Has anyone heard of any new drivers who may be going to LOLMDS?

[W2Racing09]

Sometimes this is just painful to watch.........


If everybody in the room can see it but you can't.......it's probably not " everybody else" that's incorrect.

Love how folks that have been watching slm racing for 4 or 5 years think they can tell people that have been watching or involved for 40 or 50 how dirt racing is suppose to go..........laughable

Carry on.

Do you think DLM racing just exists in its own world where big companies throw money at "The Good Guys" and don't expect anything back in return? I don't claim to be a DLM expert, but I do claim to be pretty well versed in advertisement and marketing.

There is no upside to dropping Richards and B.Shepp in exchange for Francis. There are few drivers where there would be an upside, maybe Pierce, or someone like that but certainly not Francis. This isn't Reece Monuments or Seubert Calf Ranches or something like that. The person making the decision on which cars to sponsor is accountable to someone unlike those businesses, and decisions need to be rationalized and make sense. You can't just say I like Francis better or something like that.

If you have reasoning behind the decision beyond "You don't know the history" or something like that then by all means lets hear it but so far all you both have done is tell me that I'm being biased in saying that Richards and B.Shepp are much more competitive than Francis (which is actually fact not opinion), and that Francis had the sponsorship before (a long time ago).

Thanks,
Jeff.

[SLIDING SIDEWAYS]

back to the original post...... don't know if anyone heard anything while out at the World Finals but if Jesse Stovall could secure some more sponsorship he would like to run more national shows. two years ago he had 19 wins running MLRA and MARS and only running the in Midwest and won the MLRA points this year. not sure if he could run full time nationally but I did hear the team is going to head either out west this winter/spring or head southeast and see how it goes, don't think they have made there minds up yet with what direction to go after the first of the year, but would really like to branch out from the Midwest.

I thought he looked good at world finals. Car was fast

[W2Racing09]

I'm not saying the rumor is true or not. But, would it really hurt for Francis to get the sponsorship over Josh?? Your sort of making it sound like Steve is not worthy?? There's a lot of guys out there that don't win ever week W2. But, they also need sponsorship get up and down the road. Its obvious everyone knows where your love is directed. But, it's not like Mark will fold and the house car won't be out there on the track if Valvoline leaves. To make the statement, you won't buy Valvoline if they leave Josh is stupid!! The sport needs sponsorships no matter who's car their on!! And they should be supported, even if you don't love the driver. There are other drivers out there besides Josh and BShepp you do realize that don't you?

I don't think it would really hurt the Richards team, with B.Shepp going back to his own stuff though I'm sure every little bit of sponsorship helps. I don't necessarily think Steve is unworthy, he had Optima Batteries this season and that is a good sponsor too.

I go out of my way to patronize companies that support my favorite drivers, series, tracks, (sports teams, and anything else). Josh Richards is my favorite driver so I buy Valvoline stuff even when it costs more for my daily drivers. I also make sure to support companies like Bad Boy Off Road, Craftsman (I've bought Craftsman exclusively since they began sponsoring WoO -- aside from Power Tools), and Morton Buildings is currently in the running for the Pole Barn I'm having built in the Spring (although a local company that also supports racing is probably who I will go with considering price and the customer service I've received so far). If Valvoline were to drop Richards and B. Shepp I wouldn't go out of my way to buy them anymore -- in fact I would probably start buying more AMSOIL (which is what I already use for pretty much all of the other synthetics that I buy) since they sponsor Billy Moyer Jr which is another driver I'm a fan of.

[Barbecueboy]

Do you think DLM racing just exists in its own world where big companies throw money at "The Good Guys" and don't expect anything back in return? I don't claim to be a DLM expert, but I do claim to be pretty well versed in advertisement and marketing.

There is no upside to dropping Richards and B.Shepp in exchange for Francis. There are few drivers where there would be an upside, maybe Pierce, or someone like that but certainly not Francis. This isn't Reece Monuments or Seubert Calf Ranches or something like that. The person making the decision on which cars to sponsor is accountable to someone unlike those businesses, and decisions need to be rationalized and make sense. You can't just say I like Francis better or something like that.

If you have reasoning behind the decision beyond "You don't know the history" or something like that then by all means lets hear it but so far all you both have done is tell me that I'm being biased in saying that Richards and B.Shepp are much more competitive than Francis (which is actually fact not opinion), and that Francis had the sponsorship before (a long time ago).

Thanks,
Jeff.

No upside ????

Here are a couple.

