Winner!

[CIRF]

The sheep who enjoy plywood sheets for spoilers and a whopping 550 hp for supposedly the best in the world drivers 

Put the NASCAR rules package aside and name one driver who is more skilled, talented and brave driving and winning in a half dozen, or more, different types of racecars as Larson? pee wee jr.? Hahaha!

For whatever reason you hate the guy and resent what he's accomplished in a generic dirt late model and you take the bate every time!

[Rajflyboy]

Put the NASCAR rules package aside and name one driver who is more skilled, talented and brave driving and winning in a half dozen, or more, different types of racecars as Larson? pee wee jr.? Hahaha!For whatever reason you hate the guy and resent what he's accomplished in a generic dirt late model and you take the bate every time!

I don’t hate him but I’m not ready to crown him yet either. Hey big man let me hold a dollar

[Late_Model_Mark]

Ok CIRF I'll bite on post #16. I do not take your generic shots to heart at all however I do wish that those cracks be deleted from future posts as that kinda dives beneath your caliber on knowledge

Since you did not specify era, I got one for ya that Mr. Larson cant or wont ever hang with. Before I get to that I was cheering Larson on to win because the political police got in my view, a giant thumb size prostate check, LOL

Ok here we go to challenge your claim, answer, "Super Tex" A.J. Foyt!

Winner of not 1, not 2, not 3, but 4 Indy 500s when it was a ballsy mans game. Roadsters and Rear-engine cars.
Winner of the Daytona 500.
Winner of the 24hrs of Le Mans in the only, repeat only, "all" American driving team.


From 1905 till 1971 the Contest Board of the American Automobile Association had the National Driving Championships, then USAC changed it. The award had tracks like Syracuse, Langhorne, Indianapolis (the mile)Detroit, Phoenix, Sacramento, and the tracks you know, Springfield and Du Quoin. 72 it was only asphalt.

A.J Foyt won with "dirt cars" on pavement such as at Trenton. He won in Sprints, Champ Cars, Midgets, "and" stock cars on dirt. he beat rear engine Indy cars with his dirt roadster. Also winning the Firecracker 400 at Daytona. Drove the Woods Bros. to a win at the Atlanta 500.

On a Saturday he won his 29th of a total of 67 Championship Car Races at the Illinois State Fairgrounds, The Tony Bettenhausen Memorial, then the next day he went to the Wisconsin State Fairr for the Tony Bettenhausen 200, his rear engine car broke at the shop, unloaded his dirt car and with a few changes by Steve Stapp won the pole over 53 cars.

A small history lesson for you folks who don't know about the past, this does not include Parnelli Jones, Dan Gurney,Frankie Schneider, Jim Shampine, or Al Tasnady.

CIRF, did you ever see A.J. Foyt race, I did many a time, think about our history before making these lofty claims, I hope Larson wins the championship.


LMM

[CIRF]

First, I did see A.J. race, albeit late in his career and early in my racing fan days, and I know his resume' well. Overall, I would rank Mario Andretti a tick higher than A.J. Specifically at Indy I would rank Rocket Rick Mears well ahead of A.J. Rocket Rick, had he kept racing for Penske a few more years, would likely have 5 or 6 Indy 500 victories. I know, I know, that's all just speculation but I believe it.

Another notable fact is A.J. was a notorious a$$hole and he had USAC and Tony Hulman as deeply in his hip pocket as ol' arnhead had NASCAR and Billy France Jr. in his back pocket.

An argument can be made for Foyt as the greatest American driver who has ever lived but Mario won the F1 World Championship. A.J. refused to even try to run F1 because he was well aware that the Europeans wouldn't favor him or let him do as he pleased like he did in America. The only thing A.J. did that Mario didn't was win at Le Mans. Mario won a full season championship that A.J. never even attempted.

Is Larson in the same rarified air as Foyt & Andretti? Probably not, but Larson is just 28 years old. I believe he'll give the Indy 500 a whirl before he's done and I think, given a competitive racecar, he could win it. The Daytona 500 is such a joke it means little on a drivers resume' these days. In the eyes of Kyle Larson The Chili Bowl is more prestigious and meaningful win that the Daytona 500.

Will Larson ever win Le Mans like A.J.? I'd bet heavily against it. Foyt was solidly in the Ford camp when he won Le Mans and that circumstance is not available in auto racing at this point in time. Will Larson ever win the F1 World Championship? I'd bet heavily against that happening, as well.

Don't let the term generic as it's applied to DLM's hurt your feelings, Mark. In my vernacular it merely designates the fact that even though the modern, post 1980, dirt late model is categorized as a form of "stock car" and there is nothing that remotely resembles any "stock" late model automobile. A more precise moniker would be fendered super modified. Generic is not a demeaning or derogatory term but it triggers some people. In some cases I like that but not in your case, Mark.

