Ed Hinton's take on NASCAR at Indianapolis Motor Speedway

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  • CIRF
    Senior Member
    • Jul 2007
    • 8122

    #1

    Ed Hinton's take on NASCAR at Indianapolis Motor Speedway

    Ed Hinton has always been a NASCAR guy, but you wouldn't know it by reading this. I was saying this clear back in 1993 when they announced the taxi cabs would be coming to IMS. NASCAR should never have been brought to Indy.



    NASCAR eroding Indy's greatness
    By Ed Hinton
    INDIANAPOLIS -- I wish this had been the last Brickyard 400.

    I wish the crass erosion of this hallowed ground would cease, and the damage could be limited to the horrid gullies already washed into the traditions of Indianapolis Motor Speedway by NASCAR.

    But no, hell, no, the strip-mining of this place's dignity goes on and on, like the garish droning of the cars that stumbled round and round again on Sunday, in the 18th running of motor racing's answer to a herd of buffalo stampeding down the hardwood hallways of a palace, slipping and sliding.

    This sluggish event, won by Paul Menard in a gas-mileage crapshoot, ended Indy's centennial era, 100 years since the first Indianapolis 500 in 1911.

    And with Indy's century ends its greatness.

    Those weren't fans disguised as empty seats at the Brickyard 400 on Sunday, they were just empty seats. And there seems to be more of them for this race every year.
    NASCAR has never belonged here, and it never will.

    It took the American public a while to figure that out.

    But Sunday's second straight Brickyard crowd of barely 100,000 makes it undeniable that the thrill is gone. (I don't care what the official estimates were. I've been coming here since 1975, and I've learned to read these, the most massive grandstands on the face of the earth, pretty well.)

    Sunday made one thing certain, for what it's worth now: The Indy 500 stands again as the biggest race at this place, having drawn 250,000 in May. Time was when the Indiana State Police estimated nearly 400,000 for the 500, but that was when it was the only race here each year.

    That was before NASCAR came pillaging.

    When you think about it, NASCAR is at the root of all the evils that have befallen Indy since the mid-1990s.

    Never would the fallen prince of Indy, Tony George, have split up Indy car racing if not for war chests filled with ticket and TV revenues from the NASCAR race here. He once admitted as much to me.

    So the 400 is the race that gutted the Indy 500 of its prestige, and nearly destroyed major open-wheel racing in America all together.

    And with NASCAR came all its commercial vulgarity, e.g., the practice of selling traditional race names to corporate sponsors. Indy, which had never remotely considered selling the name of the Indianapolis 500, profited for some years by calling its NASCAR race the Allstate 400 at the Brickyard.

    Next July the strip-mining of Indy's dignity will only intensify, with a so-called "super weekend" of racing that really amounts to a cluster of minor league support events.

    The good news is, Sunday really did mark the last Brickyard 400 by that name. The bad news is, the torture will continue next year under the most awkwardly commercial race name ever in American motor racing: The Crown Royal Presents "Your Hero's Name Here" 400 at the Brickyard.

    No offense to the American military or American heroes in general, but a paid promotion for whiskey by whatever inserted name is still a paid promotion for whiskey.

    On the old Formula One course, they'll add to the weekend an event for Rolex Series Grand-Am cars, the poorer of two poor series for sports-car racing in America.

    But wait! There's more! They'll also run -- are you ready for this? -- a Nationwide Series race.

    No offense to the American military or American heroes in general, but a paid promotion for whiskey by whatever inserted name is still a paid promotion for whiskey.
    With a slate like that for 2012, you have to wonder what they'll add to prop up the 400 of '13 here.

    How about a demolition derby? A figure-8 track down near the short chute between Turns 1 and 2 would be cute. While they're at it, why not throw in 100-milers for the bomber class, junkers, street stocks?

    In degrading this once-hallowed place down to dirt-track level, they could also add a hell-driver auto stunt show on the front straightaway. Simultaneously, they could run drag races down the backstretch.

