Shock Building

[Renegade Cust Susp]

Piston

Fox piston is basically a bilstein one. They don't flow either and have to gas them up. Masking a problem if you ask me.

They aren't all that similar, orifice size and location is different and there digressive bleed set up is completely unlike the Bilstein stuff.

But you keep referencing flow of the piston, what exactly are you refering to? Volumetric flow rate? and there is some trade off in that high flow

[Dirt_Buster]

The flow charectoristics are very similar to each other. They both don't flow. They also both aren't consistent on a dyno. Just throw them on there at 3-6" per second and go ahead and see how long it takes for that shock to start Cavitating. Then mask it all by throwing more gas into it.

[FourDeepInTheFluff]

Where are you guys getting your shock dynos at? Does anyone provide a leasing option? I looked at AccuForce Dyno and just dont have that kinda money to throw at one at once. But could come up with the monthly fee to lease/finance one.

[Dirt_Buster]

Unless you're doing a lot of shocks and for a lot of different divisions don't waste your money. There are plenty of shops around who fronted the bill already.

[turtle1hp]

Where are you guys getting your shock dynos at? Does anyone provide a leasing option? I looked at AccuForce Dyno and just dont have that kinda money to throw at one at once. But could come up with the monthly fee to lease/finance one.

I was lucky enough to find a used one. Before that I was looking into the Performance Trends dyno. It is moderately priced and I do believe they do offer financing. Keith Berner owns AccuForce. Did you speak to him and see if there were financing options available? Most businesses will use an outside company for the financing.

[Renegade Cust Susp]

Dyno

Where are you guys getting your shock dynos at? Does anyone provide a leasing option? I looked at AccuForce Dyno and just dont have that kinda money to throw at one at once. But could come up with the monthly fee to lease/finance one.

Personally I am partial to Roehrig Engineering

[zeroracing]

If your going to buy a dyno get a Roehrig or intercomp maybe a maxwell. You want to be able to measure the zero point easily. That said if your not going into the shock building game as a real business then I would say just get with a good shock guy and use them. The tools including dyno and knowledge needed is too much for the average racer to keep up with. Guys that do 100 shocks a year collect so much more knowledge and data than a guy that does 10. I tried it some, realized this and gave. It up.

[FourDeepInTheFluff]

Hey guys, thanks for the replies. Awesome information. So here is the idea, I have been in contact today with Maxwell. I have priced out a 3HP Shock Dyno and Spring Dyno. At first, the use will be for myself and a group of close friends. Probably around 6-8 different drivers with various classes of cars be it Modifieds, Latemodels, Stock cars, and sprint cars. Looking to try different valvings and numbers to see how things work and react. Is it for business purposes? Eh, maybe not immediately, but I am open to it. Its really more for my own knowledge.

I am a college student, so if I could use it to make some part time money and work my own schedule at night then that's a plus. I know that wont come over night and probably not for a few years. I am okay with that. Eventually, (within the next 4-6 years) I plan to turn my shop into a full fledged race shop. Offering fabrication, shock, car building services. But for now, while my own racing is being (and has been) pretty much put to the curb to focus on my education, I am just looking for something to keep me involved on the inside and challenge myself to learn a side of the business I have always bought because it was alot easier.

Thanks again for all the advice!

[Dirt_Buster]

If I have any advice at all in this it would be as follows. Get a job that makes you enough money to afford the good shock guy and work and learn with him. You won't make a lot of money in this game doing shocks at these levels. Trust me

[FourDeepInTheFluff]

Thanks guys! I am taking everything into consideration. As of now, it seems like it is a lot easier to just basically have a shock guy on payroll. Although I am still interested in learning on my own. I just may not be financially set up for that right now.

My questions I currently have is this... Purely going by what I see in pictures and prices it would seem that the Performance Trends dyno is a cheaper option. I am sure there is a reason for this... Would this set up be good enough to "potentially" use to try and get a little small time shock game going if thats the route I choose since it seems to be in a college kids price range?

Also, if I am doing coil over shocks, will I need a spring dyno? And what does the spring dyno do other than spring rates? Basically it just tells me that my spring is still within the rate stamped?

Also, can one point me in the right direction of how to gas fill shocks work, as in what kind of machinery is used to charge/recharge/service/etc.... can all this be done on a regular shock dyno?

Apologize for all the questions, but the info is not really out there...... and that is understandable.

[zeroracing]

I think you are on the right track, learn as much on your own as you can through tuning and working with a shock guy. I have never used a performance trends Dyno, I do like the intercomp and Roehrig. Both of them are very nice, intercomp is cheaper. Maxwell has a nice unit and they are extremely nice and welcoming people. I would recommend a computer controlled one like these style though over the order style spring loaded deals. They work, but do not measure zero point as well/easily and are a bit dated.

On the spring machine, Disclaimer I make one of them. Www.facebook.com/ultraforcespringmachine/
The main ways I use mine are:
1. After scaling my car I measure my center to center distance of each shock then compress them in the machine. Record my numbers. So let's say I have 515.5 lbs on the LR at 18.25". I can then change springs from say a 200 to a stack set up. Readjust until I reach the 515.5 lb at 18.25". Now I don't have rescale the car itself. Much easier for me, I only scale once in a while now but test them weekly.
2. After a race I take off my right side shocks and run them down until I reach my travel indicators, then I record my right side loads. I can correlate this to my lap times and tune to get the car to the "stance" I am after.
3. The third thing I do is set bump stops or stack RF, adjusting for track speed (corner speed and track itself).
4. Along the same lines as 3, I graph my load curves for each set up so I know how the wheel is being loaded. This is important when using spring rubbers since they are not linear, or bumps.
You can also use it to measure springs if they are not rebounding like they used to, or if they are stamped correctly (honestly use it very little for this)

The honest truth is many of the things I do with mine or recommend people to do can be done with math, that is how I did it before I started making the machines. It was more time consuming, did not account for shock gas pressure as well and made spring rubbers a guess. But it is 100% doable to tune your car without one, just makes it quicker and easier.

Gas fill shocks work a couple different ways, easiest is with a Schrader valve you just put them together and charge. A non-Schrader valve takes a different set up, basically you have to charge and clamp it all together. I run only where I can use Schrader (late model) so don't have a set up for refil, it is special tooling or machine. Most guys use their own homemade deal.

The shock Dyno will just tell you your curve and if something is wrong, it won't compress them for rebuilding or anything like that.

Hope this helps, and good luck.

[RCJ]

While a pnematic dyno has short coming, it is a cheap starting piont.You can start a shock manitence progam with it.Changing fluid , making sure adjustable shocks are working correctly,building shock to the factory specs etc..It will get you familar with shim stacks,bleeds ,pistons ,gas pressures.