Is the crate killing imca mods

[wadegarrett]

where there is smoke there is fire. SCD why dont you try proving to us that crates are not being sold cheated up for 11to 13k ? then on top of all this there are IMCA tracks grooming the track to insure dry slick conditions to benefit the crates. There are way to many people pushing for crates...follow the money its really that easy.

[UltimateRaceCars]

Their may very well be cheated up crate engines out there but the point SCD is trying to make is that it isnt necessary. From my experiences in IMCA with both the 602 and 604 crate engine you are just fine buying the engine and putting it in your car. Their is no need to get a cheated up engine or buying a few and dynoing them and selling the "weak" ones. All the big races and most of the weekly races are being held on very slick tracks which with the IMCA tires can only hold about 350hp so why waste your money on a cheated engine?

[TS3g]

I'm with Ultimate and SCD on this one....although I see lots of claimer Sport Mods winning in KS (which includes the current national points leader), so I'm not a 100% behind SCD. But anyways...

Soooo, crates are killing IMCA modifieds because they have less horsepower and are easier to drive? But, cheated crates are even worse because they have more horsepower than a normal crate? So what then, normal crates are underpowered but fast, but a cheated crate has enough power to beat a normal crate, but not so much to overpower the tires like an open engine, thus are superduper fast? LOL, just LOL.

Racers I swear are the most egotistical and narrow-minded people ever. Rather than admitting their own shortcomings with regards to driving ability or car setup and spending time and effort to improve them, it's ALWAYS some trick part/engine/money/whatever that so-and-so has that makes them faster than they are. Want to know the real secret to going fast? Tune your car/driver to go faster through the corner and quit worrying about whats under the hood or what pullbar Joe Bob is using or what John Boy had for lunch. It really is that simple.

[ask0329]

I cannot verify this first hand but was told by someone who i feel is a trust worthy person that does their homework that you can buy a 604 from F_____n C_______t that has been "loosened up", ran on the dyno, blue printed and a host of other things and the stock seals put right back on it that puts out just in excess of 600hp. Whether these are ending up in IMCA mods or late models I dont know. He was talking in the context of putting one in his RUSH late model.

As for crate engines up here in the northeast. IMCA mods where a thriving class. We had jeez 9 tracks or so with 16-24 cars at each. Then DIRT went to the 602 engine in the NE DIRT Sportsman class. (not imca style mods). Well we are now at 4 imca tracks, none of which with full fields. The NE Dirt sportsman class is out of control. 30+ cars for a regular night. So much so that tracks have added a novice sportsman class cause they where sending too many cars home. The numbers are out of control and its now the biggest division in the north east.

So in that aspect, yes crates have killed imca mods. Atleast up in the NY/PA area.

[oldtrackchamp4x]

TS3g. Right on the money!!!!! JMO.

[25drtrkr]

Carroll Smith, longtime Chevy engineer, coined a famous saying: Tune your chassis and pick up 100hp.

Those who get this are the ones that win, week in and week out!

[wadegarrett]

When you start answering my questions I might consider answering yours. Until then your just slinging unfounded made up accusations like all the other whiners out there. I race every time out with "the big teams". My motors are straight out of the crate and I win now and then and beat them all here and there.

no better or worse then your dying allegiance to the crate. the question is already answered for me enjoy the crates, got no issues other than the sanctions and tracks bending rules to support he crates and give them an advantage and then not doing tech, and trying to force out the open motors..

[wadegarrett]

I built a brand new open engine last winter. I've ran 50/50 crate open so far. I lwoukd rather race my open. it makes more noise and fries more tires!! But that doesn't make me want to sling mud lies and stupid accusations about the crate. Anyone can buy a crate they are cheap and reliable.

you can come on here and say people are not cheating up crates but you cant prove that either, whatever, go by you another crate for all I care. The point is that the reason the crates are winning are not HP or a better motor its because of the rule changes. keep believing that no one is cheating up the crates.

[ask0329]

Stock Car Driver, The fella that told me about the 600HP Fresen Chevys has no reason to lie to me and would not make this stuff up. Where he got his info, I dont know.

If you read the title of the thread again it clearly states "Is the crate killing IMCA Mods" My reply about the NE sportsman is on par with this. I clearly showed how yes the crate killed the IMCA mods in our neck of the woods. Nowhere in that title does it state "is the crate in imca mods killing imca mods". so yes I accurately replied.

As for the seal bolts, this i have seen with my very own eyes and it is not rocket science. You, or anyone for that matter, can remove the Factory GM seals, do whatever you want to your engine and put them same exact seals right back in and with a little work it looks like they have never been removed. I have followed my buddys 602 from disassemble to a bare block, through full assembly and right back in his car with the very same stock GM seals from the factory. I could show you 10 engines 5 of which have had this done and I'd guarantee you could not pick out all 5. I can personally verify this as again, I have seen this done many times. Ever see the GM seals that are sold on Crate Insider? Tell ya what, our tech up here wasnt good enough to notice my generic $75 cheater seals so theres no way on gods green earth they would be able to pick out the $300 seals from crate insider as being illegal.

[ask0329]

Is that island on McConaughy Lake?

[wadegarrett]

I have a island in Nebraska I would sell you also.... I have no reason to lie so it must be true right?! ALL the seal bolts sold ALL OF THEM are not ss and will rust unlike the oem gm ones they are using now. Also they don't have the gm encryption anyone can id them from 3 feet away. They have caught guys removing the bolts here, they ALWAYS have a prick mark or punch mark from where you have to try and get them moving with a punch. I would think if friesen sold 600hp crates some of the guys I race with who are on Friesen deals would have them and they would then fly by my stock Mexican motor on the straights...

so really what this amounts to is that if you are gonna say anything bad about crates, you better have pictures or sworn statements otherwise according to SCD its all lies and made mud slinging.

[wadegarrett]

gee all the folks on this post/board are liars too and no one is cheating up crate engines like SCD says http://www.outsidegroove.com/forum/i...?topic=12741.0

[jasjenh]

Thanks ask0329 for the info, because that's what is happening in our neck of the woods. Because of the crate, guys are quitting or moving to different classes. That equals lower car count. I didn't want this to be about whos cheating a crate and who isn't.

The fact is I think you can win with a good legal crate but there is no denying the open motors have a disadvantage right now. Now I don't want the open motors to completely dominate either. But we need more parity.

[oldtrackchamp4x]

Make the crate guys put 60 lbs in front of the midplate. Let them keep the 2 in spoiler. As an open motor guy i would be ok with that. I believe the added weight would even things out. Oh, and i don't think crates are killing the class. JMO

[jasjenh]

I clearly understand his post. As I read it people are jumping ship. Same as what is happening at our track. doesn't matter where they go it just matters the numbers are down in our area. I talked with a few guys from some different regions this week and it is not happening all over.

The reason I started this post is to get a feel what is happening in other areas. I think the crate has a place in imca just not for me, as long as they even things out a bit I would consider still racing. I don't think it would take major changes but just some tweaks here and there.

Maybe its just our track, but when you watch the sport mods put on a hell of a show then watch the fans start to leave and watch a single file line of mods. I get it why people are leaving early. Maybe we should all just give in and run the crate to give the fans a good show again.