    Maybe they could shoot a guy out of a cannon into the upper decks of the grandstands. (With events like the ones they propose for next year, they could fire a cannon of any kind into the grandstands and not hit anybody.)

    This year they threw in a big muscle-car conclave and show -- including all those antiquated winged Chargers and Plymouth Superbirds from NASCAR circa 1970 -- down near the fourth turn. Local hotel parking lots were turned into hot rod shops each evening.

    With that in mind, they might as well steal the big annual biker shindig from Sturgis, S.D., and bring it to the infield here.

    Where is Humpy Wheeler when they need him? Come to think of it, even Humpy might be mortified by the "super weekend" here next year.

    The NASCAR community keeps swearing its everlasting love and awe of Indy.

    Well, then, why have they degraded it, even stabbed it in the back?

    If they worship Indy so much, then why did they stick a new Cup race just down the road at Kentucky Speedway, just a few weeks ago, to suck the discretionary dollars out of race fans along the Ohio River? This, to go with draining off fans via Kansas Speedway and Chicagoland Speedway, tracks built in the region since the Brickyard 400 began in 1994.

    NASCAR has managed to devastate and nearly destroy the prestige of the Indianapolis 500, and now as NASCAR's own popularity dims nationwide, it drags the Brickyard 400 down with it.

    I wish the Indianapolis 500 could be, as it was from 1911 to 1993, the only motor race held here each year.

    Those years, it was the greatest race on the greatest track in the world. But that was before NASCAR came.
  • ILRaceFan007
    Member
    • Jul 2011
    • 81

    #2
    Ed should turn his snobbish nose down towards the ground a little more often and see that NASCAR is suffering for fans at EVERY track, not just "the hallowed grounds".

    In dozens of ways, not just limited to one mistake, NASCAR hierarchy have destroyed what was the best motorsport series on the planet. I can think of a few of the big ones right here, but this is just a PARTIAL list of how they've ruined the sport in the last decade (I will make them short and sweet, unlike Mr. Hinton):

    1. Cookie cutter tracks. Eliminating most of the short tracks was idiotic.
    2. Toyotas. Sorry, it's just a fact. People don't want to see Toyotas in NASCAR.
    3. The "Chase for the Cup". Moronic. Period. No further discussion needed.
    4. Templates. Ugh. This might be the BIGGEST one. Run whatchya brung, may the best make win.
    5. TV deals. They blew off ESPN at their peak and switched in on us to Fox and NBC, then they started putting races on FX and TNT. Bad, bad, bad. Stupid, stupid, stupid.
    6. Denial. They blame the "economy" for poor ratings and weak ticket sales...how about your (not a nice word)(not a nice word)(not a nice word)(not a nice word) boring product?
    7. Cookie cutter drivers. What happened to the personality? Tony Stewart is the lone remaining throwback and the ONLY reason to watch NASCAR.
    8. Rules enforcement. They pick and choose. They help determine outcomes to help their "storylines". No disrespect to Little E., but every race fan in America new he was going to win the first race at Daytona after his daddy died, and NASCAR didn't let us down. Everyone else had a restrictor plate that day, it appeared Little E had a fullblown big block.
    9. Politics. No one is interested what Mike Helton or Brian France, the ungifted one in the family, has to say about politics. But the constant shoving of right-wing politics down race fans throats turned off a big chunk o' viewers. Same goes for religion. Do you know it's in the CONTRACT that these networks MUST carry the "invocation" before a race? Many fans don't need that crap forced down their throats, including many CHURCHgoers, who would prefer that they just shut up and race.
    10. Saturday night racing. Way to kill your fanbase, idiots. The more Saturdays they run, the more they make bullring fans make choices, and it HURTS BOTH local AND national racing. Is that smart? I think not.

    Like I said, there are dozens of additional reasons why fans are leaving NASCAR in droves, these are just some.

    Oh, btw, things that DON'T suck about NASCAR?

