Lucas rules

[grt74]

a containment seat should be sufficient,no need for the cup style, we are no where near the speeds,i do agree with all of the other mandates

[fastford]

very good assessment billetbirdcage, i hate it for the ones that lost there lives this year , but this is a dangerous sport that they choose to participate in. It dont matter how many rules you apply, some one is going to get hurt, one thing that i dont understand is if these sanctioning bodies are this worried about drivers safety, why havent they mandated the tracks to have some type of soft wall system ? they want us to spend our money, but as long as these wall cushions have been out now, ive seen nothing...JMO...

[calverton]

take a look at other types of racing and you might get a n idea what grt74 is saying and just not late models even the pro 4s 4ycl are need help

[grt74]

its the cars and not the seats, look at the roll cages, almost all dirt late model roll cages are too close to the driver along with too short(for a roll over, your a human yard dart in most cars)hope they let you run mirrors, its going to be hard to see in this style of seat
i can't find a 39.2 seat but I'm guessing they want the cup seat 39.1

[Barbecueboy]

If Lucas Oil were wanting to help the drivers they would also adopt the Eldora tire rule, but that would be too simple.

I would be surprised if that or something similar didn't end up happening....

[Barbecueboy]

I don't think the minds involved are just dreaming this stuff up to add cost.......even though the flesh brokering insurance companies are the root cause behind most of the mandates ,the officials writing the safety rules have a genuine concern for the drivers and spectators well being.

The sport continues to evolve and the safety aspect of it should be no different......non issue if you wanna race in the big leagues IMO.

[calverton]

If Lucas Oil were wanting to help the drivers they would also adopt the Eldora tire rule, but that would be too simple.

totally agree

[flagone]

billet one HUGE way the use or the lack of use of PPE affects everyone is simple.

One wrongful death or disability suit would have devastating and far reaching effects for all of dirt racing. Insurance companies hold a lot of cards. They have a lot of requirements now. It is expensive now. A suit that gets a huge judgement simply because we don't have the khonas to say "this is what the requirements are and if you won't take them on your own then we will force you to do so". It is sad but all of this stuff has been around for long enough that it should be as commonplace as seat belts. And to your point we require a competitor to wear belts and all other currently required PPE because primarily of the above. I wish I could say what we have done was proactive but we all know we have had enough examples just in the last 12 months for me to say we HAVE to take these steps. We have to protect you from you.

[NormP]

So the series set the high prices for these items and are therefore to blame for the rising costs of late model racing.

Huh...you learn something new every day.

[Drop Shock]

If Lucas Oil were wanting to help the drivers they would also adopt the Eldora tire rule, but that would be too simple.

[calverton]

rules are not set until atleast December 10th

[billetbirdcage]

Kelly and Stan, I feel for you having to explain or defend some of this all by yourself so don't take my comments as going after you in any way.

1. First and foremost in my opinion mandatory safety rules should only be for protecting people that could be affected that weren't the cause of said problem like pit crew members, fans, and etc.

A. Take for example eye protection while driving, not having any could cause the driver to get something in his eye and crash into another competitor or go into the stands. Things like this I don't think anyone can disagree with needs to me mandatory.

B. However you could argue about a fire suit (Hang on and least listen to this and keep an open mind). Not having a fire suit, shouldn't result in anything happening during a race that would cause the driver to put other people at harm by not wearing one, only himself. Now doing so would be extremely stupid on any drivers part, but has no effect (for the most part) on any one else there at the races and the risk is all on said driver.

C. So in my opinion mandatory stuff should be about everyone else's safety, but the things that only effect the one person/driver should be their choice and therefore not mandatory. Obviously you have to balance this with insurance requirements for the tracks, but we all know this can be a dangerous sport.

D. Show me data, that does definitively shows that a full containment seat lessens the change of injury? And if it does show me where it doesn’t increase the chance of concussions? #Note: I do believe they are way way better, but I only staying in a holiday inn so what do I know as I have no data to support it one way or the other. Shouldn’t that decision be left to the person in the car as to what is best for him?

I can see the wheel covers as that will effect people other then the driver, but many of these other things you have to stretch pretty far in circumstance before you are risking others safety. Now a guy could argue the fuel cell to some degree because in a wreck the other cars involved could burn do to someone’s unsafe fuel cell. However I can't recall ever when someone else was burned do to a fire that came from someone fuel cell other then their own.

I think what we need more then mandatory rules is more education, knowing what can happen and being on top of these things will allow people to make the decision for themselves whether or not they feel the risk is worth having or not having some of these devises.

It's still a lack of tech that is the biggest problem; they can't enforce the basic body rules they have now. Do you really think much of this stuff gets checked after the first or second race of the year? I'm more worried about the crappy fuel fitting and plumbing job on some cars then the fuel cell itself. I've seen more fuel spelt from broken off fittings and lines then actual rupturing of the cell itself. I'd start with no aluminum fittings on the fuel system as that is what typically gets ripped off during a crash and spills more fuel then the cells themselves.

Now don’t take this as I’m saying just let us do what we want as far as safety rules go, as we all know we need the encouragement to do the right thing for ourselves. But at some point you have to let people decide for themselves what the proper equipment is as long as it isn’t affecting anyone else but them. If you have the money, it’s a no brainer but I’m so tired of anyone telling me what I have to have to protect myself, don’t treat me like a 10 year old the government does that enough.

I can’t be clear on this enough: I purposely took the devils advocate and unpopular side just to show the other side of things.

[calverton]

Charlie floyd and shane unger need i say more

[Barbecueboy]

I wish doing away with grooving and siping would have been included in the rule changes

I'm not so sure it wasn't tried a time or two......recall it working out pretty well.

[FASTRAKPR]

I'll have to reply here as the page it was asked on y post but the page refused to pull up. Maybe I'm just tired for being up all night watching the election. LOL

Plastic wheel covers. Please keep in mind my post started off w addressing crates. I disagree with metal wheel covers period, but there are people in the industry that know a lot more than I. Mine is only a opinion of one and this was made by a panel of many. I am working with one plastic company now in designing a plastic wheel cover that is vented to suck it to the ground if it comes off. Its a never ending project.

Tires, I agree tires don't need to be grooved and siped. We took that stance when we started in 2004. In FASTRAK we are limited to 2 compounds so per the drivers vote we did allow them to groove and sipe our hard compound so they could go to it quicker to keep from wearing their softer compound out. We are fortunate we have a really tough great softer compound that does a good job in most places even on hard black tracks. The FT200 crate spec.

Lajoie and others make a bolt on kit for $350 to make a seat a full containment seat. Simpson has just released a strap that goes on the left side which we will take a look at too. Just haven't seen it yet.

I know spending money where you may not see the need today is tough, but keep in mind when you need it, well its too late then. Times are still tough right now but I believe its going to get better after last night. Hopefully we will all have a little more cash. I know you are smart enough to know that in the end, this is to benefit you and the ones that depend on you each and everyday. Yes it looks a little tough today, but really all of us should have been doing this all along and no one should ever had to make us do it.

Please note, I am not speaking as a committee member which I am not. I have never been to one of these meetings. However one of our series ULTIMATE is represented on the committee so I have been kept in the loop.. I am speaking for crates although most of it applies to both. We probably won't get this right, right out of the box, but it will be a continuing job as we work to reduce cost of mandated products as well as improve them for you.

Members of ULTIMATE and FASTRAK do get discounts for the fire systems and we are going to announce a discount on Simpson products next week. Its the only way I know to help you do this and make the transition a little easier on you.

IM GOING HOME LOL.