many more opportunities.The rich will still make out ok. It's just that their greed won't be satisfied.
Racing has never been cheap. In the 50s, I could build a competitive car for well under 1k, but min wage was 50 cents. A good job paid 80 dollars a week. Granted the aftermarket sales was minimal from Honest Charly or Speedway motors. Even in the good old days, when Smart went fast, it took months of paychecks to build a car, but not like today. If your going to race, your going to have hardships. I have seen guys give up family, homes and everything they own to race, even in the good old days.
Thank you for putting the truth out once again in great composition!!
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Originally Posted by dirty-white-boy
https://www.dirtondirt.com/story_10038.html
Is anyone else tired of hearing drivers whine about money? Come on dirtondirt publish something else! These guys race for a freaking living, it costs money. If you cant afford it get a normal job like the rest of us.
With that way thinking dlm would be dead next year.. some times you got complain to get help. Then if it doesn’t then everyone know you struggling. Look at tmac there reason he didn’t race pdc and c.lake can’t afford the help you can’t race.
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Why then do 95% off drivers want a huge $50,000 To Win instead of $25,000 To Win and a much more competitive purse through out the field?
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