Tuning with Load Stick

[bananahammack00]

Anyone here using a load stick on their modified and willing to share some results? I like the idea of being able to switch springs quickly, but not sure how to use it from there. I currently have an IMCA GRT mod w/ 604 and when it dries out I'm having trouble getting it on the right front to help turn into the corner. It has a 500 LF and 550 RF. Would it be better to put a softer RF spring in there 500/525?, pull it to a 3" number and match the spring load? This would obviously raise ride height, is that a problem? I've heard both ways that ride height doesn't matter if you are tuning from a travel number. Would I be better off using a short shaft RF shock and "preloading" the soft RF number to match 3" number? I'm open to suggestions and any feedback that might be out there. Ultimate goal is to get the car to turn into the corner better. I went to a 600# RF and made the condition worse. I've tried a stiffer compression and bigger rebound RF and that helped turn the car but didnt let the weight back to the LR on corner exit. I get that adjustments have pros/cons, just looking for the combo that works best for me.-Banana

[north louisiana dirt]

march 2020 dirtmonthly mag has a mark bush article you need to read.... all your answers in there.... go to dirtmonthly.com for free down load.. they are free now because they can't print/ship..... you need a shock with shorter rebound or get your shock guy to put internal stops on your shaft... get an accurate measurement of your eye to eye on your shock with the car sitting at ride height.... record that number..... you want the rebound to never go past your ride height number.... then you pre load a 400 or 450 rf spring using the wedge bolt....like having a 2 stage spring on rf.... bunch of Mark Bush articles in the mag each month...... March 2020 has the one called Ask Mark.... first question is about IMCA rule on Chains now legal... the RF shock stuff is about 10 paragraphs later... hope this helps.. we tried it last week and it worked great on our old shaw.... see ya

[bananahammack00]

Thanks NLD. Found the article and had most of what I was looking for! Where did you start for spring rate? I have 450, 500 and 550 on the shelf, not sure if I should just start witha 450 and see if I like it then start buying what I need. Thanks again! -Banana

[pa_dirt]

I’m interested in reading the article ... but can’t seem to find it... got a page number?

[north louisiana dirt]

march 2020 page 98 and 99

[north louisiana dirt]

Banana: I started with a 500 last Fri.... I am borrowing a 400 tomorrow and will put it on a spring checker and see how much I can smash it before I get into a coil bind issue.... Pre load is the key.... I figure I can play more with a softer spring .... one video i found at DirtCarUSA shows rf spring in compression with a tie down shock vs a non tie down... I was more interested in the spring... so the guy at there FB page says it was a 450.. but he also said they went to a 500 because " it was more consistent"..... don't know what he meant... he never answered that part of the question... maybe more consistent at not bottoming out the shock in the holes and bumps once you get the nose down where you want it....... I will let you know how the testing with the 400 goes.... our Shaw by Landers is a chevelle front car with stock lowers (rules).... so std stuff..... I am guessing from the travels I got last week.( with a 500).. a 450 -500 will be in the range... the 400 is all I have available right at this moment...

[bananahammack00]

I tried the 450 this weekend. Def got on the nose better and seemed to turn better. However, on my GRT it seemed like I gave up some grip on exit. I'm on IMCA rules so stock all around and no bumps stops etc. What do you have for spring on the rear? I had a 16" 150# LR and 175 RR. Seemed like right in the center it was way tight on throttle and will probably go back to a 200# LR. I like the feel of the soft LR (125#) but it tightens the car too much in the center and I basically need to break traction to turn it and then I'm a duck in the water... I can't seem to find a happy balance between soft and stiff...Frustrating!

[DrDuctTape]

So is it necessary to short shaft your shocks or raise frame mount to use shocks as stops and preload against them? (slack in chains rules)Or is it ok to throw out your ride height numbers and just let the front set higher statically?

[bananahammack00]

DDT--I raised my frame mount to use the shocks as the stop for preloading. I asked the same question as you in my original post. I'm assuming you want to stop at ride height so all the front end geometry is where it needs to be. IMCA requires slack chains, so the shock is used. I figured if I liked the performance, I'd invest in the short shaft stuff. -Banana

[north louisiana dirt]

Banana: you need to go whole hog and go to the extended LR spring deal.... we are on a 16" long 85# LR spring...set it 1.25" pre load at full hike...jack it up, put it on the chain, take a tape measure and set the spring @ 14.750.... you will get that drive back.... :-)And once you get the RF where it won't go up past ride height... then pre load that 450 .750 or so and use that to manipulate that corner of the car.... if you look at the shock indicator and its only moving 3".... back off the pre load... if its moving 4.750... put some more pre load in the spring... that's the deal with holding it at ride height... using the wedge bolt and soft spring pre load like a helper spring or dual spring deal on a LM....

[north louisiana dirt]

what's your LS % and Rear %.?... remember , everything you do to make a car turn on entry and in the middle are all band aids if the LS % is too low.... most people never get a car loose enough to roll the entry and middle correctly because they don't like the feel of a car that doesn't have something to lean on on entry... It's a security blanket kinda thing for drivers.... if you have your brake bias way back and are one 3 wheel brakes...your probably to snug on entry.... Entry is everything... it dictates the whole set of corners..

[Kromulous]

What springs are you using in these rates? Were on a Chevelle clip (AFCO) i see a lot of 5" springs are not offered in that low of a rate. Most are 5.5"

Also, anyone ever try the QA1 UHT Springs? I usually run the Eibach, but wow there pricey, and i cant get a 450. I am wanting to get into the preloading deal on the RF.

[95shaw]

My question about the load stick is, how much does the rigidity of the shock mount affect readings?

Do you try to stiffen this area of chassis to get more consistent readings?

[MasterSbilt_Racer]

My question about the load stick is, how much does the rigidity of the shock mount affect readings?

Do you try to stiffen this area of chassis to get more consistent readings?

As much as it affects actual load on a late model.

[Kromulous]

Im sure some cars aren't braced for that load. I see some now that have sort of a strut running down to the frame, also like how Ruhlman is doing the down tube sorta like a LM with clip under the A frame tower.