I have a question for the few libs that are on here.

[DirtRacer2014]

This question was directed at a friend of mine the other night while he speaking at My kids college. He was asked a question about the role of capitalism in our current economic malaise. He immediately challenged the premise of the question because He was sure that the person who asked the question didn't understand what capitalism really is. He replied. Capitalism has become a dirty word among a select few on the left, but he ask, "What component of capitalism has failed?" When you leave ideology at the door and boil it down, capitalism is simply economic freedom broken down three ways. First, is the ability to price a product or service without coercion. Second, is the ability to trade your labor or intellect for value. And third, is the ability to acquire private property. For those who argue against capitalism I ask, "Which component do you wish to take away?" Do you want the government to determine the price for products or services? The failure of #Obamacare has shown the absurdity of that idea. Do you wish to report to work and have the government determine what you can earn? And, finally, do you wish the government to determine what you can and cannot own? If the answer is no, then I ask you to take a deeper dive into how we got into this economic mess. You will quickly find that it was not capitalism that did it but the lack thereof. Always remember, economic freedom is political freedom. So my question would be to the few liberals on here. What part would you like to see erased?

[Bubstr]

This question was directed at a friend of mine the other night while he speaking at My kids college. He was asked a question about the role of capitalism in our current economic malaise. He immediately challenged the premise of the question because He was sure that the person who asked the question didn't understand what capitalism really is. He replied. Capitalism has become a dirty word among a select few on the left, but he ask, "What component of capitalism has failed?" When you leave ideology at the door and boil it down, capitalism is simply economic freedom broken down three ways. First, is the ability to price a product or service without coercion. Second, is the ability to trade your labor or intellect for value. And third, is the ability to acquire private property. For those who argue against capitalism I ask, "Which component do you wish to take away?" Do you want the government to determine the price for products or services? The failure of #Obamacare has shown the absurdity of that idea. Do you wish to report to work and have the government determine what you can earn? And, finally, do you wish the government to determine what you can and cannot own? If the answer is no, then I ask you to take a deeper dive into how we got into this economic mess. You will quickly find that it was not capitalism that did it but the lack thereof. Always remember, economic freedom is political freedom. So my question would be to the few liberals on here. What part would you like to see erased?

I wouldn't classify myself as Liberal or Conservative. Is there room in your labeling for Pragmatist? I think everyone that hasn't buried their head in the sand, can agree we have a economic mess. Why do we have this mess? A conservative will say it's all the free stuff. Too much Socialism. The liberal will say Capitalism has created this need, filled by free stuff. They are both right to some extent, except nothing is free.

What we are seeing is Capitalism at it's finest. Nothing holding you back, winner takes all Capitalism. That includes maintaining a cheap and abundant work force, that includes a lot of unemployed and fixing it so the working pays for the unemployed, while the Capitalist reaps the profit. It is a misconception that Capitalism equals a free market. The market is controlled by the Capitalist that holds the power, usually money. Examples of Capitalism are the land barons and surfs of middle age Europe, Aristocracy and poor houses of England, Robber Barons and huddling masses of this country in the late 1800s early 1900s. If we can't learn from history, what can we learn from. The trouble with real Capitalism is there are no rules. It becomes legal theft. Example, big banks participated in naked short selling during the last crash. Everyone knows they did. Everyone knows it's against the law. No one prosecuted even one of them. No one even complained about the lack of prosecution. Well at least no one that had any power. They where allowed to take the money and run. A whole lot of money that came from your retirement accounts. Yes there is money to be made during a falling stock market. That's Capitalism at it's best.

After all the bad mouthing of Capitalism, I still believe we need it, if for no other reason, to keep everyone motivated. What we don't need is Capitalism with out rules. Our Capitalism was doing well for all of us, until some of the rules that served us well for most of a century where removed or unenforced, even with the oppressive debt based currency of the FED, the supremo capitalists. I also believe we need Socialism. Not only the Police and fire departments, military and education, that creates a environment to support Capitalism , but the welfare and unemployment benefits. These things are needed by capitalists and should be paid for by Capitalists in proportion to their profit from Capitalism.

[racin6mod]

your first mistake is assuming. the gop supporters assume all non gop backers hate capitalism. there are a he11 of a lot of business owners are dem or as you label everyone liberals. the free market is a double edged sword and the elite take full advantage.

[LITE-INN]

correcto their is libs and conservatives on both sides

[DirtRacer2014]

your first mistake is assuming. the gop supporters assume all non gop backers hate capitalism. there are a he11 of a lot of business owners are dem or as you label everyone liberals. the free market is a double edged sword and the elite take full advantage.

I did not assume anything I simply ask a question to the liberal supporter on here. and as you can see most responses have been from the liberal side. So no First mistake.

[Bubstr]

I did not assume anything I simply ask a question to the liberal supporter on here. and as you can see most responses have been from the liberal side. So no First mistake.

Yes, first mistake. Since I am the only responder and have never voted for a Democrat for president, you would be mistaken. I may have gotten a sour taste from the Regan years and didn't vote republican since. I'd lump both together and both taste like the south end of a north bound skunk.

I do need to apologize for voting for Regan because he was a key instrument in where we are today. Champion of unregulated capitalism, union buster, founder of the trickle down theory, initiated NAFTA and other trade deals that took our jobs and one of the biggest supporters of the corrupt military industrial complex, something Eisenhower, who knew the military, warned us about. In today's world of instant gratification, we don't see long term effects, but we should be able to look back, so we don't repeat those mistakes and rectify any that we can.

[mudslinger47]

I agree bubstr, Reagan was a great President....and your a liberal to cowardly to admit it....just the way I see it, you don't have to agree. I'd take twenty years of Reagans over this asshat we have now...Oh by the by, I don't think we've ever had a president named Regan.....got your country's mixed up?

