Jay D!ckens Facebook post - Good Read on cost.

[Trax53]

"Hey, folks. I just want to share some things that have been on my mind for a while. I’ve spent the last 25 years putting my heart and soul in to the DLM racing and, by far, it is the best racing on the planet. Not saying that I am totally right, but I think we can all agree that there are several issues that need to be evaluated.
I am not here to criticize anyone or any of the sanctioning bodies, but these are the “rule makers” and are the ones that are able to make much-needed changes. DLM racing has become an engineering exercise for the teams. I am not totally against this, but the drivers have been totally taken out of the game. There are tons of great drivers that have the ability to win, but they do not have the money or the resources to get it done. I have seen more race teams shut their doors in the last two years than I have in the past ten years combined. If anyone has noticed, it is usually the same 2 or 3 cars that win every week in the different series. If the sanctioning-body “rule makers” do not wake up soon, car counts are going to continue dropping lower and lower.
I realize that when rules are given, it will take more time to tech and for other requirements. If we want to turn things around and head DLM in to the right direction, I believe that we can all agree that some things need to be done. My opinion is that we need to have all cars put on an even playing field so that the drivers can settle it on the race track. When DLM racing was at its peak and car counts were at records high, the cars were not even close to the technology that we have today! Look at NASCAR. There are 5 or 6 powerhouse teams and the rest are just fill-ins. DLM racing is headed in the same direction if some things are not changed soon. The bodies, tires, shocks, chassis devices, engines, etc. need to be evaluated. As long as you have million dollar budgets to race with, the current rules are fine. The problem is that there are only a handful of teams in this lucky situation.
Weekly super late model racing has pretty much already died, because they are forced to abide by the same rules as the big sanctioning bodies. It is just not possible to run a $100,000+ machine on local tracks for $1000-1500 to win. This is just too upside down. Racing has always been an expensive game, but it seems to be getting worse and worse. Hopefully there are good things coming in the future that can help turn this sport that we love in the right direction. I am not saying that any one person or a group has done anything wrong, but it is just a sign of the times that we are in now.
My concern is that it is going to be too late if we do not do something now. This is why I felt the need to express myself and help DLM racing turn the corner back in to its glory days."

Jay D[CKENS

[Pennsboro23]

The great debate continues. The glory days are behind us. The 90's were the best this sport will ever be. But something does need done. The local hot shoe doesn't stand a chance to even podium when the the big boys roll into town. Eddie Carrier Jr. should not be running for a track championship. The STARS was the best traveling series IMO.

I agree with all of those takes.

[Pennsboro23]

I disagree that a local guy cannot win. Michael Norris beat the WoO guys at Lernerville. Max Blair won a WoO race last year as well. It is tough yes but it can be done. Unzicker got 2nd at the Lucas Oil Macon show.

The drivers you mentioned aren't locals. They're regional hot shoes. IMO, there's a big difference in a true "local" and a regional driver. Blair could run a national schedule and be somewhat successful if he chose to do so. Unzicker is a regional star in Illinois running summernats, etc.

[golddirt]

Regardless we have all seen car counts and all divisions drop dramatically at all tracks even our beloved fairbury. It affects all divisions look at the street stock car count it is almost nonexistent anymore. All of our tracks had car count exceeding 100 not all that long ago and that's just for a weekly show so that proves that our sport that we so dearly love is dying due to the cost. Let's get real late models are not late models anymore they in no way have the appearance of a late model car. Let's get rid of the huge motors the shocks and that engineering mess in the rear

[heinen81]

Jay (not a nice word)(not a nice word)(not a nice word)(not a nice word)ens, Pro Power, Durham and all the other top builders and parts suppliers for their motors, are just as much to blame as anyone right behind the aero and shock packages. I get that the cars have more grip than power now, so these builders charge a premium for every last bit of power they can make. Then the Nascar owned and funded teams come in and write checks for a dozen motors without balking at the price, which sets the market for every one else. Most others cant keep up with those costs, so they fold up. 20 years ago they made 700-800 horsepower for under 30k.... now you're telling me it should cost 60k for 100 hp more?? even with the introduction of CNC and other time and cost effective manufacturing processes? does a $5,500 crankshaft really cost any more to make than a $1,500 crankshaft? Does a $7000 block really cost any more to manufacture than a $2500 block? Do a set of 15k cylinder heads take any more to cast and machine than a $2000 set? No. The suppliers and builders are catering to the big money teams which set the market price for everyone else. (not a nice word)(not a nice word)(not a nice word)(not a nice word)ens is just as guilty for how out of hand this got, when HP became king again, and they could charge what they wanted for it.

