UMP / HOOSIER Tire Issues. Racers / Promoters Why 20's instead of 40's?

[old fan]

Out of 108 drivers do really think all drivers would've loved it esp the ones that never ran that tire and who knows what the tire rule will be in the future

[blncfn57]

Not all drivers loved it. Eldora appreciated Ruhlmans donation.

The guy that finished 2nd ran the same tires thursday and friday. New ones on saturday. Better than having a trailer full of tires that are all doped just a little different.

[old fan]

An owner told me it takes 3 hours to prep one tire that could get a little time consuming

[Bubstr]

Sure, it's a money grab and the racers, track owners or promoters and the series are making it easy. The racers cheat. The tracks or promoters want that kick back and the series now has a tire cheating problem to cure. Convenient, I would say.

First off, It is easier and more effective to cheat a harder tire into a softer one. That will be the reason everyone gets stuck with the LM20. If they go with the no grooving, it sells tires faster, because when the edge goes away the tire is done. If they where really interested in saving the racer a little money, a rule that allowed re grooving on the same stock pattern. This would give enough edge for another race.

Most of the doping comes when too hard a tire is mandated and you have a edge with a softer one. The switching of casings comes when the mandated tire is too soft to really lean on. The later is easier to catch, because the tire make up is different. The soft tire mandate makes doping useless and the money rolls in thanks to the cheaters and thieves. You can fix anything for a price.

[old fan]

Well the real reason is when they dropped American Racer a lot of drivers stop racing with them and it killed them..6 or 7 of the top cars Went and raced some were else...Ask the 47 Steve Hilliard He was so Mad that they dropped AR tires....

why the need to carry more tires then needed

[old fan]

Drivers Would 20's last on the RF and LR during the summer months at your tracks can someone say summer nationals

[MasterSbilt_Racer]

The guy that finished 2nd ran the same tires thursday and friday. New ones on saturday. Better than having a trailer full of tires that are all doped just a little different.

The rule has little to do with doping. And the guys with the cash can carry all the tires they want. Those who can't sure could benefit from grooving to extend life.

The track was very easy on tires Thursday, so no surprise on using them two days. That won't be the norm. The racing was artificially damaged by hurting guys who drive straight. The laps were painfully slow. It wasn't great.

[Kromulous]

40's all the way around would make the cars painfully slow. I would guess 1 second a lap maybe more, particularly with no siping or grooving.

20's on the RF and LR will last any Summer Nats race, they will last any 100 lapper if you dont abuse them, but thats where the racing comes in.

Crate cars run 40's all around, and the cut the tires up like Swiss cheese literally. Take 6 razor blades about 1/8" apart and cut around, circumstantially and across, all blocks to get them to work.

The distinction from grooving and siping or not is key.

[a25rjr]

Mark Richards said during their testing for the W100, grooved and siped tires were 6 tenths faster than non! That's huge!

[westlingracing]

My perspective. 2 car team very budget oriented. Normally we run 40-50 shows a year. We buy lots of used tires in a season. Actually only bought 4 new ones all season. Probably 40 used ones.
Going to no grooving or siping saves a ton of labor and will extend the life of the tire a ton. I get close to 20 nights on a pair of front 20s by not over cutting them. Lr 20s I get 4-6 nights out of and normally cut them pretty good. Not cutting or siping will help even more. People talk about losing edges. Every race we flip the tire and you usually get a good edge back. Rr40 really needs to be siped or they need a different tread pattern. That block pattern could be changed and I'd be happy.
One thing about all 40s is I could run a whole season on fronts and probably half season on a lr40 but the problem with the 40 is it will just get harder and after 6 or 8 nights still look good but not be an effective tire. Only the guys buying new every couple weeks will be fast, and there will be a ton of good looking used 40s on the market cheap., But too hard to be any good.
Personally I like the 20/40 deal with no siping just change the tread pattern a little.
I did the MLRA wrs 55 tire deal for years. And bought used tires all the time but had to treat them to soften them back down. Still not as good as new but couldn't afford new.
No real reason to treat a 20, if anything let them out to dry and use them when it looks like the track might take rubber.

[MasterSbilt_Racer]

My perspective. 2 car team very budget oriented. Normally we run 40-50 shows a year. We buy lots of used tires in a season. Actually only bought 4 new ones all season. Probably 40 used ones.
Going to no grooving or siping saves a ton of labor and will extend the life of the tire a ton. I get close to 20 nights on a pair of front 20s by not over cutting them. Lr 20s I get 4-6 nights out of and normally cut them pretty good. Not cutting or siping will help even more. People talk about losing edges. Every race we flip the tire and you usually get a good edge back. Rr40 really needs to be siped or they need a different tread pattern. That block pattern could be changed and I'd be happy.
One thing about all 40s is I could run a whole season on fronts and probably half season on a lr40 but the problem with the 40 is it will just get harder and after 6 or 8 nights still look good but not be an effective tire. Only the guys buying new every couple weeks will be fast, and there will be a ton of good looking used 40s on the market cheap., But too hard to be any good.
Personally I like the 20/40 deal with no siping just change the tread pattern a little.
I did the MLRA wrs 55 tire deal for years. And bought used tires all the time but had to treat them to soften them back down. Still not as good as new but couldn't afford new.
No real reason to treat a 20, if anything let them out to dry and use them when it looks like the track might take rubber.

I agree with most of what you said, are in the same boat, but the flipping rarely works for us. That trailing edge is usually really proud and will tear like crazy if you don't at least grind it down some. Then, you have two rounded edges after you run it again. I often hit the blocks on edge with a grooving iron to make the blocks look fresh again, just a little smaller. Works for us.

[old fan]

Mark Richards said during their testing for the W100, grooved and siped tires were 6 tenths faster than non! That's huge!

3 teams told me this past weekend it takes 3 hours to work on one tires x that's by 4 or 5 etc and what do you have

[Krooser]

At Shawano I see guys buying 3 new rock hard WISSOTA tires per night then spend hours grooving and siping... 20's would end most of that.

[TALON75]

Not all drivers loved it. Eldora appreciated Ruhlmans donation.

Who said they didn't like it besides Oneal(DOD interview) , everyone I talked to were good with it.

[MasterSbilt_Racer]

Who said they didn't like it besides Oneal(DOD interview) , everyone I talked to were good with it.

Off the too of my head, Erb sounded less than pleased.

They just changed what type of tire magic is neded and crippled some peoples cars.