Gets Francis cheaper.
Rewarding the longtime Francis loyalty.
Other sponsor synergized relationships , maybe it's just a good fit for Steve , his current group of new sponsors and the valvoline guys again.

So to say there is no upside is a bit of a stretch........actually it's not even stretch, it's just incorrect.

I ,like others though think it will be a multi pronged approach with the valvoline guys expanding sponsorship , not cutting it back.( but all you assumed was that I just think they are bailing on your guy Richards).........objectivity blinded by the rose colored rocket glasses again, because I never once even came close to saying anything of the sort.

What kills me about you sometimes is the condescending nature of your posts......as if you have to explain to us how it all works.

Like your claim of having a marketing background.....to hear you talk and to read your stuff you make it sound as if you have that market cornered on 4m.

I am in that business, so I kinda know how that marketing stuff goes Jeff, I got my degree in 1985....about 10 years after seeing my first late model dirt track race with my father.

Happy you are enthusiastic and passionate about the sport.......but give the guys that have been around it a little while some credit.

I've learned the hard way that just because you have an assumption about someone or something, it doesn't always make it so.

given you two examples of that in this very post.

[Barbecueboy]

Do you think DLM racing just exists in its own world where big companies throw money at "The Good Guys" and don't expect anything back in return? I don't claim to be a DLM expert, but I do claim to be pretty well versed in advertisement and marketing.

There is no upside to dropping Richards and B.Shepp in exchange for Francis. There are few drivers where there would be an upside, maybe Pierce, or someone like that but certainly not Francis. This isn't Reece Monuments or Seubert Calf Ranches or something like that. The person making the decision on which cars to sponsor is accountable to someone unlike those businesses, and decisions need to be rationalized and make sense. You can't just say I like Francis better or something like that.

If you have reasoning behind the decision beyond "You don't know the history" or something like that then by all means lets hear it but so far all you both have done is tell me that I'm being biased in saying that Richards and B.Shepp are much more competitive than Francis (which is actually fact not opinion), and that Francis had the sponsorship before (a long time ago).

Thanks,
Jeff.

And the valvoline on Steves car, wasn't exactly a long time ago............think you mentioned your first slm race was in 2012 maybe???

So for you, yeah......maybe it was a long time ago.

I remember being at Charlotte when he wrapped up the championship in the beitler car....and it wasn't all that long ago...believe the valvoline sticker was on the car....but maybe I'm wrong.

[MasterSbilt_Racer]

Since when does DLM racing move the needle for Valvoline and make product fly off the shelf? I have a hard time thinking there is much impact.

[Josh Bayko]

Since when does DLM racing move the needle for Valvoline and make product fly off the shelf? I have a hard time thinking there is much impact.

I doubt it moves the needle much, if at all for Valvoline. However, it certainly doesn't hurt them to give out a few sponsorship in DLM racing, because it's rather affordable (in the grand scheme of motorsport sponsorship) advertising.

[MasterSbilt_Racer]

I doubt it moves the needle much, if at all for Valvoline. However, it certainly doesn't hurt them to give out a few sponsorship in DLM racing, because it's rather affordable (in the grand scheme of motorsport sponsorship) advertising.

Agreed. But I guess my point was that if it doesn't move the needle, performance of the car is very unimportant.

[W2Racing09]

Heard the other day Steve Francis has took the big valvoline sponsorship from Richards and shepherd and will field his own cars and run Lucas next year. And there is a newer s and s hauler out on 60 by his shop and it's not tims his is a 5150

No upside ????

Here are a couple.

Gets Francis cheaper.
Rewarding the longtime Francis loyalty.
Other sponsor synergized relationships , maybe it's just a good fit for Steve , his current group of new sponsors and the valvoline guys again.

So to say there is no upside is a bit of a stretch........actually it's not even stretch, it's just incorrect.

I ,like others though think it will be a multi pronged approach with the valvoline guys expanding sponsorship , not cutting it back.( but all you assumed was that I just think they are bailing on your guy Richards).........objectivity blinded by the rose colored rocket glasses again, because I never once even came close to saying anything of the sort.

What kills me about you sometimes is the condescending nature of your posts......as if you have to explain to us how it all works.

Like your claim of having a marketing background.....to hear you talk and to read your stuff you make it sound as if you have that market cornered on 4m.

I am in that business, so I kinda know how that marketing stuff goes Jeff, I got my degree in 1985....about 10 years after seeing my first late model dirt track race with my father.

Happy you are enthusiastic and passionate about the sport.......but give the guys that have been around it a little while some credit.

