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size of carb, gear ratio, torque, rpm's , size of track , weight of car. compression ratio , engine size and good setup = less practice run. = amount of fuel. he!! ,let it go
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Originally Posted by dave41
size of carb, gear ratio, torque, rpm's , size of track , weight of car. compression ratio , engine size and good setup = less practice run. = amount of fuel. he!! ,let it go
i stopped beating that dead horse 3 days ago, but i would love to have one of those magic carburetors that burns 5 times less gas than alky though.
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Does a car warm up faster on gas or alcohol? Does a person pull out onto the track with a cold engine? It isn't "magic", but a very small group of carburetor builders know what to do to maximize power while keeping fuel consumption to a minimum. That was always a big objective with the carbureted NASCAR stuff. If you can take away one pit stop it's huge. He happens to have a very good one. In theory the difference is close to 2:1 but there's a whole lot more to it. It doesn't really matter. People will run what they want to run and will always question something they're not used to seeing.
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E-85. It can run very well if you have a good carburetor and the fuel and fuel system is set up right. Cut one corner on it, and it will run horribly. Using the right carburetor builder and following all of the recommendations will yield the results you want. Tread carefully here, there are more bad E-85 4412 carbs than good ones. By far. Conversion kits don't work. You'd be wise to call a few of the good builders and see who knows E-85.
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fuel left in tank this sat. not real good next sat. ethanol is bad to evap. in a week
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50J who do you recommend for a E85 builder? Need to be 4 barrel, single inlet, non double pumper. ( due to rules)
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We have ran pump E85 for the last 8 years, carbs by JDR. Check every batch for ethanol content. Have ran in 604 Crate & 750HP 14-1 Open late model and mod engines. we use about 10 gallons per car on an average night.It makes more torque than gas , is easier to cool, and usually around $2 per gallon in our area.
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Billy at Willys carb and dyno told me when I had them build me an e85 carb for our crate that if your buying it from the pump your wasting your money. The range on that stuff out of the pump from my own testing can be anywhere from 60-94 ethanol not to mention they are cutting with the worst of unleaded fuel available. Do yourself a favor find you a renegade fuel dealer and buy the renegade race E85 leaded fuel. We've used 5 drums this year and every drum has tested dead on 85 and its only about 250 a drum.
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MLR has good advice. E-85 should always be tested but a small change in ethanol content makes very little real difference. E-85 in a drum is fine too, and Sunoco or VP have it. I wouldn't use ethanol with leaded fuel, but different strokes I suppose.
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Why not use ethanol with leaded fuel?
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Google "mixing ethanol with leaded fuel". I'm sure it's just fine for some people. It just depends on what you're looking for.
Last edited by 50j; 12-14-2016 at 01:18 PM.
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We have dynoed a 604 with pump e85 ranging from E-82 to E-87 with no jet changes, and saw no difference in power or temperature, we have ran renegade e-85, not on the dyno, but it wasnt an obvious difference. I believe the VP C85 is better, but it wont separate in an e85 tester, so we cant run it (it tests to be pure E-98) not saying it is but with a standard $20 tester that is how it checks.
I heard the same thing from the guys at Willies , about pump e85 but I also know they sell their own blend of e-85. If you check the content with every batch, you wont have any problems. Pump E-85 gets a bad rap from the fuel companies because it does everything their $10 a gallon fuel does for $2 a gallon.
I also hear stories of damage to components & having to drain the fuel cell every week, we do none of that , we treat it just like gas.
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We have used pump e85 for going on 3 yrs now with a 600 single line Holley with only one problem the one time I did not have checker with me it was bad . The mix was about 50/50 apparently the delivery man put gas in e85 tank.i caught it first when I started to pour it gas smell was way too strong got checker and it was 50/50. I carried it back to store they gave my money back and offered to pay for any damage.They were not real happy either having contaminated fuel.A new flex fuel car would probably have never known the difference as it would have adjusted to the mixture. Every since then I always carry checker and it has been perfect every time. We started 1 season with a drum of renegade e 85 and then went back to pump gas renegade was 320 a drum with tax or a little over 5 $ a gallon pump is between 1.80 to 2$ a gallon do the math it's a no brained with no difference in performance now race e85 is leaded so we add marvel mystery oil or atf to fuel for some top end lubrication.
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You won't find changes above e60. More timing won't get you anything. E85 is an easy 30+ hp/TQ. I've tuned a lot of cars fuel injected and carb and it's great. Just make sure you change that oil frequently as it is very corrosive on the bottom end. A good tuner for carbs is hard to come by and I suggest chassis dyno tuning them. If anyone says pump e85 isn't good they're not informed and spewing bs. Gas vs e85 look to use 30% more e85. We use 10 gal on typical race night. Pump e85 is just fine and only $1.50-$2 gal.
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With an engine with some compression you have to be a lot more careful with the blend. On any of them, more than a few% of ethanol content change will require a tuning change if you want it to be right. Everything MLR suggested is correct in my opinion. You'll find a big difference in E-85 carburetors from different sources even with tuning for the same a/f too.
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You can run 38* timing on your high compression motors all day long and run e60-e85 without changing anything. You're not going to find any noticeable gain past e60.
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Actually, the lower the ethanol percentage the richer it runs and the lower the octane rating. Not all engines need the same timing. That depends on combustion chamber, piston design and some other factors. The plugs and dyno show what the engine likes for timing.
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I ran E85 on 434 23 degree motor with a carb from Pro Flow systems. The carb was perfect right out of the box. All my E85 was out of the pump ranging from e82 to e88. if its over e85 i cut it with 93 octane. If its under e85 you have to have e98 to bring it up and there is no e98 where i live so I test at the pump. I have ran e82 and could tell no difference, smart or not? IDK, but I did it. I usually used 10 gallons of VP late model plus and on E85 i was using 15 gallons.
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been running e85 for a few seasons, if you have a good carb builder then it easy to deal with. I have a fuel tester they are cheap, and you will want one. As mentioned you may need to add ethanol. My experience in IL has shown the fuel to be consistent at the two stations I buy at all thru race season.
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