[CIRF]

I forgot to speak of the legend of A.J. at Milwaukee. It happened waaaaaay before my time so I only know what has been written and passed down over the decades. It obviously was very impressive and helped make Foyt the mythical racing folk legend that he is and richly deserves. However, a friend of mine raced a Silver Crown car against winged rear engine Indy Cars at Pocono way back in the day. The Silver Crown cars were different than the roadster that Foyt drove at Milwaukee as were the rear engine cars that raced at Pocono were far, far different than the rear engine cars that A.J. ran against at Milwaukee.

My friend held his own in that Silver Crown car and it's one of the highlights of his racing memories!

[lurker]

Heck, I’m just glad I could see Kyle race in a Midget when he was suspended from NASCAR.

[CIRF]

lurker, Larson really is a special talent and he's a nice kid. We first met him at Springfield, Illinois at the Bettenhausen Memorial 100. He was driving the #71 Silver Crown car owned by Keith Kunz and Pete Willoughby. I think he ran 4th that day. 2 weeks later on the dirt mile at Du Quoin, Illinois he put an ass kickin' on the field similar to the whoopin' he put on the DLM boys this past January. Larson and the late, great Bryan Clauson went at it tooth & nail in the early stages of that race but by half way Larson was 1/2 lap ahead of BC and stretching it every lap.

If you are a race fan you have to enjoy watching the kid do his thing. It can't be overstated just how special a talent Larson is and you can call me anything you want for saying so. He makes history just about every time he straps in a race car at a dirt track!

[lurker]

--- and the late, great Bryan Clauson

When he was fresh out of California, and cutting his teeth, I watched very young Brian at Peru, In. Miami Co. Speedway many a night racing a 600cc Micro. I’ve been very blessed over the years to watch some of the best racers to be, race here in Indiana.

[Rajflyboy]

Good thing about Larson is that he wheels the car and doesn’t whine about setups/Tire wear etc. A perfect fit for Hendrick. Drivers who don’t build cars. They just drive.

[CIRF]

lurker, I didn't discover BC until he'd gone through the NASCAR stage of his career. You were very fortunate to see him race in his formative years!

I was born a little too late to have seen some of the great ones but I at least got to watch some of the legends very late in their careers. As a pre-teen I watched Sheldon Kinser drive a sprint car and Silver Crown car. Got to see Gary Bettenhausen and Larry D!ckson but both were into their last seasons of competition. Never got to see Parnelli or Dan Gurney. Both those guys are hero's of mine and I believe Parnelli was just as good as Foyt.

The one guy I agonize about not seeing race was Jan Opperman. I've been told that he was beyond special behind the wheel of a wingless sprint car. I've also read about and heard of a guy from out east by the name of Tommy Hinner(not a nice word)(not a nice word)(not a nice word)(not a nice word)z. I think Foyt said Hinner(not a nice word)(not a nice word)(not a nice word)(not a nice word)z was as good as anyone who ever lived. Pre war driver Ted Horn (who is memorialized every Labor Day Weekend at the Magic Mile at Du Quoin) is said to have been as good as anyone who lived but like many he fell victim to the lack of safety equipment and policies of his time period.

There are four tracks that I missed due to the tardiness of my existence and it makes me sad never to have seen them. They are Langhorne, Pennsylvania, the beach road course in Ponce De Leon Inlet/Daytona Beach, Florida, Trenton, New Jersey and of course Ascot Park in Gardena, California.

[Late_Model_Mark]

I got to see Foyt run dozens of races from Ascot to Ontario, Phoenix to Riverside, pavement and dirt, it could have been either surface in Stock Cars, Sprints, Midgets. Roadsters and so on. Rick Mears dirt experience was some bad a$$ off road stuff. I really like Mears, one year had a long overall conversation with him at his hometown's Bakersfield March Meet, a guy who who listening to the 2 of us talk was Buck Owens, something really cool.

CIRF, no mention of Frankie Schneider or Al Tasnady, why? In my view you cant say someone is the best with out knowing history, not that you dont, maybe cuz I am an older.....fart than most.

Just my view, but I think Mr. Foyt is so accomplished overshadowing most if not all major sanctioning group talents. Y a think how many late bad breaks Foyt had at Indy.

Also got to meet him once at Ontario.



LMM

[Rajflyboy]

And Foyt showed up to Le Mans for the very first time with Dan Gurney and they won the race. Foyt had never seen the place.

[Raceready]

The sheep who enjoy plywood sheets for spoilers and a whopping 550 hp for supposedly the best in the world drivers 

Not to mention the FACT that all of the passing is done by spotters and mirrors ! ! If'n they took that away from them. Larson and Bell would run 1st and 2nd every race. Week in and week out !!!!!!!!!!!

[Rajflyboy]

Not to mention the FACT that all of the passing is done by spotters and mirrors ! ! If'n they took that away from them. Larson and Bell would run 1st and 2nd every race. Week in and week out !!!!!!!!!!!

Great Segway 😜👍

[JimBo]

Good conversation and great history in this thread. Growing up in Texas I was a huge A J Foyt fan when I was a kid back in the 60's. I never got the opportunity to see him race unfortunately, but I followed his carrier. He is the GOAT in my opinion with Andretti a close second.