I've learned the hard way that just because you have an assumption about someone or something, it doesn't always make it so.

given you two examples of that in this very post.

If you are involved in this business then you should know that the "upside" you mentioned isn't exactly the type of stuff you list in a board meeting when you are explaining to your boss why you just spent $25-30k of the advertising budget on a Dirt Late Model - aside from the less expensive part, which isn't necessarily true since nobody knows the specifics.

Also, I made sure to quote the actual person who stated that Francis was taking the Richards/Sheppard sponsorship to clear up any confusion there. More power to them if they want to additionally sponsor someone -- like they have with the Conley's, Cody Mahoney, Gregg Satterlee and others in the past as well. I wasn't arguing that they shouldn't sponsor Francis, I was arguing that dropping your two high profile/marketable drivers and in exchange sponsoring Francis does not make much sense.

As I've said previously, the condescending part is coming from your head. My posts are not meant to be condescending, but there is nothing I can do to stop you from feeling that way beyond saying I'm sorry that you feel that way.

Thanks,
Jeff.

[NormP]

Agreed. But I guess my point was that if it doesn't move the needle, performance of the car is very unimportant.

That was going to be my point to Jeff when I got home from work, but you beat me to it.

Valvoline is a multi-national company with God only knows how much money going out for everything under the sun. Dirt Late Model racing is a pretty small segment of autosports. So I don't think Valvoline is as concerned about who the best in the business is as Jeff thinks they are.

As far as the sponsorship goes, there is a pretty decent history with Steve Francis the hometown guy, and I think Jeff is completely overlooking that. And as BBQ boy said, it wasn't that long ago that the big V was on his car. He only let it go because he was going to CBR with the Georgia Boot ride. It wasn't yanked from him by anyone.

[Josh Bayko]

Agreed. But I guess my point was that if it doesn't move the needle, performance of the car is very unimportant.

I tend to agree. Relationships tend to matter more. And let's be serious here, Steve Francis hasn't exactly set the world on fire the last few years, but he's still fairly competitive on the national scene. Sure, Richards was better in 2016 and will be going into the future, but it's completely unfair to compare anybody's stats to Richards (other than Bloomer) at this point.

And I maintain that Valvoline will likely be on both Francis' and Richards' cars in 2017. Visibility on both tours that way.

[W2Racing09]

I doubt it moves the needle much, if at all for Valvoline. However, it certainly doesn't hurt them to give out a few sponsorship in DLM racing, because it's rather affordable (in the grand scheme of motorsport sponsorship) advertising.

Agreed. But I guess my point was that if it doesn't move the needle, performance of the car is very unimportant.

They use Josh Richards and the Rocket House Car quite extensively in the Team Valvoline "Club" that they have. You can join there and watch educational videos about things like changing gears in a DLM, etc. Josh Richards has done a decent sized series of videos for them on there. I do think unlike a lot of DLM cars there is a decent reach for Valvoline in conjunction with the Rocket House Car (which is pretty much the featured car on the WoO series and is in a lot of their advertising). It is definitely a small piece of the pie for them, but I would say they probably recognize the value of it as well more so than they do with some of the smaller teams they also sponsor.

[Barbecueboy]

If you are involved in this business then you should know that the "upside" you mentioned isn't exactly the type of stuff you list in a board meeting when you are explaining to your boss why you just spent $25-30k of the advertising budget on a Dirt Late Model - aside from the less expensive part, which isn't necessarily true since nobody knows the specifics.

Also, I made sure to quote the actual person who stated that Francis was taking the Richards/Sheppard sponsorship to clear up any confusion there. More power to them if they want to additionally sponsor someone -- like they have with the Conley's, Cody Mahoney, Gregg Satterlee and others in the past as well. I wasn't arguing that they shouldn't sponsor Francis, I was arguing that dropping your two high profile/marketable drivers and in exchange sponsoring Francis does not make much sense.

As I've said previously, the condescending part is coming from your head. My posts are not meant to be condescending, but there is nothing I can do to stop you from feeling that way beyond saying I'm sorry that you feel that way.

Thanks,
Jeff.

IF, I'm involved in the business of marketing??????

( insert long sigh here^^^^^^^)

I wouldn't know anything about sponsoring drivers, series or events either......please do learn me some stuff on that side of it.

( insert same sigh here^^^^^^)

[Barbecueboy]

That was going to be my point to Jeff when I got home from work, but you beat me to it.