[fastford]

after reading post #16 , it seems to me he is calling for a spec class to replace SUPER LATE MODELS , I have no idea what will actually work , but this has already been tried.........

[Austin34471]

Everything Jay said is true.. everyone and their mother agrees with 100% of what he said. The issue is, everyone already knows this! Acknowledging that there is a problem without providing any ideas on how to fix said problem doesn't fix anything!

And that's the biggest problem.. no one knows how to fix it. The second biggest problem is: if someone did know how to fix it, 3/4 of the sport would whine at him/her until they gave up because no one agrees on anything. We will ride it out for another 5-10 years until it dies completely then find something else to do

[Burke1118]

Everything Jay said is true.. everyone and their mother agrees with 100% of what he said. The issue is, everyone already knows this! Acknowledging that there is a problem without providing any ideas on how to fix said problem doesn't fix anything! And that's the biggest problem.. no one knows how to fix it. The second biggest problem is: if someone did know how to fix it, 3/4 of the sport would whine at him/her until they gave up because no one agrees on anything. We will ride it out for another 5-10 years until it dies completely then find something else to do

Sad but true. Same could be said for America lol

[bleedblue55]

Every time this gets brought up the engine size of sprint cars classes are used as an example, 410, 360. Correct me if I'm wrong but doesn't a top shelf complete 410 sprint motor cost about the same as a top of the line Durham, Clements, etc. for late models.

[Josh Bayko]

Seems to me that would be more regional talent. I consider local guy the guy that is running top 3 in weekly track points and races once a week. And maybe twice a week a couple times a month.

Norris is absolutely a Lenerville local. He has traveled a bit more this year than in years past, but he was at the Ville every week and won almost every feature and the point title.

[Josh Bayko]

Ok, now name a guy who is truly a "local" racer, not a regional guy, who has won on the Lucas or WoO tour in the last 3 years.

Second by Unzicker is nice, but it's still not a win, and it was on a 1/5th mile track...not exactly a straight up hp venue.

Michael Norris.

[MI Dirt Fan]

Jay (not a nice word)(not a nice word)(not a nice word)(not a nice word)ens, Pro Power, Durham and all the other top builders and parts suppliers for their motors, are just as much to blame as anyone right behind the aero and shock packages. I get that the cars have more grip than power now, so these builders charge a premium for every last bit of power they can make. Then the Nascar owned and funded teams come in and write checks for a dozen motors without balking at the price, which sets the market for every one else. Most others cant keep up with those costs, so they fold up. 20 years ago they made 700-800 horsepower for under 30k.... now you're telling me it should cost 60k for 100 hp more?? even with the introduction of CNC and other time and cost effective manufacturing processes? does a $5,500 crankshaft really cost any more to make than a $1,500 crankshaft? Does a $7000 block really cost any more to manufacture than a $2500 block? Do a set of 15k cylinder heads take any more to cast and machine than a $2000 set? No. The suppliers and builders are catering to the big money teams which set the market price for everyone else. (not a nice word)(not a nice word)(not a nice word)(not a nice word)ens is just as guilty for how out of hand this got, when HP became king again, and they could charge what they wanted for it.

How many DLM teams are Nascar owned and funded?

[thexfactor0210]

Jeff Rine is also a weekly racer who won a WoO race at Port Royal last year. Kenny Pettyjohn won a WoO race a couple years ago at Volusia. AJ Diemel won the Lucas race at Oshkosh two years ago.

[xray]

In no other sport do the pros and amateurs intermingle on the appearance of a level playing field.

You don't try to play basketball against curry.
You don't try to out throw rodgers
You don't try to outgolf tiger, etc.

Wether that makes DLM racing better or worse is unknown, but it does not occur anywhere else.

[DGI]

I'm sure I'll get slammed by the know it all's on here but here's my 2 cents. I ran DLM's off and on in the midwest from 1999 to 2009. There would be 30-40 cars show up for a $3000 to win every single weekend and the racing from a driver and spectator stand point was phenomenal. A local guy could make the field and run up front with the likes of Bill Frye,Terry Phillips, Wendell Wallace, Al Purkey etc. Granted you weren't going to beat those much because they are great drivers but you could at least race with them. And if you look back at what all the teams had including the top tier teams the answer seems easy.

18 degree motors
double adjustable non canister shocks (probably have to be some sort of spec sealed shock now a day)
WRS D55 tires (one tire only)
Squared up bodies (that were teched all night long)


I'm sure there would have to be some tweaking but if you just implemented some common sense rules you could cut the cost in half in a matter of no time and your local and regional guys would get back into the DLM's.