[Bubstr]

I agree bubstr, Reagan was a great President....and your a liberal to cowardly to admit it....just the way I see it, you don't have to agree. I'd take twenty years of Reagans over this asshat we have now...Oh by the by, I don't think we've ever had a president named Regan.....got your country's mixed up?

Sorry, You have problems dealing with facts, or you are one of the elites that benefited from policies his administration set in motion. You must like the Idea of elitist corporations being able to outsourcing and shipping jobs to other countries and still able to repatriate profits at lower tax rates than the employees that lost the jobs paid. You must like the idea of a handful of Oil companies swallowing up all the small ones and fixing prices to fleece all of us at the filling station. You must like the fact, that we spend more on Defense than the next ten countries and are no safer for it. You must like the fact, that Unions where weakened, the only lobbyist that had similar interests with working men and women of this country, making the Elite corporations lobby much more effective. You must like the idea of 1% wealth rising, while middle class is going away. You must like the fact that your state's usury laws are now ineffective. You got more that 20 years under Reagan, You got 30 years of his results. He may have been a charismatic, likeable president, but he did not do this country any favors. It is arguable, that with out Reagan, we wouldn't have had this last recession that started with sharp Oil prices, that created home owners budget imbalances, that started the real estate fiasco.

Now, of course, your not going to agree with this, because FOX news didn't tell it to you. Isn't it strange that the liberal media also doesn't tell us this. Could it be both are owned by elitist money and only want to argue trivial talking points? Go bury your head in the sand, your comfortable there.

[dirtisforracin]

So now its Reagan fault. Not only Bush's fault, we gotta go back 30 yrs and blame Reagan. Oil companies vs Goverment who makes more money on the selling of a gallon of gas?? How much of our products are oil based? What percentage of oil is used to make gasoline? What president was or is in office when median income has dropped a couple grand a year. Who was insistant that you did not need money and forced banks to sell people home they could not afford? Your right elitist in both partys. Thats why I'm for term limits.

[Bubstr]

So now its Reagan fault. Not only Bush's fault, we gotta go back 30 yrs and blame Reagan. Oil companies vs Goverment who makes more money on the selling of a gallon of gas?? How much of our products are oil based? What percentage of oil is used to make gasoline? What president was or is in office when median income has dropped a couple grand a year. Who was insistant that you did not need money and forced banks to sell people home they could not afford? Your right elitist in both partys. Thats why I'm for term limits.

We all know the government and we the people are 17 trillion in debt, so it wasn't you or me. Could the elite money lenders and the oil companies be splitting those profits? Duh

The banks and moneylenders encouraged lax regulation on loans. That is their business. Show me any instance where politicians don't do exactly what the campaign funders don't want done? If your memory is long enough remember the price spike in oil? It doubled almost overnight. every thing is oil dependent and the price of everything went up. Transportation businesses went out of business in approximately two weeks. These affordable loans became unaffordable over night. Sure there where flippers that depended on the rising value of homes to make profit, but ask how many flippers do you know and how many home owners do you know. This problem was a government problem, but it wasn't because they gave to the poor,it was because they gave the elite the tools to fleece the middle class. Do you think Banks lost money on these houses? Remember they loan on marginal reserve banking principles. After just a couple years they are in the black on your home loan at that time and they get the house. $100,000 house, they have $10,000 in real money invested. Bankruptcy wipes out the debt and they still have all the interest paid and the house. They bitch but make more faster by foreclosing that taking payments. Are you one of those silly people that think when you pay off a house, you own it. Try not paying tax, it's still just interest payment collected by the government. Try running a business out of your home. Government has more control over your house than you do. If you have enough money, they are going to take at least part of their home back when you die and even if you don't have that much, keep paying that interest.

While Reagan doesn't own all our problems, he did put a big chink in our armor. He may have started NAFTA, but Clinton finished and signed it. There is no difference in the two parties.

[LITE-INN]

http://www.infowars.com/mancow-muller-obama-is-an-actor-trained-by-harry-lennix/

[dirtisforracin]

Bustr we can agree on that both parties are to blame. I agree on federal taxes as well, we pay to much, for very little in return.

[Bubstr]

Bustr we can agree on that both parties are to blame. I agree on federal taxes as well, we pay to much, for very little in return.

We don't pay for the services we get in return. We just pay on the interest of our National Debt. When have you ever seen the debt go lower than the previous year? I've been around for 70 years and can't remember seeing it. We are still paying interest on ww1. Tax and inflation are just a means to get our money to the Elite bankers. You should have paid attention when I started the cure for capitalism thread. You are paying interest to someone that never had the money to loan you. If we even wanted to pay off the national debt, we would have to borrow it to pay. We can't pay the interest alone right now. We borrow 40% of that money, by issuing bonds.

[mudslinger47]

Hey wait, didn't we skip a president in there to add to the blame. Should be "W" his dad then Reagan....get it right lib.... heck maybe we need to go back to Nixon..... but really, you want to know where the problems started, go back to the Great Society.... as a matter of fact I think you could reasonably go back to FDR and pin the blame there.....the gubmint always knows best...just ask'm...

[Bubstr]

Hey wait, didn't we skip a president in there to add to the blame. Should be "W" his dad then Reagan....get it right lib.... heck maybe we need to go back to Nixon..... but really, you want to know where the problems started, go back to the Great Society.... as a matter of fact I think you could reasonably go back to FDR and pin the blame there.....the gubmint always knows best...just ask'm...

You can blame any of them. They all had a hand in it. Go way back to Woodrow Wilson, he was president when the FED got it's charter.