Valvoline is a multi-national company with God only knows how much money going out for everything under the sun. Dirt Late Model racing is a pretty small segment of autosports. So I don't think Valvoline is as concerned about who the best in the business is as Jeff thinks they are.

As far as the sponsorship goes, there is a pretty decent history with Steve Francis the hometown guy, and I think Jeff is completely overlooking that. And as BBQ boy said, it wasn't that long ago that the big V was on his car. He only let it go because he was going to CBR with the Georgia Boot ride. It wasn't yanked from him by anyone.

Jeff said it was a long time ago.......so it must have been a long time ago.

Fugetaboutit........it's jeffs world, we are all students.in it.

[chupp n bloomer fan]

I think Jlacey has a man crush for Josh and tries to over come it with hate.O'Neal did it at Eldora under green to change tires and nothing was done. All mighty Bloomquist caused a caution under green at Portsmouth and drove away....didn't have a flat or anything. Josh had a LR tire going down and didn't get the two laps to change it because it wasn't completely flat. So I don't blame him. While we are condemning and b1tching I don't understand why Lanigan and Casebolt wasn't disqualified.... WOO rules state if you hit someone on the caution or after the race you are disqualified. That was pretty obvious after the race between those two.

Apparently you missed the part where Bloomer's crew guy put his kill switch in a spot very easy to hit on accident. That is what happened at PRP to Bloomer. He knew it needed moved and they never did it.

[W2Racing09]

IF, I'm involved in the business of marketing??????

( insert long sigh here^^^^^^^)

I wouldn't know anything about sponsoring drivers, series or events either......please do learn me some stuff on that side of it.

( insert same sigh here^^^^^^)

You are the one who capitalized the IF not me. I'm just pointing out that being involved in the business you know this stuff. You are overlooking your knowledge of this because you have a bias in the opposite direction (against Mark Richards). If you are not being biased then how could you say it would be a good decision?

28 Year old driver, with lots of fans who drivers for arguably the best team in DLM racing in terms of wins.

23 Year old up and coming driver, with TONS of fans and has a few wins including one of the biggest DLM races of the season.

Vs.

50 Year old driver, with a few loyal fans who had several solid top 5 runs this season but no wins (to my knowledge).

If you are going to spend the time and money to sponsor DLM racing to me it is only logical to get the most bang for your buck. If there are other factors at play then I totally understand the reasoning, but short of Francis being the last name of the decision maker here I couldn't imagine it happening.

I'm certainly not looking down on your DLM knowledge (I watched my first DLM race in 2012). You shouldn't act like my opinion does not matter just because of that fact though, our opinions are equally valid regarding DLM racing 2016 as I expect we have both watched and followed the racing about as much as anyone possibly could. My posts are me expressing my opinion, and explaining how I got there. That is how I learned to operate on the internet, if you don't want the explanation then skip it (it's often times in parenthesis which makes that pretty easy).

Thanks,
Jeff.

[Hoosier_Dirt]

Steve Francis switching to Rockets next season??

[Josh Bayko]

Steve Francis switching to Rockets next season??

Word on the street is that a chassis change is happening, and no, it's not Rockets.

[cutman]

You are the one who capitalized the IF not me. I'm just pointing out that being involved in the business you know this stuff. You are overlooking your knowledge of this because you have a bias in the opposite direction (against Mark Richards). If you are not being biased then how could you say it would be a good decision?

28 Year old driver, with lots of fans who drivers for arguably the best team in DLM racing in terms of wins.

23 Year old up and coming driver, with TONS of fans and has a few wins including one of the biggest DLM races of the season.

Vs.

60+ Year old driver, with a few loyal fans who had several solid top 5 runs this season but no wins (to my knowledge).

If you are going to spend the time and money to sponsor DLM racing to me it is only logical to get the most bang for your buck. If there are other factors at play then I totally understand the reasoning, but short of Francis being the last name of the decision maker here I couldn't imagine it happening.

I'm certainly not looking down on your DLM knowledge (I watched my first DLM race in 2012). You shouldn't act like my opinion does not matter just because of that fact though, our opinions are equally valid regarding DLM racing 2016 as I expect we have both watched and followed the racing about as much as anyone possibly could. My posts are me expressing my opinion, and explaining how I got there. That is how I learned to operate on the internet, if you don't want the explanation then skip it (it's often times in parenthesis which makes that pretty easy).

Thanks,
Jeff.

60+ year old driver? Are talking about Francis or Delmas?

[Josh Bayko]

60+ year old driver? Are talking about Francis or Delmas?

He must be talking about Delmas. Steve ain't even 50 yet.