    1. Commercialization. Hinton is DEAD WRONG about this. Do it. Commercialize it. Sell everything you can to sponsors. There's nothing wrong with that. Make money where you can, especially the teams because Lord knows the purses NASCAR pays suck. T-shirt sales, diecast sales, all of it are areas where NASCAR rules. You don't see a lot of "Michael Shumacher" T-shirts running around, do you? Hinton is wrong.

    2. Pomp and circumstance. Outside of the invocation, which is better done privately by each individual at the track, the showmanship of NASCAR is cool. Fly-bys, military salutes, celebs singing the anthem, all good. All very entertaining.

    3. Safety. NASCAR is f'en slow to the party in some areas, but the teams are good about safety generally. They waited about three years too long to make safer barriers a part of every track (actually, truth be known, they waited until the figured out a way to own part of the company and get rich off of it...typical NASCAR greed), but racing is dangerous, and anything they can do to make it less so is a good thing.

    There y'all go. Fire away. But Hinton is an idiot.
    10.

    Comment

    • slick01
      Senior Member
      • May 2007
      • 3599

      #3
      Now IRP (the heck with ORP or LOR) is destroyed by moving the NASCRAP stuff to Indy. All things NASCRAP are bad. They have destroyed everything that at one point was GOOD about NASCAR. But alas, as the top go away rich, the rest are left with what there is.

      In fairness the split in open wheel was long before this. There was first the split from USAC, then later the split caused by the big owners (Penske, Haas, et al) . I know much focused on the road course vs. oval debate. I wouldn't totally throw the blame at Tony George or NASCAR, but throwing in with them or Bruton Smith is never a good idea.

      USAC pitching in with NASCAR on the Silver Crown deal destroyed that series.

      RIP IRP.
      43 races this year.
      Tulsa Expo- 5, Volusia- 3, Bubba Raceway- 3
      Dillon Speedway- 1, Myrtle Beach Speedway-1, Hickory Speedway- 1
      Southern National- 1, Lincoln Speedway-2, Williams Grove Speedway-2, Indiana State Fairgrounds-1
      Anderson (Indiana) Speedway-1, Indianapolis Motor Speedway- 1
      Bloomington Speedway-1, Lawrenceburg Speedway-1
      Kokomo Speedway- 1, Port Royal-1, Limaland- 1
      Eldora- 2, Knoxville- 6, Oskaloosa-2, Attica-2, Wayne County-1

      Comment

      • Clayton_Wetter
        Banned
        • May 2007
        • 16671

        #4
        How did this thread become an attack on Christianity! I don't particularly enjoy envocations but when I see that they are under attack just like everything else in this country that is it's heart and soul, one realizes that our freedoms are attack more than ever.

        Nothing political hear, just a reality check!!!

        Comment

        • HighMaintenance2007
          Senior Member
          • Jul 2007
          • 6876

          #5
          ED is catching the back door in his azz on the twitter circuit among

          his 'friends'....which shows THEIR lack of backbone.


          The only thing he has figured out if that they HAD to give KY a race to keep from

          losing the lawsuit & establishing a precendent to lose to every other state in the

          union that thought they need a N 'race'..


          The ONLY hope the have w todays wham bam fans are to make the cars the same

          color for at least 10 race in a row...so Joe lite beer 6 pack can identify w his driver.

          Nobody knows (or cares) who is driving what w/o a program...



          Hinton may be an idiot, but nobody remembered who he was , until today ....

          RIP POOLE..
          Last edited by HighMaintenance2007; 08-01-2011, 09:24 PM.
          Feb 11-13 2016 Winter Freeze VI World Of Outlaws Super Late Models
          Open Wheel Modifieds & More tba
          SLM & OWM Chassis & Mfg CHAMPIONSHIP CUP
          SYLVANIA GA www.ScrevenMotorSports.com

          Comment

          • HighMaintenance2007
            Senior Member
            • Jul 2007
            • 6876

            #6
            OH...and I give him points for spelling

            ' bomber class, junkers, street stocks' correctly

            dmg

            @HM2099
            Feb 11-13 2016 Winter Freeze VI World Of Outlaws Super Late Models
            Open Wheel Modifieds & More tba
            SLM & OWM Chassis & Mfg CHAMPIONSHIP CUP
            SYLVANIA GA www.ScrevenMotorSports.com

            Comment

            • ILRaceFan007
              Member
              • Jul 2011
              • 81

              #7
              Wetter, you are simply amazing.

