Who builds the best late model motor???

[hucktyson]

With the amount of time and money Clements spends to develop their clyinder heads do you think the old man is really reinventing that wheel ?? I could maybe see a slightly different cam since Davensnort runs a narrower rpm range than most with his wide open hammer the cushion every lap style ...

[MasterSbilt_Racer]

The engine is still much less important than the chassis setup. It isn't that big of a deal...

[Barbecueboy]

The engine is still much less important than the chassis setup. It isn't that big of a deal...

True.............

[dirtracer99]

Vic Hill Racing Engines

[Barbecueboy]

With the amount of time and money Clements spends to develop their clyinder heads do you think the old man is really reinventing that wheel ?? I could maybe see a slightly different cam since Davensnort runs a narrower rpm range than most with his wide open hammer the cushion every lap style ...

No, but with you and serge as the dynamic reach around duo I think you have re invented a bad clone of Freddy Mercury,David Bowie and Rob halford racing team.

#therealrainbowwarriors

[Barbecueboy]

I don't know Leroy, but I'm guessing he farms out the machining, as the cost of owning that equipment for just your own engines, would be expensive. He is probably working with a head porter as a 5 angle CNC machine costs more than several years of engines and is worthless without a flow bench. He is old enough, that he could know what he wants for a profile and flow and dictates what he wants, but even people like Hendricks have people do their R/D work. He is probably buying pistons, valve train components, crank, rods and blocks. So at most he would be a designer / assembler.

This is not bad mouthing him. There just aren't any engine builders since the 50s. Tech put them out of business. The last time, I saw someone make their own pistons, was 1958.

So your saying the term engine builders doesn't apply to anyone these days???

Home builders don't make any of the components the build with( or 99.99 percent don't), they outsource everything too , yet are still called home builders.

I see where your going , but it's all semantics.

[fastford]

I assemble my engines, do 90% of the machine work in house and experiment a lot,( I was probably the first person to put Honda civic rods in a 302 ford engine) just wandering how I would be classified now? I have been calling myself a builder, but could be wrong.

[t.nie]

I think some people are confusing "parts design and manufacture" with "engine builder." If a guy has to fabricate his own piston, crank, block, etc to be a bona fide "engine builder", its been a long time since anyone could do that and make a better component than what a good manufacturer can sell you.

These days a builder is really more of an assembly engineer. He has to determine, based on your preferences, what he can build that will do what you want it to do at the price you can afford.

So you go to the guy and say "I want 850 hp, so many ft lbs of torque, it has to last 3000 laps between freshens..etc... for this much money" and the builder has to pick all the ingredients to bake that cake and make it work. Or tell you he can't do it for your budget but here is what I can do for you in that price range, or here is the compromise. I can get you 790 at that ft lbs of torque but it won't last more than 1500 laps, etc...

Good builders really know their stuff and can put together a package of components for you that will meet your goals, but you first have to tell them what it is you want or just ask them what packages they have. I would still say a local guy trying to make a living with local racers is probably going to offer you a lot more added value in terms of cooperation, information and weekly support than some big name builder already overflowing with work from the major league racers. The local dude may not have the same level of resources in his shop as the big names, but he does have the advantage of being available and in a price range you can probably afford.

[Barbecueboy]

I think some people are confusing "parts design and manufacture" with "engine builder." If a guy has to fabricate his own piston, crank, block, etc to be a bona fide "engine builder", its been a long time since anyone could do that and make a better component than what a good manufacturer can sell you.

These days a builder is really more of an assembly engineer. He has to determine, based on your preferences, what he can build that will do what you want it to do at the price you can afford.

So you go to the guy and say "I want 850 hp, so many ft lbs of torque, it has to last 3000 laps between freshens..etc... for this much money" and the builder has to pick all the ingredients to bake that cake and make it work. Or tell you he can't do it for your budget but here is what I can do for you in that price range, or here is the compromise. I can get you 790 at that ft lbs of torque but it won't last more than 1500 laps, etc...

Good builders really know their stuff and can put together a package of components for you that will meet your goals, but you first have to tell them what it is you want or just ask them what packages they have. I would still say a local guy trying to make a living with local racers is probably going to offer you a lot more added value in terms of cooperation, information and weekly support than some big name builder already overflowing with work from the major league racers. The local dude may not have the same level of resources in his shop as the big names, but he does have the advantage of being available and in a price range you can probably afford.

Another excellent post by t.nie.........

[deez lug nuts]

Ain't no true engine builders if you have to make your own bolts and zip ties to be called one.

[onlyfacts]

Mr.Rumbley is more of an engine builder than Ronnie Stuckey, Darrell Lanigan, Scott Bloomquist or Billy Moyer are a chassis builder. Mr. Rumbley has been building his own engines for years. I don't think Stuckey, Lanigan, Bloomquist or Moyer has ever build a chassis on their own. I am sure Barry Wright, Tader Masters and Mark Richards have built chassis the same as Clements, Cornett, Hill, Scheilper, Draime and Mr. Rumbley have built engines. Put a pile of tubing in front of Barry Wright, Tader Master or Mark Richards and they can build you a chassis. Put same pile of tubing in front of Stuckey, Lanigan, Bloomquist or Moyer and it will still be a pile a year from now. Put a pile of engine parts in front of Mr. Rumbley and it will be an engine that can win the World 100.

[Bubstr]

I think some people are confusing "parts design and manufacture" with "engine builder." If a guy has to fabricate his own piston, crank, block, etc to be a bona fide "engine builder", its been a long time since anyone could do that and make a better component than what a good manufacturer can sell you.

These days a builder is really more of an assembly engineer. He has to determine, based on your preferences, what he can build that will do what you want it to do at the price you can afford.

So you go to the guy and say "I want 850 hp, so many ft lbs of torque, it has to last 3000 laps between freshens..etc... for this much money" and the builder has to pick all the ingredients to bake that cake and make it work. Or tell you he can't do it for your budget but here is what I can do for you in that price range, or here is the compromise. I can get you 790 at that ft lbs of torque but it won't last more than 1500 laps, etc...

Good builders really know their stuff and can put together a package of components for you that will meet your goals, but you first have to tell them what it is you want or just ask them what packages they have. I would still say a local guy trying to make a living with local racers is probably going to offer you a lot more added value in terms of cooperation, information and weekly support than some big name builder already overflowing with work from the major league racers. The local dude may not have the same level of resources in his shop as the big names, but he does have the advantage of being available and in a price range you can probably afford.

Good post. Most engines have similar parts. What sets one above others is experience of having built a lot of engines and having the feed back from those customers and the ability to run a lot of different configurations on the Dyno to compare.

MasterSbilt_Racer, is also correct. The engine is not the most important component of a LM. If you have enough for the track, you are running, you have enough. How long it lasts, is what you pay for. What's important is a chassis and driver that can use the engine. Just listen to some of the Go Pro vids. They aren't on the go pedal all the time and how much of it do they really use? A long travel go pedal is probably as important as the engine choice for most tracks.

[hucktyson]

I will bet you any of the guys you mentioned are capable of fabricating their own chassis .... But when a decent fabricator can be had for $25.00 an hour or less why would they ??? Their time is much better spent running the business

[Barbecueboy]

I will bet you any of the guys you mentioned are capable of fabricating their own chassis .... But when a decent fabricator can be had for $25.00 an hour or less why would they ??? Their time is much better spent running the business

Well dam, just when I think your a complete hoax you go and say something relevent like this.

Your point is valid.

[fastford]

I guess its like a home builder, he don't produce the 2x4s or nails, but he is still considered a builder.