Blue Oval crate engine??!!

[JustAddDirt]

Does Ford build a crate engine that could be looked at to compete with a GM crate engines?
Would any series even look at making it possible to have an option for die hard Ford folks?

Just random thoughts that run through my head.
Let me hear what you think??

[billetbirdcage]

Does Ford build a crate engine that could be looked at to compete with a GM crate engines?
Would any series even look at making it possible to have an option for die hard Ford folks?

Just random thoughts that run through my head.
Let me hear what you think??

Ford had/designed one years ago when crates first started, but it was more money and had a little too much power to be comparable to the 604. Not sure on the whole deal but it didn't get approved as ford or someone didn't want to adjust the engine to be more inline with the 604 so it never got approved ford comp with/against the 604.

Something to that effect, think it was a 347 cid. IIRC correct the 604 back then was under 5K and the ford was 7400.00 and was up 70HP (HP may be off). I do think Stan Lester (fastrax) really tried to make the ford happen to allow a choice, but it never worked out.

[JustAddDirt]

If it was a 347ci that would mean it was a stroked 302. Which would be considerably less weight than the 604 as well.
That would be so much better of an option than the 604 just Because of the weight (roughly 50lbs)

[fastford]

the weight was the biggest issue , the 347 was a good bit lighter than the 350 chevy , and there 351 crate was to heavy , but the real reason was this was a cheby deal to start with and gm wanted ALL the money , there was a rumor that Chrysler look at this and realized what i just mentioned and decided there was no use.......

[swingarm4life]

Not to mention the only Ford parts in the Ford engine are the block and heads.
Scat rods and crank, comp cam, mahle pistons, and clevite rings among other stuff. The engine is about 40-50 pounds lighter than the chevy and makes more than the advertised hp.

[fastford]

you saying we trying to cheat swingarm? lol

[brad hibbard]

we have been involved with the GM crate program since the beginning and I have watched and heard the Ford story---
to my knowledge ---everything that has been written so far in this thread is pretty accurate
there were some early attempts to even the engines up with a restrictor plate but that never gained much traction

Brad

https://www.race-1.com

[fastford]

there was a guy in north alabama named gant , that they let test one and from what i understood , thats when they (crate association) decided it had to much of an advantage , my problem with that was , they chose a very experienced racer to do this test , he could have out run his competition at that time with a 12hp briggs and stratton , they should have chosen a less experienced driver , like crate racing was suppose to be......JMO.......

[brad hibbard]

couple things that have not been mentioned

1st--sponsorship
Chevrolet/GM has put a ton of sponsorship money into the crate world and I have not heard where the other 2 manufacturers have even considered any equal commitment

2nd---this is my personal theory...
in the beginning very few people (including myself) thought that "crate" racing would catch on ---not to mention become a large portion of racing in general in such a short period of time
it happened quick and big----GM was able to make a large footprint in the racing world with 2 basic engines in a very short time -----it would be hard for a manufacturer to compete or the industry to adjust to another manufacturer

just my 2cents

Brad

https://www.race-1.com

[fastford]

1st , they did not want another manufacture to participate , so no need for them to spend sponsorship dollars on the class , which brings me to #2 , GM is the sanctioning body , rule makers and such , so , Why would they ever allow another manufacture to play in there sand box,,,,my personal theory......

[brad hibbard]

GM is the sanctioning body?????? please explain
rule makers???---the only rule that I know of made by GM is the spec manual for the engine
they have carburetor--fuel and header recommendations but never made a rule.

I understand that Ford and Chrysler enthusiasts are less than pleased that the racing industry has been influenced by the Gm crate engines but I don't see how you can blame GM for Ford and Chrysler choosing not to enter the ring

again just my 2 cents

Brad

https://www.race-1.com

[LRtireCHANGER]

The main point should be that G.M. started the whole idea of spec engines on dirt tracks. If you were in G.M.'s current position of having your spec. engines used exclusively in several racing series, would you allow other manufacturers in the series that you developed???? I highly doubt that you would allow this, I would not. If you want to run a ford engine, you have 2 choices, run in an open engine late model class, or start your own series that uses ford spec engines. I am not trying to be rude by saying this, but sometimes I think some people need to back up and look at the whole picture.

[fastford]

i agree tirechanger , i think it was a business adventure from the beginning , i have no use for a crate engine whether it is a ford or a chevy , i just hate to hear that a ford cant compete in crate racing because IMO they have never really been given a chance , i realize short track racing is typically a chevy thing , which is the" whole picture " I suppose , but i think it would have been nice to have a little diversity .......

[billetbirdcage]

i agree tirechanger , i think it was a business adventure from the beginning , i have no use for a crate engine whether it is a ford or a chevy , i just hate to hear that a ford cant compete in crate racing because IMO they have never really been given a chance , i realize short track racing is typically a chevy thing , which is the" whole picture " I suppose , but i think it would have been nice to have a little diversity .......

First I will say I been a ford guy since I was 12 years old. However with crate racing having a choice would be nice for a couple reasons the main problem with it would be like NASCAR during the Goodyear/Hoosier tire era. Both companies trying to out do the other and kept bringing softer and softer tires to the tracks and next thing you know guys are popping tires due to them not lasting and guys using one tire here and that tire there and end up buying both brands.

Keeping or making the engines really equal wasn't gonna be super easy, so really it's easier to just have one engine that everyone uses.

[Mopar DLM]

It's been probably close to 20 years ago but Chrysler did have a 360 CI 400 HP crate engine designed specifically for racing. In typical Chrysler fashion it was built by engineers and not race people. The block they used was an R series race block which is about 60-70 pounds heavier than a stock block and used the same heads that are used on our over 800 HP super engines. Intake ports way to big and a 2.15 valve has no place on a low RPM 360 CI crate engine. They were built at 9 to 1 compression and a lot of them ran hot from people lugging them around. A lot of the series didn't like that the only rocker arms available were T&D or Jesel. Seems they didn't think it was fair. Chrysler tried but had a bunch of idiots in that program. They were smart and let real race engine builders like Stanton, Gearte, and Malcuit help design the sprint car and late model engines.