              In a 10-pronged attack on NASCAR, all you want to do is compare how someone not liking an invocation (that's "INvocation", with an "I", Einstein) in the context of how it is displayed is somehow an "attack on christianity".

              Why to spin it, buddy. Really? All you got out of that was how one line out of a mini-novel was an "attack on christianity"?

              You've got issues. Seriously. Your "freedoms are under attack" my arse, nobody is doing anything to your "freedoms". Go away.

              Comment

              • Clayton_Wetter
                Banned
                • May 2007
                • 16671

                #8
                So you want to be a big jerk? Guess what? Your infantile posts are a true fit!

                How about sticking your pacifier where the sun don't shine and go to your crib!
                Attached Files

                Comment

                • ferd
                  Member
                  • Jul 2011
                  • 73

                  #9
                  I guess I agree with Mr. Hinton (that NASCAR is hurting Indy) but not for most of the reasons he lists. NASCAR has been going downhill ever since they started grooming Brian France to run it, and today's empty seats prove it. But there are empty seats everywhere now, even at Bristol. Cookie-cutter cars, bland drivers, sky-high prices and races with long boring pacing sections have turned me away. France's (and his buddies') attitudes aren't helping either.

                  But Mr. Hinton forgets two major problems that contributed to the Indy Car split: the CART debacle and drivers with no name recognition who buy their rides. The Brickyard was struggling to stay alive when NASCAR came along… and when you lay down with dogs you do get fleas. I wouldn’t blame NASCAR solely for the Brickyard’s demise. But I do agree that too many gimmicks stain Indy’s reputation.

                  Comment

                  • CIRF
                    Senior Member
                    • Jul 2007
                    • 8122

                    #10
                    Indy was struggling to stay alive? In 1991 or 1992? Don't remember it that way.

                    91 or 92 was when NASCAR first started negotiating with the Speedway to race there. In fact the first indication that NASCAR would in fact run the Speedway was in June of 92 or 93, can't remember for sure. The teams left Michigan and came down to Indy the Monday after the June Michigan race. We left MIS after the race there and drove to Indy, got a room and went to the tire test the next day. They had to stop letting people in because the stands that were designated for the crowd to watch the tire test were full. Rusty Wallace was the first NASCAR stock car on the track due to his number being 2. Ironhead (3) was the second car and Ernie Ervin (4) was the third. No number 1 car was there, I think it was Rick Mast in the 1 car at that time and he wasn't one of the test cars.

                    I've been going to the Indy 500 since 1983 and the place was sold out for the 500 every year during the period leading up to the first Brickyard 400 and was drawing 50,000 to 75,000 for pole day and 30,000 to 50,000 for bump day and carb day. In fact, I would bet there were some years during that time that the Speedway had more people in the stands for 500 pole day than were in the stands for the 2011 Brickyard 400. The years leading up to the first Brickyard weren't exactly the golden years of the Indy 500 but the Speedway was far from struggling to stay alive.

                    Looking around this year while we were at the Indy 500 it was very apparent that if the place wasn't completely sold out it was very close to it while the taxi cabs don't even half fill the place. My how quickly times change.

                    Comment

                    • ferd
                      Member
                      • Jul 2011
                      • 73

                      #11
                      Well I may be wrong, but my opinion about "struggling to stay alive" had to do with the CART / IndyCar split (including lawsuits), the fiasco after CART left and USAC tried to operate and score the race, and comments from Mr. George that the Brickyard could no longer sustain itself from the proceeds of just one race anymore. But please forgive my hazy memory. We seem to both agree that bringing NASCAR in was only a temporary shot in the arm, and that NASCAR is starting to become a burden. Peace.

                      Comment

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